Erin Patchell: G'day friends and welcome back to another episode of Weirdos in the Workplace, where we discuss how authenticity, transparency, passion, and purpose can lead to more visionary organizations. I'm your host, Erin Pachell, and today I have a very special guest with us. Everyone meet Asmaa Moussa.
Asmaa Moussa: Hi, thank you.
Erin Patchell: Welcome to the show Asmaa thank you.
Asmaa Moussa: So much for having me.
Erin Patchell: Awesome. And what are we talking about today?
Asmaa Moussa: Community, I think.
Erin Patchell: Yeah, I think so. Community building. I think that's something that we both care a lot about.
Asmaa Moussa: Yeah, very much.
Erin Patchell: Very much. Awesome. Stay tuned.
[Intro music]
Erin Patchell: All right, everyone, let's get started. Asmaa is a new permanent resident to Canada, and I know she's already starting to make waves in the National Capital Region where we live. She's a Meta certified community manager and the founder of Moussa Media. Now in its fifth year, Asmaa is also a founding member of the ClickFunnels Community Management Team and helps thousands of clients in her company's groups to improve their businesses, careers and lives. And she's also award winning Community Specialist from 2021.
Erin Patchell: Welcome to the show, Asmaa.
Asmaa Moussa: Thank you so much. I'm super excited to talk everything community with you.
Erin Patchell: Fantastic. I'm so curious, what does community mean to you?
Asmaa Moussa: Well, I'm super passionate about community, and I really like that you are as well. So that gives us lots of things to talk about. I started my community career in 2018, but I've been passionate about that, well, before that, it started maybe even when I got graduated. The whole idea of how community and how networks can change people's lives and can create very important impacts in their professional and personal careers hit me immediately after my exams, my school exams. So that was a very nice story. I would like to share it with you. I remember that I was very active in school, by the way.
Asmaa Moussa: I was active in all the students unions, attended events, organized events and everything. So I remember that I was in one of those events, and the instructor was very interesting, so he was discussing how the digital world is changing. That was 2008. Okay? So it was before everything that we're experiencing now. So everything he was sharing was revolutionary for me. It was amazing. So I listened, I was very attentive. And then I remember towards the end of this lecture, he shared his number.
Asmaa Moussa: And I remember that there were very few people who picked out the pen and actually took the number, but I was one of them because okay, so I was weirdo when I was even younger. So I remember that after my exams, I was just trying to think, what would I do with my future, how life would go on and everything. And I remember him, he just popped in my mind. So I decided to pick up the phone and call him and that is so hard for an introvert like me. But something inside told me that this is an area that you want to explore. So I called and I asked him about the project he was talking about. And he told me that, unfortunately, this is not available yet in Alexandria.
Asmaa Moussa: Okay. Alexandria is where I lived, in a small city. It is Mediterranean in Egypt, so we did not have lots of opportunities there. So we had a conversation and I was ready to hang up. And then he told me, do you speak English? And I said, my English is nice. So he told me, why don't you come for an interview? And it turned out that this interview was for training college students on the same project that I wanted to work in. Okay. So I wanted to work as an employee, but things turned to be I was teaching people how to enter that field.
Asmaa Moussa: So the interview went really good. And by the way, that man did not help me at all when it came to the interview or entering the project because he never knew me. Okay. It's just the idea of having connection with someone else. So the interview went well and I got hired for a very good salary. I remember that it was even around what my own parents were making back then. Yeah, it was amazing. And it was training and I was going to deal with people at college and I was not even graduated yet.
Asmaa Moussa: I just finished my exams. I remember that I was the youngest person in that project and I was the first one of my whole college who started working in a good place. It was a governmental project. It was amazing. And then something just hit my mind that networks are great thing to have. These are very important asset that anyone can have. And having the courage to make that contact and to ask and to try to find explore different opportunities, that was amazing. So I think that it started with me back then, and then many other series of events supported that belief.
Asmaa Moussa: So you can tell that I am passionate, right?
Erin Patchell: You absolutely can tell. Yes, you 100%. That story so clearly demonstrates how community is not a passive process. It's an active process, an extremely active process that it takes energy to cultivate a community.
Asmaa Moussa: Absolutely, yes. This is 100% something that I figured out. I'm so grateful that I learned it when I was so young because it positively impacted my whole life, my whole career, my whole mindset, because I approach things way differently than most people do because of these experiences that I got.
Erin Patchell: So we all know that. I think that building your network can help you reach a goal or become more successful in whatever way you define success. I think, in a lot of different ways that people define success. What other benefits does a community bring, do you think?
Asmaa Moussa: Support above all that you know that there are other people out there who have similar interests, who share similar ideas who have the same hopes. And we are humans, we are social creatures, right? So we want to feel that we belong no matter what we think, no matter what are our interests. And especially for people sometimes like us, it's so hard to find those connections with everyone around you when you are an entrepreneur. So that makes you a little bit different kind of person. Okay? So you might not find the same interest like any other housewife or regular employee. Okay. So it's really nice to know that I have another person, that there is an Erin that I can contact her and ask her that. I had this idea when I was sleeping and I couldn't sleep and I have to execute it right now.
Asmaa Moussa: So not everyone can understand that. And having access to community is one way to make sure that you do not feel excluded, that you do not feel like you're an inferior person. So this is an amazing part of the community that I'm also very interested in creating and developing and making sure that it is there whenever I'm building a new community.
Erin Patchell: What is the differences? Or maybe I don't know what the differences are, if there are any differences, but what would you say between building a community in real life face to face versus building a virtual community? What would you say are the differences or the similarities?
Asmaa Moussa: I think that building a community in virtual life, it is easier in a way, but still it's harder. But if we try to think of how easy it is, it's as easy as opening a search bar and looking for entrepreneurs in Ottawa. Okay, so you can easily search and try to find yeah, it would take you some time to explore different places and make sure that their values are the same and everything and make those connections. But other than in real life, in physical life, it's hard to approach every person that you meet in the street and say, are you an entrepreneur? Are you an entrepreneur? It's not going to work that way. Okay, so it's a little bit easy. The digital space has created this whole world where we can connect with people who have the same interests. And it doesn't have to be only in Ottawa, it can be anywhere else. So I was in Egypt and I had a community of people in the US.
Asmaa Moussa: In Canada, in Germany, in South Africa and everywhere. So that is the beauty of having the online and the digital space. And while I grow older, I really appreciate the physical and the real life connections, but I still value the opportunities that this digital space had opened for us, because without that, I would have never been having this conversation. With you right now or never had the opportunity to work with ClickFunnels, for example, or gain all the experiences from the people that I learned from. So that's why I'm a little bit passionate about the digital space, but I can definitely see the advantages and the beauty of having a real connection with someone and shaking their hands and having a meal with them. It's also amazing.
Erin Patchell:
What are the characteristics, do you think? I mean, as a community builder yourself, like, you're a community builder. I think that you probably network also with other community builders. What are the characteristics that make up a person who's great at community building?
Asmaa Moussa:
You have to start by loving people, right? Yeah. It's important to know that everyone can provide something, that everyone has something to share and to see the good in every person that belongs to that community that you're trying to build. It's very important that you create a very safe space for everyone to share whatever they want to say, as long as it's not abusive or hatred or whatever. But you have to create this area where people are free to share their hopes, their dreams, their fears, their struggles, no matter how small others might think there is. So, for example, we're working with software, and that means we're dealing with people from all different kinds of backgrounds and experiences. So we're dealing with someone who might be who might have just opened a computer today. They have never had to deal with a computer before, other than for work or something. So I can literally coach someone on how to open a new browser and maybe search for a specific criteria on Google.
Asmaa Moussa:
And in the same time, I'm dealing with other people who are very technically advanced and help them troubleshoot very difficult issues. Okay, so it's important to create communities that are open for both of them, that are acceptable for both of them without judgment. So I want to create a community where the person who just tried or who's just starting his online career or starting his software building journey, I want him to not feel intimidated. And in the same time, I do not want the other person who has very high technical skills to feel like he has the right to mock the other person or underestimate what they bring to the table. Okay, so having this inclusive community is extremely important.
Erin Patchell:
Yeah, I feel like there's a lot of entrepreneurs that build communities. I'm trying to figure out how to word this best, but I feel like community or or creating a community can sometimes be like an ego driven thing rather than becoming part of a community. Do you know what I'm saying? It's like everyone wants their own community, but if we all have our own community, then there's no community, you know what I mean? Because we can only be a part of so many communities. And so I'm curious to know, do you think for entrepreneurs, it's better to start your own community or if it's better to join another community or somewhere in between?
Asmaa Moussa:
I would definitely recommend that people start by joining other communities because it's easier. First of all, it's easier to go to a well established community and see how people are reacting and look at the problems that they are having. Engage in conversations, build relationships with other people. So this is how you create the true and deep understanding of the people that you want to gather around you. Okay. And then within the time after you develop clear understanding of those who you want to serve, maybe you can craft a specific area that you want to explore more or that you want to have a network or a community where you share more about that very specific niche. Okay. So for example, there are tons of communities about entrepreneurs online.
Asmaa Moussa:
So I would go to that one and start building the relationships and maybe I notice that there is a need or there is a certain problem that I can personally solve and then I would start gradually to build my whole network and my whole effect around that just small carved area.
Erin Patchell: Good advice. Yeah.
Asmaa Moussa: Thank you.
Erin Patchell: Is that generally the same advice that you would give your clients?
Asmaa Moussa: Yeah, 100%. Because it's important for my clients to know that one of the important advices that I give them is to go where their customers hang out. Okay. So it's important to understand the customer that you're trying to serve. Right. I really hate when someone thinks that they have a solution that's going to help other people and they have never had the time to speak with those other people. They have to spend the time to understand the kind of issues that they are having, the pains, the struggles, and what exactly the solution that they are looking for. If you do not know that, if you do not know the kind of language that your people are using, how can you serve them? How can you help them? This way, you're not going to go anywhere.
Asmaa Moussa: So it's always better to immerse yourself in the places where your customers are hanging out and develop that deep understanding of what you can offer based on what they need, not just based on your own vision of what they might need. Does that make sense?
Erin Patchell: Yeah, that definitely makes sense. What would you say if I'm and I am an entrepreneur, so you can talk directly to me about this? What is the fastest way to build a community?
Asmaa Moussa: Okay, so the real truth is that communities take time to be built. Okay? So effective communities require tons of work, tons of effort, and tons of time to be created and built and nurtured because you cannot just create a group on Facebook and have 100 of your friends and say that you have a community. This is not a community. A community is a place where people, not just you as an entrepreneur, where people have the opportunity to share their ideas, to share their questions, experiences, issues, wins, challenges and failures. Okay? So this is what a community really means. A very successful community is a one that the owner is not the only one that's engaging, to put it that clear, okay? A good community is a self sustained community where other members are the ones that are sharing the most posts, are the ones that are answering the most comments or threats, okay? So this is when you know that you have created a good community. So it takes tons of efforts. However, we have discovered a little bit of a trick that we use in order to build a community faster, but then you would still have the work to leverage that group or that community that you have created.
Asmaa Moussa: So this strategy is based on creating a coaching week or a challenge. And the whole idea starts with something that you can help your clients with or your audience with within a very short amount of time, okay? Something that they can actually create within, let's say, five days. So you host that challenge where people sign up for that. So you have the benefit of building your list and having all these emails that you can nurture afterwards. And this is a whole new topic that we can spend hours talking about. But you would have that list and then you invite them to a group where you would deliver the content of that challenge. Okay? So, for example, if you are a business coach and you are serving people who want to start their own businesses so you can create a simple five day challenge that starts with developing a business idea. Understanding your Avatar developing your core offers, coming up with marketing plan and so on and so forth, so that by the end of the five days, your audience would have a clear plan on things that they can start.
Asmaa Moussa: You made that transformation for them. You've helped them within five days. So that is an amazing way to build a community where the people inside of that place understand the value that you can offer. So they would stick there, they would come to you for help and maybe they want to sign up for higher ticket offers that you've got. So a challenge might be free or very low ticket offer, but then afterwards there is an opportunity for a serving people for $0. And this is extremely important part of any business because not everyone is ready to invest with you. And it's a good way to give back to the community by giving them free value. Then you would have others who might be interested in working with Erin and to explore the advice, the high ticket advice that you can offer for them, so you will get extra business on the site.
Asmaa Moussa: So it's a win win.
Erin Patchell: That's awesome advice, and I might just do that.
Asmaa Moussa: I'm a huge fan of free value or giving back to the people who are not ready to invest at the moment. Because everyone deserves to have this break and not having the budget does not mean that you do not qualify for success.
Erin Patchell: Oh, I am so with you on that one. I am all about giving free value as well. I mean, that's one of the reasons why we decided to start the podcast in the first place. Right?
Asmaa Moussa: Of course.
Erin Patchell: Yeah. And lots of other endeavors as well, so that's great. Do you have any projects coming up or anything you'd like to share with.
Asmaa Moussa:
The listeners at the moment? I've been going very deep and immersing myself in another way to create community and to develop your fans around the business that you have. I've been exploring the idea of memberships. There is this concept that I am very convinced about at this moment that having courses is dead. Okay? If you're creating a course, if you're a course builder, this is dead. Stop doing that. And instead, it's better to develop memberships. So the whole idea is that people that you should develop memberships where people come to you and listen to the content that you have and in the same time offer them a community where they connect together and learn. From you and try to understand how they can apply whatever content you are giving to them and apply them in their businesses or in their lives to have this place where they can network and share whatever questions they have.
Asmaa Moussa:
I think this is a much better model than just having a course, selling it and putting it out there for the people to buy. And when you create a subscription and have a community, again, have a community attached to that membership where you continue to offer value to your members, this can create great value for the people that you want to serve. So there is this saying that keeps popping in my head that says people buy for the product, but they stay for the community. Right. This makes lots of sense. And we have seen that. I've seen that so many times over and over and over again, and we're making huge success with that. This is something that I'm working on with my clients at the moment, developing successful memberships for them.
Erin Patchell:
That's fantastic. Well, I think that sounds like a great idea, and I've actually seen a few examples of that, in fact, in a few different groups that I've been a part of where it's the same model. And I think that does work exceptionally well when it's done well. For sure.
Asmaa Moussa:
Exactly. So just stop doing courses.
Erin Patchell:
Everyone develop membership for individuals. For sure. Yeah. For B to C. Definitely.
Asmaa Moussa:
Exactly.
Erin Patchell:
Yeah. Awesome. Really good advice. Asima, thank you so much for joining us today, Chris.
Asmaa Moussa:
You're very welcome. Always happy to be here.
Erin Patchell:
Really appreciate your words of wisdom. And I'm going to remember that people may buy your products, but they stay for the community. 100% amazing. I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Asmaa on the power of community and how to build community in your business. If you want to get a hold of Asmaa to help you build community, connect with her at www.moussamedia.com.
In the words of the great Annie DeFranco, building jetties in a current is a surefire way to move lots of water. This is how you take the energy that's coming in the form of current and you shape it.
Erin Patchell:
That's a metaphor I think perfectly applies to community building. That's all for today. Until next time, remember to stay weird, stay wonderful, and don't stay out of trouble.
