Quick Note:
Due to technical difficulties during the interview, today’s episode will be available as audio only. You can still listen to this episode as a podcast right here on Substack, on Apple Podcasts, or on Spotify. Thanks for tuning in and enjoy the interview!
Show Notes:
Liz Robinson is the Executive Director of the Philadelphia Solar Energy Association and a 40-year veteran of Pennsylvania’s clean energy movement.
She spent more than three decades leading the Energy Coordinating Agency before taking the helm at PSEA, where she’s focused on energy education, policy advocacy, and accelerating the state’s transition to affordable, abundant, and clean power.
Liz is a nationally recognized leader in energy efficiency and solar, with a deep history in workforce development, community outreach, and building science.
Here’s her LinkedIn.
Expect to learn:
* How Pennsylvania’s fossil fuel legacy is holding solar energy back.
* Why energy efficiency and solar are “two sides of the same coin.”
* How PJM’s backlog of solar projects is driving unnecessary electricity rate hikes.
You can listen to this episode here, or on:
* YouTube
* Spotify
Transcript:
Aaron Nichols:Hello everyone, and welcome back to This Week in Solar. I'm Aaron Nichols, the Research and Policy Specialist here at Exact Solar in Newtown, Pennsylvania.
Today we’re talking to someone who has been working in Philadelphia and Pennsylvania energy for a long time. As part of our goal to fight some of the short-term panic around the Inflation Reduction Act and assure people that solar has been around for a while and will continue to be around, we decided to bring her on. So everyone, please welcome Liz Robinson to the show.
Liz Robinson:Thanks, Aaron.
Aaron Nichols:So Liz, you are the Executive Director of the Philadelphia Solar Energy Association, right?
Liz Robinson:Yes.
Aaron Nichols:If you wouldn’t mind, could you talk to us a little bit about the organization, your role, and what a day in your life looks like?
Liz Robinson:Sure. The Philadelphia Solar Energy Association has been around for about 40 years, initially unincorporated and then incorporated. It’s a very small local nonprofit started by architects and energy nerds at Penn, and its focus has always been education.
It principally focuses on school-age education programs. I was asked to join when I resigned from the Energy Coordinating Agency some years ago. I’ve always been really interested in education and really believe Americans as a nation are undereducated — our energy literacy level is pretty low.
We are in the midst of a transition to clean energy, and it’s critically important that people have better access to the fundamentals of energy, particularly solar. My focus now is really on improving the quality of tools available for children and youth to learn about solar.
Aaron Nichols:As someone who’s had a 40-year career in energy — which is so crazy for me to think about, since I’m barely two years in — you have more experience than anyone we’ve interviewed so far. I’m interested in what changes you’ve seen over that time, and why, after all this time, you still love solar so much.
Liz Robinson:I’m not inherently a technical person; my background is more social science. I spent almost 35 years in energy efficiency and only recently came into solar.
My orientation to energy is that it’s key to all life on Earth. It’s critical that energy be abundant, accessible, affordable, and clean. Energy efficiency remains the cheapest form of energy, but solar is a close second — and has quickly caught up in recent years.
I’ve always regarded them as two sides of the same coin. They go together, particularly in buildings. You don’t want to put a fancy solar system on a very inefficient building — as they say, you don’t put lipstick on a pig. Reducing load first allows solar to carry it efficiently.
Under the Biden administration, there’s been a strong emphasis on using a wide range of tools to achieve abundant, affordable, clean energy. Unfortunately, we’ve taken a turn for the worse lately, but to be frank, this is inevitable. Humanity needs clean, abundant, affordable energy.
I’ve been heartened by the extraordinary technical developments in recent years. My husband and I are decarbonizing our lives — moving from fossil fuels to all-electric, powered by solar. The new highly efficient electric appliances — induction stoves, heat pump water heaters, heat pumps — are extraordinarily efficient, quiet, clean, and durable. I’m very excited about the transition, and I believe it’s inevitable, despite short-term setbacks.
Aaron Nichols:“Inevitable” is the word I keep hearing from veterans in this industry. The way I’ve been describing it is: we’re in a trilogy, and this is The Empire Strikes Back.
Liz Robinson:Oh, I like that.
Aaron Nichols:Darth Vader’s our father, we’ve lost a hand, and now we have to gather strength and move forward. Not to get too lost in the metaphor, but I’m really curious — what was energy efficiency like 40 years ago, and what’s the growth curve looked like in your career?
Liz Robinson:Forty years ago, it was very rudimentary. Technical advances were slow at first, but they began to speed up during the Obama administration. DOE Secretary Steven Chu — a Nobel Prize-winning physicist — made an extraordinary difference. He laid the groundwork for rapid development in both energy efficiency and solar, putting the U.S. on a strong scientific footing.
The Obama administration raised efficiency standards significantly. The energy efficiency field shifted from basic auditing to “building science” — understanding energy, humidity, moisture, materials, pollutants, and health in buildings. This led to leapfrogging technology improvements.
The pace of change is now accelerating exponentially — because we’re transforming the largest, most powerful industry in history: fossil fuels.
Aaron Nichols:As someone who’s pretty chronically online, I’ve noticed the dizzying amount of misinformation — things like “windmills cause cancer” or “solar panels kill plants.” Has this always been the playbook?
Liz Robinson:No. The difference is that solar is now the cheapest, cleanest, fastest form of energy generation worldwide, which makes it very threatening to fossil fuels. Its availability has accelerated coal plant closures. That’s a direct threat to an industry that’s had friends, money, and lobbying power for 200 years.
I think we’re in the “death throes” phase of fossil fuels. The industry has largely given up on Europe — which is now firmly on a clean energy path — and is focusing on preventing the U.S. from moving forward. This is the last desperate phase.
Aaron Nichols:That reminds me of the quote: “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”
Liz Robinson:Exactly.
Aaron Nichols:You and I have both chosen not only a hard industry, but a hard state to fight in. Can you talk about the challenges of implementing renewables in Pennsylvania?
Liz Robinson:Pennsylvania is where U.S. fossil fuel industries got their start — coal, oil, gas — and much of the state’s wealth and political power is tied to them. More recently, fracking brought gas back in a big way, coinciding with the Tea Party’s rise.
It wasn’t always this way. When I started, the most dedicated conservationists in Pennsylvania were Republicans — especially in Chester County. They valued resource stewardship. That’s been turned on its head.
Aaron Nichols:That’s hopeful in a way, because solar is broadly popular — even with conservatives — if framed right.
Liz Robinson:It’s the most popular form of energy. It represents freedom, independence, and savings.
Aaron Nichols:In the short term, though, with the loss of IRA incentives, what’s the way forward for solar companies?
Liz Robinson:I don’t think this is permanent. But companies will need to tighten belts, diversify, and perhaps move into larger-scale projects. Residential will be hit hardest, followed by community solar. Utility-scale may hold on longer.
We’ll lose jobs and some companies in Pennsylvania. The industry’s multiple scales — residential, community, utility — offer some resilience if companies can pivot.
Aaron Nichols:And for home and business owners?
Liz Robinson:I think education is key. Pennsylvania is facing astronomical electricity price increases due to poor utility-scale planning and mismanagement by PJM, our grid operator. PJM has hundreds of projects — 87% of them solar — stuck in its queue. If admitted, they’d lower prices. Instead, prices are rising.
For consumers, the best defenses are energy efficiency and solar. Buying your energy in bulk — locking in decades of production — is a smart move, especially with rates climbing.
Aaron Nichols:These are big problems, but they’re worth throwing a lifetime at. As someone who’s been in the fight for 40 years, what advice do you have for the next generation?
Liz Robinson:Resilience, resourcefulness, flexibility, and the ability to anticipate what’s coming. Hold yourself to high integrity — trust is the industry’s most important asset.
Aaron Nichols:To close, I’ve been asking everyone a moonshot question: what do you think clean energy will look like in 80 years?
Liz Robinson:It’s hard to picture that far ahead, but I believe we’ll have clean, abundant, affordable energy for all. Solar’s abundance can transform economies, lower the cost of essentials, and democratize access to energy. Once people experience that, they won’t give it up.
Aaron Nichols:Liz Robinson, if people have questions or want to reach out, how can they find you?
Liz Robinson:Email is best, or LinkedIn.
Aaron Nichols:Thank you so much for coming on.
