Press TV: And to discuss that topic and more, we are now joined by Booker Ngesa, who is a member of Kenya-Palestine Solidarity Movement, joining us from Nairobi, and also Kevin Barrett, editor of Veteran Today, who is joining us from Saidia, Morocco. Gentlemen, thank you so much and welcome to the program. I’m going to start with Mr. Kevin. This is not the first time that we have seen the Israelis continue to attack this particular flotilla. But in your opinion, with the intervention of the Europeans, do you think we might be heading towards something entirely different?
Kevin Barrett: Well, it’s a good sign. It’s going to discourage further drone strikes as long as the flotilla remains in international waters. But as we heard from the leaders of Italy and Spain, it doesn’t sound like there’s any intention to protect the flotilla all the way to the beach of Gaza, much less to land in Gaza and protect the people of Gaza from the genocide that’s being perpetrated against them, which is what all nations in that region, and indeed all nations, period, should be doing.
Indonesia has announced its willingness to send tens of thousands of its troops to protect the civilians of Gaza, and it’s imperative that the world find a way to organize this kind of humanitarian intervention under the responsibility to protect principles or R2P that are accepted by the United States and the European Union. This is a good baby step towards that, but the genocide continues, and we really need to be clear about the fact that the international community is responsible for this. So-called Israel has fewer than 15 million people. How can a nation that size completely dominate the world to the point that they are allowed to get away with committing a genocide that no other nation would ever be allowed to get away with? The Israeli agents who dominate European countries, and especially dominate my own country, the United States, need to be arrested. They need to be put in prison. And the United States and the European countries need to pursue their own interests (not Zionist ones). And first of all, they need to stop this genocide.
Press TV: Okay, we’re going to go to Mr. Ngesa in Kenya. You heard what our guest just said about the fact that, nothing much has been done. Building on what he said, that the Europeans who have announced that they are sending their ships are not going to protect the ships till they get to the shore of Gaza. And I want to quote what the the defense minister said. He said “tomorrow we will dispatch vessels in case of necessity of assistance or a rescue mission.” So they are just going there to rescue in case the Israelis attack the boat. Do you think the Europeans are doing enough to protect this civilian vessel trying to do governments should have been doing?
I think we are having some sound issues with our guest in Nairobi, so we’ll go back to Mr. Kevin Barrett. Mr. Barrett, I do want to look at the history of the flotillas that have tried to break the siege on Gaza. We do know that this is not the first time. And obviously, the most tragic of those actually cost many people their lives, if you remember very well. Do you think something like that will happen? Because this particular flotilla consists of hundreds of people and many, many, many ships, and more also saying they are going to join. If they do get to that red zone where the Israelis have the history of stopping this boat, do you think we might be seeing something like that again? A more deadly attack by the Israelis?
Kevin Barrett: Well, theoretically, they shouldn’t be able to do that. That is, theoretically, once we get dozens or perhaps even hundreds of boats sailing to Gaza, that is far too many for the Israelis to stop. But I thought back in the fall of 2023 that the Israelis might manage to kill more than they had killed in their previous slaughters in Gaza. They would kill a few thousand people in Gaza, but certainly they couldn’t go very far beyond that before the international community would stop them. And I was wrong. They’ve gone and killed perhaps hundreds of thousands. And so if we assume that, oh, they’ll kill a dozen people aboard one ship like they did with the Mavi Marmara, but they certainly aren’t going to sink multiple ships and kill hundreds of people…Well, they probably won’t, but the thing about Israel is that this is a completely insane fake nation that is going down. It’s reached the end of its history, and they’re going down in a huge bloody genocide, and they are completely insane. They’re millenarian messianic fanatics dedicated to their crazed extremist religious ideology, and there’s really no limit to what they might do. So I hope that we’re right in thinking that even they are not capable of slaughtering huge number of people on this flotilla. But I’ve learned from hard experience never to underestimate the murderous insanity of the genocidal Zionists.
Press TV: Okay, let’s see if our guest in Nairobi is back with us and can hear us clearly… go ahead and answer the question.
Booker Ngesa: The initiative that has been taken by the European governments must be understood in the context that this is not a voluntary action that the European government are indeed in solidarity with the Palestinian people. It must be understood only in the context of the successes of pressure groups and solidarity that continues to support the Palestinian struggles. In this sense, it actually proves that we can actually pressurize our governments to act against their own will in terms of stopping the genocide in Gaza. It also a clear proof that this flotilla movement has actually been able to get legitimacy in terms of advancing its mission, and that the Palestinian people are not alone…
Let me just go to our guest in Saidia and just wrap it up, Mr. Kevin Barrett. Just in less than a minute, if you can, what should we do now to protect this ship? Like you mentioned, no one knows the capability of the Israelis and since there is no accountability, there is every likelihood that they will attack this ship once they’re out of international waters. What can the press and average people do in order to protect this flotilla?
Kevin Barrett: We should be drawing as much attention as possible to this flotilla because these are really noble people who are putting their lives on the line to try to stop this genocide. Western publics, which have become inured to the mass slaughter of people who look different from them and speak different languages, are less likely to be inured to the slaughter of people who look like them and who express their best idealistic impulses. So this is a very strong way of trying to move Western public opinion, which hopefully will ultimately move far enough to end the genocide.
Okay, let’s hope we’re right this time and we’re not wrong like we have been when it comes to…discussing the Israelis. Mr. Ngesa, I hear you’re back. If you can, within two minutes or less, can you give us your thoughts, please?
I would like to put it through that the flotilla movement has gained legitimacy and continues to win support of many peace loving citizens and to attract more solidarity with the struggle, the genuine struggle of the Palestinian people. And for the first time, at least it has been confirmed in practice that the Zionist regime, Israel, continues to suffer isolation. And all we can do is to continue to advance permanent solidarity with the people of Palestine. For the safety of the people that are involved in the flotilla movement, we need to continue to push the European government so that they’re not just going there to say that we will accept any attack by the Zionists on the flotilla movement and then have a rescue mission. Since last time we have seen attacks in the international waters, particularly off of Greece coast, But if the Zionist regime attempts to attack the flotilla movement, then European governments, if they’re serious, should be able to confront the Israeli army and tell them that it is unacceptable, that you cannot continue to break international laws, and once you break the international laws, try to escape from them without facing punishment.
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