Tony interviews chess enthusiast Ben on why a game that isn't designed to give frequent "joy feedback" is, in fact, the most rewarding. Because "we're all part-time experts at 30 different things" and "live in a world that doesn't require you to have that kind of focus," chess is also an inherently therapeutic act today. Tony also quizzes Ben on what's required to be great at chess, how much a novice can actually learn, why chess flourished during the pandemic, ways to remedy the game's historical gender imbalance, and his reflections on "The Queen's Gambit."
