What if bravery isn’t just about the big leaps, but also the small, daily choices? In this episode, Jackie and Denise reflect on the winding road that led Jackie from a dark season into preparing for grad school—and all the emotional, logistical, and spiritual layers in between.
00:00:00 – Tech victory + grounding breathwork
00:02:00 – Denise reflects on Jackie’s evolution: from survival mode to moving forward
00:04:42 – Jackie shares the reality of dark thoughts, resilience, and seeking help
00:07:53 – First-generation grad student challenges + moving logistics
00:09:28 – Prescriptions, health insurance, and the hidden weight of adulting
00:12:01 – Disneyland as escapism + knowing who the “right” helpers are
00:14:32 – Bravery and exposure therapy: applying to grad school despite fear
00:16:58 – Returning to student mode after nine years + curiosity over perfection
00:18:00 – Fourth of July at the Hollywood Bowl: patriotism, protest, and perspective
00:23:20 – Conspiracies, corruption, and parsing reality in anxious times
00:25:31 – Community care: money, bodies, and where we put our energy
00:27:10 – Denise’s hope for a Phoenix-like future, even amidst broken systems
00:28:02 – Closing thoughts: hope, gratitude, and Sunday meeting invites
In this intimate episode, Denise and Jackie trace Jackie’s journey from a period of deep struggle to a season of packing boxes and preparing for grad school. Jackie opens up about the mental health challenges that shaped her path, the bravery it took to apply to programs despite fear of rejection, and the overwhelming logistics of moving to a new city with her dog, car, and adult responsibilities in tow.
Denise reflects on what it means to witness her daughter’s growth, offering encouragement to focus on learning and curiosity over perfectionism as Jackie prepares to re-enter academia after nearly a decade away. Together, they hold a layered conversation that weaves in Fourth of July reflections on patriotism, the reality of conspiracy culture, and the ongoing tension between wanting to help the world and needing to put your own oxygen mask on first.
They close with reminders about their Sunday “12 Steps for Everyone” community meetings, and the importance of hope—even when systems are broken.
