Copywriter Rick Marion joins Kira Hug and Rob Marsh for the 86th episode of The Copywriter Club Podcast. This one gets personal as Rick talks about how he overcame his addictions and how that relates to copywriting. We also talked about...
• how he found copywriting and persuasion though a mentor
• what his first few clients were like (where the work came from)
• how he identifies a mentor to connect (and work) with
• how he finds clients today
• what he’s doing to build the channels where clients can find him
• the two reasons he continually invests in masterminds, books, and events
• the biggest take-aways from his membership in The Think Tank
• his struggle with addiction and how he reframed the way he looked at the world
• what he is experimenting with these days
• what copywriters can do to build their authority
• why he put together a copywriter book group
• what Rick is working on in his business today
Rick is a current member of The Copywriter Think Tank and he shares a bit about his experience there. To get this one, visit iTunes, Stitcher or your favorite podcast app. Or click the play button below. For a full transcript, just keep scrolling.
The people and stuff we mentioned on the show:
The Copywriter Think Tank
The New York Event: TCCIRL
Proposify
Better Proposals
Ben Settle
Jody Mayberry
Ray Edwards
Brian Kurtz
Larry Winget
Parris Lampropolous
Parris’ book list (coming soon)
How to Write a Good Advertisement by Vic Schwab
Talent is Overrated by Geoffrey Colvin
rickmarion.com
Kira’s website
Rob’s website
The Copywriter Club Facebook Group
Intro: Content (for now)
Outro: Gravity
Full Transcript:
Kira: What if you could hang out with seriously talented copywriters and other experts, ask them about their successes and failures, their work processes and their habits, then steal an idea or two to inspire your own work? That’s what Rob and I do every week at The Copywriter Club Podcast.
Rob: You’re invited to join the club for episode 86, as we chat we freelance copywriter Rick Marion about his story; dealing with addiction; how he approached copywriting; what he’s learned from the influencers in his life, and the importance of constantly learning and improving as you build your career.
Kira: Rick, welcome!
Rob: Hey Rick!
Rick: Hey; thank you guys!
Kira: So Rick, we met you through The Copywriter Think Tank, and we’ve had the privilege of getting to know you overt the past six months or so. So why don’t we start with your story, and how you became a copywriter?
Rick: Well, it was comforting; a couple of weeks ago at the New York event, someone asked how many people became copywriters by accident, and like, the whole room pretty much raised their hand. So, that was pretty comforting to know that I also kind of just fell into this. So, full-time job; like, i was working. This was about four years ago, five years ago, and I was working on my master’s degree. i was getting certifications going after my dream job. And I actually got the offer. It was more money than I asked for. Ton of vacation time...it was exactly what I was looking for in like cyber-security. And I had the start date, like, everything was lined up. And then i got a call saying they couldn’t give me the job because of foreign-national contacts that i had. Like...
Kira: What?
Rick: It was too sensitive. Yeah, it’s the industry.
Rob: I want to know about these “foreign-national contacts”!
Rick: Laughs.
Kira: Yeah!
Rob: Like, foreign national...spy? Or drug dealer?
Kira: Are you a spy?
Rob: Yeah, what’s up? Laughs.
Rick: Laughs. No, you know what? It’s just people that travel all over the world and they travel to some countries that, you know, the U.S. doesn’t really want to get involved with. So it was enough to basically say they couldn’t offer me the job, and I was devastated.
Kira: Wow.
Rick: I mean this was, like I said, like three years i was working towards this. I was working two jobs to get it, like, I was making all the connections. Going through, like, the whole interview process from like falling on my face the first interview I ever had, to like, really learning how to sell myself. And through that process, someone say that I was having a tough time, and they put me in contact with a mentor, and someone who’s now become a friend—his name’s Mark. And, he helped open my eyes to other possibilities outside of just that, like, one track that i had in mind. He made me realize I was kind of living in a bubble, and that there’s a ton more opportunities.
And so we started talking, and he kind of introduced me to the whole idea of, like, marketing concepts, and how psychology plays a role, and I was just like falling in love with this because it was right up my alley anyway. So then I started looking into, like, online business, and marketing and realized that, I actually knew something about this because I had marketed myself in the career space, and there are a lot of parallels. And so, come up to close to today, I was connected to a couple people who were already copywriters, and like, I was like, this copywriting thing makes a lot of sense, because you know, you have to be curious, and like I asked probably too many questions. Like, I love learning, you know? And there’s like all these characteristics that just really fit with being a copywriter. And so, it’s kind of like I feel into like this perfect role for my personality, and what I’ve been through, and I was connected to people who were copywriters, so they were able to kind of get me work right away. And, yeah. Here I am. Laughs.
Rob: What did those first couple of clients look like, you know? You say you got them from your contacts; what were the projects, and how did that go?
Rick: My client was technically the people that I knew in copywriting, right? So I was doing work for them. One of the project was basically an on-boarding and a sales funnel in the real estate investing industry. So, Writing the full sales funnel was about seven or eight emails, and I loved it. It was just throwing me into the fire, like, right into the market research, pulling out like testimonials from different pieces of their content online, and including them and the emails, and on the sale pages... And then i was able to present it to the person that hired me and get the feedback, and that was a huge boost of confidence too, early on, you know, for someone to say, “Yeah, this is good enough to where I would put my name on it.” Like, that mean that world to me.
Kira: Yeah. I was going to say, like, what are some of the benefits of writing copy for other copywriters early in your career? Because I do think that’s huge and so important. What else can copywriters get out of that?
Rick: Well, the confidence is the big thing, and direct feedback. So, there’s a book called Talent is Overrated. And it talks about how you can really excel with a skill, and a couple of the points that you need to do is you need to push your mind. Like, you need to push yourself mentally in order to improve rapidly. So, getting that feedback and, you know, basically saying like, hey—this isn’t quite getting it over here, it needs to be improved—as crappy as that sounds getting, but that’s what’s needed to really improve, and to get better. And another thing is, the direct feedback—having someone who’s more experienced that can kind of see where your weaknesses are in order to tell you that this is where you need to improve. And, yeah, so it’s the basic skill development, and then coming back around again—I know I’ve said it like two of three times, but—confidence; confidence; confidence.
Rob: So if I’m a beginning copywriter, and I’m think, “Okay; I want to do what Rick just did. I want to connect with another copywriter, somebody who can feed me work,” how did you do that? How did you connect with somebody who was willing to give you the time, first of all, and second of all, willing to give you a project?
Rick: So, part of it was by chance, because I just happened to be connected with a couple people who were in copywriting. But, strategically, there are things that people can do. So, what I like to do is look at groups or circles or people that you really are attracted to, that you like. It won’t work if you don’t like the person; like don’t try to connect with someone just because, you know, they’re successful. Chuckles.
Kira: Laughs.
Rick: Right? You have to like them; you have to be attracted to these people for one reason or another. And if they’re at like—let’s just, for lack for a better term—an elite level, then look at who is someone that’s a couple of steps ahead of you, and a few steps below the elite level, and that’s kind of who I look at for who I can connect with and who would be willing to work with me, you know? Because I think it’s tough to, you know, someone who’s brand new asking someone like Ben Settle or whatever to feed them work, you know? It happens, but it’s not as likely. So I think looking at someone a couple steps ahead of you that you respect, and, really just starting to build a relationship with them. You know, you can pitch them, right off the bat, but you can also build a relationship, and you know, try to offer value; try to support them in what they’re doing. And that’ll show that, “Hey, this person actually thinks of things outside of just themself. Like they think about other people,” and it’s really attractive when you’re talking about working with someone else.
Kira: So Rick, how have you found clients, beyond the first few, you know, through close friendships? How have you found other clients so that you can grow your business, because most new copywriters really struggle to find those clients early on.
Rick: Yeah. And I’m no different. So, referrals—all of my clients have been through referrals. And so that’s really good,
