Description

In this episode of the Engaged By Design Podcast, we welcome back Kathy Hagler and Robin Graham, co-authors of The ABCs of Murmuration.

Together, we explore Flock Logic—a powerful nature-inspired framework drawn from the mesmerizing behavior of starlings—and how it applies to leadership, teamwork, and learning organizations.

You’ll discover:

• Why high-functioning groups don’t need a single leader to move together
• The three natural principles behind murmuration: alignment, separation, and cohesion
• How those principles translate into human leadership behaviors: step up, step back, and step together
• Why trust, awareness, and connection matter more than control
• Simple practices leaders and educators can use immediately to create rhythm, flow, and shared responsibility

If you’re navigating uncertainty, change, or collaboration fatigue, this conversation offers a hopeful and practical path forward—one grounded in nature, humanity, and collective wisdom.