Description

Change is rarely just a rational process — it’s an emotional journey.

In this episode of Sticky From The Inside, I’m joined by John Fisher, business psychologist, constructivist thinker, and creator of the Fisher Change Curve. His model goes beyond the Kubler-Ross grief curve to capture the messy, shifting emotions people actually experience during change, from anxiety and fear, to guilt, confusion, and eventual acceptance.

We explore why organisations so often mishandle change, the crucial difference between self-initiated and imposed change, and the role of emotional triggers like SCARF. John also shares practical ways leaders can support their teams and themselves through uncertainty, plus his three Sticky Notes of advice for navigating change with confidence and compassion.

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• Change is emotional, not just rational. People experience fear, guilt, and confusion — not just a neat process plan.
• Kubler-Ross isn’t enough. Grief stages don’t capture the nuance of organisational or self-initiated change.
• Small wins create momentum. Celebrating quick wins helps rebuild confidence and reduces resistance.
• Leaders must engage with honesty. Open conversations, empathy, and clarity move teams from compliance to commitment.

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The key moments in this episode are:

0:01:10 – Why change is never just a process problem
0:05:57 – Meet John Fisher: from radar systems to psychology
0:08:22 – Why the emotional side of change matters
0:11:35 – Constructivism and interpretation in change
0:14:22 – Do we treat change differently at work than in life?
0:17:05 – Self-initiated vs imposed change: why control matters
0:21:09 – Why Kubler-Ross isn’t enough for organisational change
0:24:03 – Introducing the Fisher Change Curve
0:27:58 – Stages of the curve: from anxiety to acceptance
0:34:53 – Quick wins, small steps, and sustainable change
0:36:39 – SCARF triggers and why leaders misjudge readiness
0:41:36 – Practical advice: honesty, engagement, and WIIFM
0:45:28 – John’s three Sticky Notes of advice

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Useful Links
Follow John Fisher on LinkedIn here
Find the C2D website here
 
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Full Episode Transcript

Get the full transcript of the episode here