Retired Intelligence Detective Gary Jenkins brings you the best in mob history with his unique perception of the mafia. In this episode, I speak with author Matt Birkbeck about the life of William “Big Billy” D’Elia, a prominent figure in the mafia. We discuss D’Elia’s role as a negotiator for the mob and his close relationship with Russell Bufalino. The conversation delves into behind-the-scenes dealings, connections to influential individuals, and the complexities of the criminal world. We highlight the scarcity of information about the Russell Bufalino family and the power they held.
One fascinating aspect that emerges is Billy’s role as a negotiator for the mob across different industries, including films, music, and politics. We discuss his connections with influential individuals like Nick Civella and Tony Ripe Civella, the nephew who took over the family business. A notable episode involves Billy intervening when Donald Trump wanted Michael Jackson to perform at his casino, ultimately becoming Jackson’s co-manager.
The book offers unparalleled insights into the inner workings of organized crime, including behind-the-scenes dealings and Billy’s rise to power within the mob. We uncover Muhammad Ali’s visit to Ted Kennedy on Russell Bufalino’s behalf, showcasing these hidden alliances’ unpredictable nature. The power and respect commanded by Bufalino become evident as we explore anecdotes of his interactions with figures like Frank Sinatra. We also touch on Bufalino’s influence through his connection to the Teamsters Union.
We recommend Matt Birkbeck’s book for true crime enthusiasts and provide valuable resources for listeners dealing with PTSD and substance abuse.
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Transcript
Introduction of special guest Matt Birkbeck
[0:00] Welcome, all you guys back here in the studio Ganglans Wire where I have a special guest today, Matt Birkbeck.
He wrote The Life We Chose, and he examines the life of William Big Billy D’Elia.
Did I get that right, Matt D’Elia?
You got that right. Well, Matt, welcome. I’m really happy to have you on the show.
Thanks for having me.
And you write a lot about Russell Bufalino and who Big Billy D’Elia came up under. So that’s something that my guys out here really want to know about, because he was such an important mafia member nationally.
Bufalino was, and D’Elia, Big Billy, he came up under him. He kind of took over his kind of mantle, it looks to me like, from reading your book.
Guys, let me tell you a couple of quotes. You may all know mafia reporter, my favorite mafia reporter and expert, George Anastasia.
And he said about The Life We Choose, he said it’s a riveting, extraordinary account of one of the last 20th century goodfellas.
And Nicholas Pelleggi, who is the, of course, Las Vegas expert, called it a good read and an unforgettable story. So there’s pretty high praise, Matt, from guys like that.
Matt Birkbeck’s other true crime books
[1:14] What other true crime books do you have?
So this was my, I believe it was my seventh book. So I’ve written about Robert Durst in my first book, A Deadly Secret.
[1:25] I wrote two books on a really interesting case involving a girl who was kidnapped as a toddler, called Books for a Beautiful Child and Finding Sharon, which became a Netflix film last year.
It was released last summer. I’ve written about Sammy Davis Jr., Deconstructing Sammy, which also included The Mob, believe it or not.
And then now I did The Life We Chose, which came out last month.
[1:49] Interesting. Just a little aside, Matt, there’s a true crime author, And I think he produced the movie about Danny Green and the Cleveland mob, a guy named Rick Varello.
And Rick Varello played in a backup band as a drummer years ago for Sammy Davis Jr.
So he’s got a lot of Sammy Davis Jr. stories.
I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of Ricky. I think, believe it or not, Sammy had a lot of Cleveland connections, which was really interesting. So your listeners or viewers or whatever may be interested in reading about Sammy and deconstructing Sammy too.
Yeah, really. Sammy’s an interesting guy. He brushed up against the mafia off and on all his career, but all those guys did.
You had to in the fifties, especially reading this book, you’ll find out how much music and Hollywood film industry rubbed up against the mafia.
Tell us a little bit about Big Billy D’Elia.
Billy D’Elia’s rise in the Bufalino family
[2:43] Billy was the head of the Bufalino family beginning in 1994, following the death of Russell Bufalino.
He was arrested in 2006. When he was arrested, he got arrested on a money laundering charge, and they later added attempting to kill a witness, which was later dropped.
But when he was arrested, law enforcement across the country had wanted to talk to him.
Everyone from the FBI, US Secret Service, Homeland Security, IRS, New York City Terrorism Task Force, and that was because of who Billy was.
He became this very powerful individual, and it was a result of his almost 30 years with Russell Buffalino. Prior to Russell’s death in 1994, Billy had been with him since 1966, and the two men were very, very close, and Russell considered him his son.
[3:39] Russell, for those, even for your listeners who think they may know who Russell Buffalino was, they don’t know. Very few people know this, but he was arguably one of the most powerful and influential organized crime figures of the 20th century. He was that big. He was involved in so many different things, from Cuba, to the Appalachian Conference, to testifying before Bobby Kennedy, to the Teamsters, where he was just incredibly influential.
Russell Bufalino’s immense power and influence
[4:09] He knew and loved Jimmy Hoffa.
His nephew, who he had placed with the Teamsters, was their general counsel.
Russell had huge influence over their Central States Teamsters Fund.
Of course, he was involved. He was one of the key suspects in the disappearance of Jimmy Hoffa in the mid-1970s, in 1975.
I asked Billy, when I started interviewing Billy in 2020, I said, was Russell Buffalino ever a member of the commission?
And Billy said to me, no. He said Russell was above the commission.
[4:39] And that just spoke volumes to me. So that’s who Billy DeLeo was. Billy had the benefit of being tutored, being protege of Russell Buffalino. And he subsequently took on Russell’s role as the mob’s negotiator when Russell went to prison in the mid-1980s.
Yeah, I had read that about Russell, that he was the negotiator, go all over the United States and settle things that the commission, you don’t want to bring everything to the commission, but he would go out there and get people together, which is pretty interesting.
You’ve got some stories, really great stories that Billy told you.
[5:14] And how did you happen to get in connecting with him? Billy actually connected with me. It was August of 2020.
And I got an email, and it said, Would I be interested in speaking with Billy?
I knew who Billy was, because I had covered him when I was a newspaper reporter.
In the early 2000s, Billy was involved in it says I write in the book.
Billy was involved in a situation involving casino gambling in Pennsylvania when Governor Ed Rendell bought casinos here. And Billy was involved with one of the applicants who was a good friend of his. And that good friend turned his back on Billy and basically offered him up.
As I write in the book to the government, as I said, Billy never spoke to law enforcement.
They all wanted to talk to him. FBI wanted to talk to him about Jimmy Hoffa because they figured They figured that he knew Russell, he was that close to Russell.
He was also very close to Frank Sheeran.
And the government figured that he had to know something. And he did, but he didn’t talk to.
[6:13] Anyone. But a couple of things occurred. One, he saw The Irishman, the film, in 2019, and he was outraged by it over a couple of things. One, the portrayal of Bufalino, not the acting of Joe Pesci, who was marvelous, but the portrayal of Bufalino as being and somewhat subservient to some other mob leaders, which wasn’t the case in Billy’s eye.
And also, Frank Sheeran’s story about killing Jimmy Hoffa, Billy knew that wasn’t fiction.
And so he wanted to set the record straight on that. And he also wanted to set the record straight on a couple of other things involving the local connection with casinos and.
[6:53] This situation involving him and his former friend of his, this billionaire.
Big Billy’s involvement in New York City with Bufalino
[6:57] So they reached out to me, I jumped at the chance, it took a number of months to get Billy comfortable with the idea of talking to a reporter or a writer, an author. But once Billy got comfortable and began to trust me and we got going, we spoke for roughly another year and a half. And the result’s the book. Interesting. Now, in your book, you talk a lot about Bufalino bringing Big Billy on trips to New York City and going to the jewelry district, because he had some action down there getting stolen jewelry, I think, from people and other business that he had. And going to Copacabana, which is kind of part of the Irishman story, and the movie, they had this. And there’s another guy named Pete the Greek, Dacopolis,
