Description

Today we’re talking about state school property projects. All schools have to plan for maintenance and upgrades, as well as planning for new capital projects – like new or improved buildings. But who leads which projects, how are they planned for and funded, and what’s it like to be involved in or to lead a property project?

My guests are:

• De Thomson, Ministry of Education Infrastructure manager Otago/Southland
• Hugh Gully, (now retired) tumuaki of Collingwood area school
• Linda Tame, former tumuaki of Golden Bay high school.

This podcast was produced for the Ministry of Education as part of Te Ara Tīmatanga mō ngā Tumuaki - The Beginning Pathway for Principals.

You can learn more about this topic by accessing Te Ara Tīmatanga mō ngā Tumuaki - The Beginning Pathway for Principals e-learning modules on the Education LMS: https://training.education.govt.nz

Show notes

Episode themes:

• Who leads most major school property projects.
• How the Ministry works with schools on major projects, including in the design phase.
• What to think about when involved in planning major property projects.
• The importance of the tumuaki or someone senior who knows about teaching and learning to be very involved in building projects, because the smallest decisions can sometimes make the biggest difference.
• The importance of the tumuaki understanding the scope of the project, and being able to push back when people ask for changes or for things that are out of scope. Contract variations are very costly.
• Initial planning conversations are key to agreeing on scope, setting expectations and making sure everyone is on the same page.
• Sometimes unplanned things crop up, and there’s no way to avoid variations. Work your way through those with your project person.
• Health and safety on site is everyone’s responsibility, and everyone needs to recognise and understand the part they have to play. Keeping a constant watch on everything on site and vehicles etc coming and going is a massive responsibility and is very time consuming, but essential.
• Someone needs to be the point person for the foreperson to contact with any health and safety issues. Ensure everyone knows who this person is.
• If asbestos is found there are clear guidelines, and the Minstry has in-house experts on this. Communicating with staff and community about asbestos being present is key so they don’t overreact.
• During 5YA projects a rule of thumb is that if you were to pick up your building and shake it, and something falls out, it's your furniture and equipment funding that's going to pay for those things. If it's fixed to the building and it's part of the structure of the building, then that’s paid through capital funding.

Additional information

Ministry of Education property portal https://property.education.govt.nz 

Questions

1:39 [De] Who leads most major school property projects and why?

2:59 [De] In terms of the delineation between the kinds of property projects managed by the Ministry and those that are led by schools, where does that line sit?

3:41 [De] How does the Ministry work with a school on those major projects?

4:34 [De] Tell me about the Ministry's responsibilities when it comes to property projects and design.

5:25 [Hugh] When it comes to thinking about what you might need in that planning of a property project, how do you go about anticipating the needs of your kura?

6:17 [Hugh/Linda] And what kinds of property projects have you been involved in?

9:54 [Hugh/Linda] Have you ever seen an initial design for something in the kura and gone back and said, actually, this isn't going to work as a learning environment. Have you ever had to intervene or make suggestions in that way?

15:59 [De] There are obviously big health and safety responsibilities that are shared by a whole lot of parties, everyone on site. Can you tell me about the responsibilities for health and safety around any property projects in a school, just in general terms.

17:49 [Linda/Hugh]

What’s been your experience?

20:04 [De] What about handling hazards and things like asbestos?

22:23 [Hugh/Linda] What lessons have you learned through your involvement with school property projects?

24:31 [De] Is there an easy way for a tumuaki to see a breakdown of what the school is paying for and what the Ministry is paying for?

27:08 [All] If you were to be giving some advice to a new tumuaki coming in to a school where perhaps they're in the middle of a property project, or they are due to start one, what would your advice to them be about getting their head around what's happening or is going to happen?

30:09 [All] Is there anything you wanted to add that we haven't covered?