Listen on Spotify:
In March 2025 I journeyed to Nihue Rao in Iquitos Peru for my most significant ‘diet’ with the Plant Medicine of Ayahuasca to date. The retreat was held by Maestro Remi Delaune, and his Shipibo teacher Maestro Ricardo Amaringo. I first experienced Remi’s works at ‘Kumankaya’ the remarkable healing center he and his wife Ashley built in the jungle of México. As a curandero he brings a one of a kind mixture of presence, humor, devotion to the medicine and indescribable Icaros.
His near 20 years as an Orthodox monk in France and transition to a deep study of Shipibo Ayahuasca medicine make him a unique teacher on the experiential, mystical and synergistic integration of Christianity and Plant Medicine. Remi’s work represents a key inspiration for my ongoing project ‘Christianity Beyond Itself’.
We recorded this impromptu interview exploring what Ayahuasca is and and Remi’s understanding of the relationship between Ayahuasca, Christianity and the Shipibo tradition. He shares the key practices of the Curandero, the idea of a ‘natural pentecost’ and the importance of a strong spiritual practice when approaching ayahuasca and why he is not an emissary of the plant.
*A note on audio fidelity*
This podcast was recorded in the open air at Nihue Rao in Iquitos Peru. There are lots of wonderful bird sounds. However, there was also some construction on site which shows up for a couple of minutes. These noisy moments have been included to preserve clarity and meaning in the dialogue.
“If you go into the core of it then you’re going to understand the Christianism has just begun, because nobody is capable of matching the level of spirituality of love, of service, of sacrifice that is required to be a true disciple of christ. And the Shipibos they don’t teach anything else than that; humility, love and service, being caring for people—that’s what they teach.
So for myself I do believe that christianity is teaching what true human beings should be. St Irene de de Lyon, a father of the church from the 2nd century, was saying “the glory of god is a living man” you understand? Living to the fullest his life, in the presence of God. His freedom to the fullest, in the presence of God.”
—Maestro Remi Delaune
Chapters:
3:30 Why do we drink Ayahuasca
08:00 What is the Icaro?
15:29 The relationship between Shipibo Ayahuasca tradition and Christianity
16:50-19:32 construction sound
19:52 Remi’s background in Greek Orthodox and mystical experience
20:42 Deepening Christianity through Ayahuasca
24:19 A ‘natural pentecost’ rather than a psychedelic renaissance
25:43 Ayahuasca is not for everyone
27:30 It’s important to have a spiritual practice when we engage with ayahuasca
28:00 The Five points that make a good Curandero
