PR and sales have more in common than most people want to admit. In this episode, Darryl Sparey, co-founder and Managing Director of Hard Numbers, explains why a “sales backbone” makes you better at PR, why the industry keeps fighting the label, and how Hard Numbers built a reputation around measurable outcomes, including writing KPIs into contracts.
We also talk about the shift towards GEO and LLM-driven discovery, why PR should be owning the citations conversation, and the real leadership lessons that come from losing pitches, handling pressure, and learning the hard way about client concentration. If you work in comms, agency leadership, or in-house marketing and you want practical thinking you can apply straight away, this one is for you.
Connect with Darryl Sparey Hard Numbers: https://www.linkedin.com/in/darryl-sparey/
Darryl on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/darryl-sparey/
Connect with Be Broadcast Website: https://www.linkedin.com/company/be-broadcast/
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joshwheelerbroadcast/
00:00 Intro: Darryl Sparey + Hard Numbers
01:18 Sales “backbone” and why it matters in PR
05:26 Why PR people resist being linked to sales
08:39 From Media Report to Precise: learning sales properly
12:25 Moving into SEO/PPC and becoming “numerate” (by effort)
13:30 Words first: reading, social mobility and writing his way out
15:20 Excel, Salesforce and the practical power of numbers
20:01 Hard Numbers’ KPI stance: writing KPIs into contracts
24:52 GEO, LLMs and why PR should own the citations conversation
33:27 The spark behind founding Hard Numbers
38:26 Parenting, motivation and creating safe opportunities to fail
45:12 Biggest business screw-up: client concentration and the lesson
49:17 The thread through it all: persuasion, listening, and relevance
51:10 School years: humour, bullying, debating society
53:16 “Accidentally brilliant”: luck, judgement, and brilliant people
56:30 Wrap up
#PublicRelations #PR #Marketing #AgencyLife #Leadership #BusinessDevelopment #Sales #Measurement #KPIs #EarnedMedia #DigitalPR #Communications #AI #GEO #Reputation #B2BMarketing #FounderStories #Entrepreneurship #UKBusiness #BeBroadcast
