Shows
The Belt and Road PodcastAll Things Durian with Beimeng Fu and Zhaoyin FengBeimeng Fu and Zhaoyin Feng join the Belt and Road Podcast to talk about durian, a tropical fruit most widely known for its strong and divisive odor. It's also a fruit in very high demand in China; the country consumes 1.5 million tons of durian per year. Beimeng and Zhaoyin talk about how Chinese consumption of the fruit is driving durian plantation expansion across Southeast Asia and what that means for the region.Beimeng Fu is an independent multimedia journalist and filmmaker based in Mexico. She previously worked as senior producer of original video and documentary production at...2025-06-241h 00The Belt and Road PodcastReconfiguring Racial Capitalism with Mingwei HuangMingwei Huang joins Juliet, Keren, and Sisi to talk about the social and racial dimensions of China's increasing engagement with Africa, with a focus on Huang's research in Johannesburg, South Africa. The discussion is inspired by Mingwei's recent book, Reconfiguring Racial Capitalism: South Africa in the Chinese Century (Duke University Press, 2024).Mingwei Huang is assistant professor of Women's, Gender and Sexuality Studies at Dartmouth University. She is an interdisciplinary scholar of race and migration trained in American studies and gender & sexuality studies. Recommendations:Mingwei:Made in Ethiopia film (2024)K...2025-04-2247 minThe Belt and Road PodcastEnvironmental Issues along the Belt and Road, Episode 1: Manufacturing the Clean Energy TransitionThis is Episode 1 of our sub-series "Environmental Issues along the Belt and Road"The series considers the complexities of Chinese actors' impacts on the environment, extractive activities, and role in driving sustainability solutions from the sands of the Mekong River to lithium mines in Argentina. China produces 80% of the world's solar panels, over 60% of all wind turbines, and more electric vehicles than the US and the EU combined. In this episode, we ask how China became so dominant in clean energy technology manufacturing, how its products are exported to other countries trying to transition their e...2025-04-0457 minThe Belt and Road PodcastSino-Zambian Relations with Justin HaruyamaJustin Haruyama joins Juliet, Erik, and Sisi (welcome to our new team member/producer!) to talk about China-Zambia relations, from the history of Chinese aid in Zambia to the complex people-to-people relations that characterize this bilateral relationship.Justin Haruyama is an instructor of anthropology at The University of British Columbia whose research explores diverse forms of relationality enabled by Chinese-African encounters, ranging from intimacy and fellowship, to exclusion and xenophobia, to mutual dependence and obligation. He is currently working on a book entitled Mining for Coal and Souls: Modes of Relationality in Emerging Chinese-Zambian Worlds that examines...2025-03-1651 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Latercomer’s Rise and the Globalization of Chinese Development Finance with Muyang ChenMuyang Chen joins Erik and Keren to talk all things Chinese development finance, including her recent book, The Latecomer's Rise: Policy Banks and the Globalization of China's Development Finance (2024).Muyang Chen is an Assistant Professor of International Development at Peking University's School of International Studies. Her research and teaching interests lie at the intersection of development, political economy, and international relations. She has been a visiting scholar at the Institute for International Economic Policy at George Washington University, a visiting scholar at Japan's National Graduate Institute for Policy Studies, and a pre-doctoral fellow at the Global Development...2024-10-2242 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina’s Complex Presence in Southeast Asia: Tourism, Organized Crime, Geopolitical TensionsEnze Han joins Juliet and Keren to discuss all things China in Southeast Asia, from migration to tourism to pig butchering scams, and much more. Enze Han is Associate Professor at the Department of Politics and Public Administration at the University of Hong Kong. His research interests include the international relations of East Asia, China's relations with Southeast Asia, Southeast Asian politics, and ethnic politics in China. Professor Han received a Ph.D in Political Science from the George Washington University. He is the author of The Ripple Effect: China's Complex Presence in Southeast Asia (2024)....2024-09-1952 minThe Belt and Road PodcastInfrastructure States and Cycling Along the China-Laos Railroad with Jess DiCarloJess DiCarlo joins Juliet and Keren for a dynamic discussion about China's identity as an infrastructural state, the myth of the debt trap narrative, cycling as method (and Jess's experience biking along the China-Laos train route), the impact of the BRI in Laos, and much more. Dr. Jess DiCarlo is an assistant professor in Geography, Environment, and Asian Studies at the University of Utah. She has been a Wilson China Fellow, a Public Intellectual Program Fellow of the National Committee on U.S.-China Relations, and the Chevalier Postdoctoral Research Fellow in Transportation and Development in China a...2024-07-2348 minThe Belt and Road PodcastOcean Consciousness and the Maritime Silk Road with Tabitha Grace Mallory and Andrew ChubbTabitha Grace Mallory and Andrew Chubb visit the Belt and Road Podcast to chat about China's ocean economy, maritime activities, and the role of concepts like ocean consciousness. Dr. Tabitha Grace Mallory is CEO of the consulting firm China Ocean Institute, and an affiliate faculty member of the Henry M. Jackson School of International Studies. Tabitha specializes in Chinese foreign and environmental policy and researches China and global ocean governance. She has consulted for the UN, WWF, the World Bank, and the OECD, she serves on the board of directors of the China Club of Seattle, and i...2024-05-3058 minThe Belt and Road PodcastLeland Lazarus on Triads, Taiwan, and China's Forum Diplomacy in Latin America and the CaribbeanLeland Lazarus joins Juliet to talk about Chinese and Taiwanese engagement in Latin America and the Caribbean, from official diplomatic activities to BRI projects to transnational organized crime. Leland Lazarus is the Associate Director of National Security at Florida International University’s Jack D. Gordon Institute of Public Policy. He is an expert on China’s relations with Latin America and the Caribbean, and manages a team of researchers and interns that collect data and analysis on U.S. national security and governance in the region. Fluent in both Mandarin and Spanish, he holds an M.A. in U...2024-04-2245 minThe Belt and Road PodcastEnvironmental Justice and Coal-Fired Power Plants in Indonesia with Bowen GuBowen Gu joins Juliet and Erik on the podcast to talk about environmental justice and China's coal investments in Indonesia, with a focus on Gu's recent paper: Black gold and green BRI: A grounded analysis of Chinese investment in coal-fired power plants in Indonesia (2024).Bowen Gu is a PhD student at the Institute of Environmental Science and Technology, Autonomous University of Barcelona (ICTA-UAB). Her research looks into coal-related environmental justice movements in China and broader regions under the Belt and Road Initiative. Recommendations: Erik:Terror Capitalism: Uyghur Dispossession and Masculinity in a Ch...2024-03-0841 minThe Belt and Road PodcastAn Anthropological Understanding of Chinese-financed Special Economic Zones in Nigeria with Omolade AdunbiProfessor Omolade Adunbi joins Juliet and Erik on the podcast to talk about China's free trade zones in Nigeria. Adunbi is the Director of the African Studies Center, Professor of Anthropology and Afroamerican and African Studies, Professor of Law, and Faculty Associate in the Program in the Environment at the University of Michigan. His research explores issues related to governance, infrastructures of extraction, environmental politics and rights, power, violence, culture, transnational institutions, multinational corporations, and the postcolonial state.Recommendations:Omolade:Music of Fela KutiPower, Knowledge, Land: Contested Ontologies of Land and its Governance...2023-11-1045 minThe Belt and Road PodcastHow China is Reshaping International Technical Standards with Tim RühligJuliet, Erik, and guest Tim Ruhlig discuss technical standards, China’s growth in technical industries and its increasing influence in leading and setting standards, and the new geopolitics of technical standardization and interdependence.Tim Ruhlig is a senior fellow at the German Council on Foreign Relations, where he researches Europe-China relations, German-China relations, Hong Kong politics, and Chinese foreign industrial policy, He is the founder of the Digital Power China (DPC) Research Consortium, which brings together European engineers and Chinese scholars to carry out policy-relevant research on the PRC’s growing digital technology footprint and its implications for...2023-09-2746 minThe Belt and Road PodcastFunding the Pre-Project Pipeline: China's New MCDF with Shuang LiuBefore the shovels hit the dirt, before a developer gets construction permits, before an MOU is signed, there exists a huge process of project feasibility, planning, and pre-approval. That process is incredibly complex and costly, but a new Multilateral Cooperation Center for Development Finance (MCDF) has been established to help. Shuang Liu joins Juliet and Erik on this episode to discuss how this might help kick start and expand the pipeline of more sustainable projects, and her broader goals in working at the World Resources Institute.Shuang Liu is the China Finance Director and Acting Director at...2023-08-2130 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina, the U.S., and Critical Minerals in the DRC with Laetitia Tran NgocJuliet chats with Laetitia Tran Ngoc about the state of China-Democratic Republic of the Congo (DRC) relations, the way people in the DRC view China and the U.S., outside interest in critical minerals mining in the DRC, and the domestic situation of the DRC that acts as a destabilizing factor to it all. Her article in South China Morning Post is here: "Mineral-rich central Africa become focal point in US-China tug of war"Laetitia Tran Ngoc is a freelance journalist and consultant specializing in government communications, with extensive experience in advising diplomatic institutions in t...2023-07-1337 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Periphery Perspective: Global China from the Borderlands with Ale RippaAlessandro (Ale) Rippa joins Juliet and Erik on the podcast to talk about how he uses China's borderlands as a starting point to understand the Chinese state, global engagements like the Belt and Road Initiative, and Chinese development. They discuss Ale's experiences working in China's border regions in Xinjiang and Yunnan, how borders are zones of connection and disconnection, China's historical support for the Communist Party of Burma, and much more. Alessandro Rippa is associate professor at the University of Oslo's Department of Social Anthropology. His research centers on China's borderlands as lenses for studying infrastructure, global circulations...2023-04-2841 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina's Growing Flirtations with International NGO Collaboration with May Farid and Hui LiMay Farid and Hui Li drop by the podcast to talk about INGOs, or international non-governmental organizations, and specifically how their relationship with China is shifting as China goes global. The conversation focuses on their article "International NGOs as intermediaries in China's 'going out' strategy." May Farid is a political scientist studying civil society, policy and development in contemporary China and beyond. She is a visiting scholar at Stanford University's Center on China's Economy and Institutions and a Lecturer at the University of Hong Kong. She holds a doctorate from the University of Oxford and has worked ex...2023-03-2447 minThe Belt and Road PodcastCOP15 and China's Growing Environmental Leadership with Jesse Rodenbiker and Tyler HarlanJuliet is joined by friends and fellow researchers Jesse Rodenbiker and Tyler Harlan to discuss their recent experiences at the COP15 of the Conference on Biological Diversity, China's growing environmental leadership, and China's domestic environmental policies and their impact on BRI initiatives and overseas engagements. Jesse starts off the conversation with some background on China's approach to environmental governance - based on his articles "Making Ecology Developmental: China's Environmental Sciences and Green Modernization in Global Context," "Green silk roads, partner state development, and environmental governance," and his upcoming book "Ecological States: Politics of Science and Nature in U...2023-01-181h 03The Belt and Road PodcastComparing the Railway Bureaucracies in China and India with Kyle ChanKyle Chan visits the Belt and Road Podcast to talk about state capacity in railway bureaucracies in China and India, his research collected while riding trains through the two countries, the incredibly mundane naming of Chinese companies, and much more. This episode discusses Kyle's research published in two articles: Inside China's state-owned enterprises: Managed competition through a multi-level structure (2022) and The organizational roots of state capacity: Comparing railway bureaucracies in China and India (2022).Kyle Chan is a PhD student in sociology at Princeton University, where his research focuses on bureaucracy and infrastructure development in China and India. H...2022-12-1243 minThe Belt and Road PodcastExploring Chinese Soft Power with Maria RepnikovaJuliet and Erik are joined by Maria Repnikova to talk about her book, "Chinese soft power," Confucius Institutes, China's love for spectacle, and of course, how all this and more applies to the Belt and Road. What is soft power? How is China doing when it comes to soft power projection around the world? Listen to find out!Maria Repnikova is the Director of the Center for Global Information Studies and an Assistant Professor in Global Communication at Georgia State University. She is a scholar of global communication, with a comparative focus on China and Russia. Her research...2022-10-2449 minThe Belt and Road PodcastEvaluating Mega Projects: The Standard Gauge Railway in Kenya with Keren ZhuKeren Zhu talked with us about her research on the socioeconomic impacts of the Belt and Road, specifically with regard to Kenya's Standard Gauge Railway (SGR). She provides background and analysis on the SGR, she and Eric discuss their personal experiences riding the railway, and more! Much of the conversation centers around Keren's recent work with co-authors Ben Mwangi and Lynn Hu, published in the article Socioeconomic impact of China's infrastructure-led growth model in Africa: A case study of the Kenyan Standard Gauge Railway (2022). We also draw on her piece, "Addressing the Impact Evaluation Gaps in Belt and Road I...2022-09-1638 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina's Global Climate Governance with Jeffrey QiJeffrey Qi discusses China's growing role in high-level, high-stakes global climate governance. We discuss research Jeffrey conducted as a master's student in political science at the University of British Columbia and the resulting article he wrote with his advisor Peter Dauvergne, China's rising influence on climate governance: Forging a path for the global South (2021), which can be found here.Jeffrey Qi is a policy analyst at the International Institute for Sustainable Development's Resilience Program (IISD). Based in Vancouver, he provides research, project management, and communication support with a focus on national adaptation planning (NAP) processes, ecosystem-based adaptation...2022-08-1044 minThe Belt and Road PodcastUS Strategy Regarding China's Presence in the African Continent with Winslow Robertson and Owakhela KankhwendeErik is joined by Winslow Robertson and Owakhela Kankhwende to discuss their chapter of the book From Trump to Biden and Beyond: Reimagining U.S.-China Relations, entitled "U.S. Strategy Vis-À-Vis China's Presence in the African Continent: Description and Prescription". Winslow Robertson is a PhD student at IESE Business School at the University of Navarra, where he focuses on Chinese provincial SOEs and the Belt and Road. He is also the founder of Cowries and Rice, a Sino-Africa management consultancy.Owakhela Kankhwende is a recent graduate with a MAS in business analytics from F...2022-06-2349 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Politics of Infrastructure Maintenance and Decay w/ The Roadwork Asia Project's Agnieszka Joniak-Lüthi and Zarina UrmanbetovaJuliet and Erik are joined by Agnieszka Joniak-Lüthi and Zarina Urmanbetova of Roadwork Asia to discuss China's road infrastructure projects in Central Asia and their research at Roadwork Asia, including their article on infrastructural connections across the Toghuz-Toro district of central Kyrgystan Welcome and Unwelcome Connections: Travelling Post-Soviet Roads in Kyrgyzstan.Agnieszka Joniak-Lüthi is a professor of social anthropology at the University of Fribourg and head of the ROADWORK project. She focuses on China and the Sino-Central Asian borderlands. Her recent research explores the nexus of transport infrastructure, settler colonialism, and processes of state territorialization in...2022-06-1049 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Chinese Insurance Sector and the BRI with Margaret MyersMargaret Myers returns to The Belt and Road Podcast to speak with Erik about the role and development of China's international insurance sector in Latin America and the Caribbean. The conversation is based on her January 2022 report from The Dialogue entitled Going Out, Guaranteed: Chinese Insurers in Latin America. Margaret Myers is the director of the Asia & Latin America Program at the Inter-American Dialogue. She created the Dialogue's China and Latin America Working Group in 2011, as well as the China-Latin America Finance Database in cooperation with the Global China Initiative at Boston University's Global Development Policy Center. Sh...2022-05-1032 minThe Belt and Road PodcastAmmar Malik, China AidData, and the Data and Debate over Chinese LendingOn this episode, Juliet and Erik speak to Dr. Ammar Malik about AidData’s Global Chinese Development Finance Dataset, Version 2.0. This dataset provides the most comprehensive data on China’s overseas development finance activities, covering projects over 18 commitment years (2000-2017). They discuss the trends and findings from the dataset, break down China’s overseas loans and the concept of ‘hidden debt’, explore potential future applications of the data, and more. Dr. Ammar Malik is a senior research scientist at AidData, a research lab at William & Mary where he leads the Chinese Development Finance Program. He holds a Ph.D. in Pub...2022-04-0848 minThe Belt and Road PodcastCotton Diplomacy in Central Asia: Dr. Irna Hofman on China in Tajikistan and BeyondJust across the Xinjiang border, China is investing in a range of sectors. Infrastructure and road construction are booming as in many other places, but cotton investments dominate and are seen as a distinct type. Cotton is considered a strategic crop both to China and Tajikistan and is embedded in a range of elite networks and state power. Cotton Diplomacy is one of many things we cover in this episode, listen in!Read more of Dr. Hofman's work: Chinese Cotton Diplomacy in Tajikistan: Greasing the Ties by Reviving the Cotton EconomyIn the Interstices of Patriarchal Order: S...2022-03-1048 minThe Belt and Road PodcastA Systematic Analysis of International Chinese Contractors - w/ Hong ZhangOn episode 51, Juliet and Erik welcome back Dr. Hong Zhang to discuss the history, interests, corporate structures and agency of International Chinese infrastructure contractors. Discussion is based on Hong Zhang's May 2021 working paper for SAIS-China Africa Research Initiative entitled: Chinese International Contractors in Africa: Structure and Agency. Hong Zhang is a Postdoctoral Fellow at Johns Hopkins University's SIAS-CARI and a 2021-22 China and the World Program Fellow at Columbia University. She received her PhD in Public Policy from the Schar School of Policy and Government at George Mason University in 2021. She is one of...2022-02-031h 01The Belt and Road PodcastEpisode 50!! Grounded Understanding Within BRI / B3W "Competition" with Juliet & ErikJuliet and Erik celebrate their 50th episode by discussing their first co-authored article "Beyond Competition: Why the BRI and the B3W Can’t and Shouldn’t Be Considered Rivals" (Rosa Luxemburg Stiftung)On June 12, 2021, US President Biden along with the leaders of the Group of Seven (G7) launched their own “positive alternative” to the BRI - the Build Back Better for the World (B3W) multilateral infrastructure investment initiative. Juliet and Erik make the case that framing the two initiatives as competing alternatives is deceptive as on one hand, they are not comparable in many important ways, and...2021-12-151h 02The Belt and Road PodcastHow Do Chinese Firms Approach Overseas Investment Risk? w/ Alvin CambaOn this episode Erik speaks with returning guest Dr. Alvin Camba about his latest research paper "How Chinese firms approach investment risk: strong leaders, cancellation, and pushback" (link to paper)This groundbreaking research uses hundreds of in-depth interviews with top officials from China, Chinese SOEs, state-owned banks as well as Philippine and Indonesian political and economic elite to get a glimpse at how Chinese firms view the strength of a foreign leader, how that affects their investment decisions and how miscalculating strength can lead to undesirable outcomes for Chinese investors and/or State.Alvin Camba...2021-09-2851 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Continued Transformations of the Belt and Road Initiative w/ Jonathan HillmanOn the episode, Juliet and Erik speak with Senior Fellow and Director of the Reconnecting Asia Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies, Jonathan E. Hillman. Jon discusses the BRI in a historical context and talks about the way he's seen the BRI shift since its inception in 2013. The interview is based on Jon's 2020 book The Emperor's New Road: China and the Project of the Century (Yale University Press -- Juliet's review of the book)Recommendations:Juliet: 1) Feature on the main takeaways of the 2020 China census, South China Morning Post2) Sophia Ya...2021-08-1639 minThe Belt and Road PodcastKristen Hopewell on Chinese Agricultural Trade, Emerging Powers, and the Battle Over Export CreditOn this episode, Juliet talks with Dr. Kristen Hopewell, the Canada Research Chair in Global Policy in the School of Public Policy and Global Affairs at the University of British Columbia. Also a Wilson China Fellow, Kristen's work sheds light on how international governing bodies like the WTO and OECD can influence and be influenced by growing Chinese agricultural trade, subsidies, and export credit, combined with the increasing exercise of power by emerging powers coming to the international forefront. Who wins and who loses?Today's interview is based on: 1) Clash of Powers: US-China Rivalry in Global...2021-07-1538 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Belt and Road from Outer Space to Underground with Julie KlingerOn this episode Juliet and Erik speak with Dr. Julie Klinger about her research that smartly connects the seemingly disparate topics of geological surveying, Chinese domestic environmental and social movements, international infrastructure investments and China-Africa space cooperation. It's a fascinating discussion that you certainly don't want to miss! Our interview is based on: 1) Julie's amazing book, Rare Earth Frontiers2) "Environment, development, and security politics in the production of Belt and Road spaces" and 3) "China, Africa, and the Rest: recent trends in space science, technology, and satellite development."Julie Klinger is an Assistant P...2021-06-221h 08The Belt and Road PodcastMapping Global China, For and By the People with Ivan Franceschini, Stella Hongzhang and Mark GrimsditchA new approach to mapping the Belt and Road Initiative has arrived! The People's Map of China combines a broad, global representation of Chinese investments across a map of where they occur across the world with deep dive research into specific projects and their social and environmental implications. Designed by a coalition of nongovernmental organizations, journalists, trade unions, academics, and public contributors, the People's Map aims not only to improve understandings of global China but also to serve as a tool for advocacy for stakeholders affected by Chinese projects. Erik & Juliet speak with Mark Grimsditch, Stella HongZhang, an...2021-05-2937 minThe Belt and Road PodcastAn In-Depth Look at the Environmental Implications of the $2bn Ghana - Sinohydro Bauxite for Infrastructure Deal with Terrence Neal and Dr. Elizabeth LososIn this episode, Erik is joined by Terrence Neal and Dr. Elizabeth Losos to discuss their recent report that uses Ghana's $2bn bauxite-for-infrastructure deal with Sinohydro as a case study to look into the environmental implications of BRI resource-financed infrastructure agreements. Read the full report here: "The Environmental Implications of China-Africa Resource-Finance Infrastructure Agreements: Lessons Learned from Ghana's Sinohydro Agreement" About the authors: Terrence Neal is a natural resource governance researcher and current U.S. District court judicial law clerk. Terrence received his J.D. from Harvard Law School in 2019, and...2021-04-2547 minThe Belt and Road PodcastKelly Chen on the Complexities of Politically Important Sovereign Debt Agreements within the BRI - A Case Study of the Laos-China Railway Juliet and Erik talk with research assistant professor at the Hong Kong University of Science and Technology - Kelly Chen about her latest publication on the effects of Chinese infrastructure aid in Laos: hidden labor struggles, subcontracting, equity, and how it all came to a head with the Trans-Laos Railway project. Kelly dives into Chinese international lending, economic geographies, and narratives about creditworthiness and power through this case study.Read Kelly's work here:Sovereign Debt in the Making: Financial Entanglements and Labor Politics along the Belt and Road in LaosAnd here's an article b...2021-03-1648 minThe Belt and Road PodcastMargaret Myers on China's “Multi-tiered” Approach in the Latin America and the Caribbean RegionOn this episode, Juliet and Erik talk with Margaret Myers about the growing importance of Sub-national actors in China's geo-economic engagement in Latin America and the Caribbean. Read the entire report "Going Local: An Assessment of China's Administrative-Level Activity in Latin America and the Caribbean" hereMargaret Myers is the director of the Asia & Latin America Program at the Inter-American Dialogue. Recommendations:Margaret: - Yellowstone, Infrastructure Finance: The Business of Infrastructure for a Sustainable Future by Neil GriggJuliet: - The Yongle E...2021-02-2352 minThe Belt and Road PodcastEasy Money is Rarely Easy: Jessica Liao on Infrastructure Financing and Export Credit AgenciesChina is not the only player in the infrastructure investment game. So how does China's rising engagement under the Belt and Road intersect with investments of other countries? Jessica Liao shares multiple examples in which China's engagement in infrastructure investments, as well as in other areas of export investment management (e.g. export credit agencies), provoke competition with and sometimes the weakening of standards among other investor countries. Read the following articles by Jessica: 1) Panda Paw article "Easy Money and Political Opportunism: How China and Japan's High-Speed Rail Competition in Indonesia drives financially risky projects" 2) "...2021-01-211h 09The Belt and Road PodcastHarnessing Chinese Telecommunications Investments to Ethiopia's Benefit with Ding FeiCountries along the Belt and Road face major strategic technical and political questions when considering Chinese assistance in the telecommunications field. In this episode, Dr. DingFei discusses two articles on Chinese telecoms investments in Ethiopia. Through the lenses of Ethiopian state-Chinese company negotiations as well as employment practices, she explains how Ethiopian actors have corralled Chinese company interests to better serve their priorities and put bounds on their dominance of the Ethiopian telecommunications system by introducing inter-firm competition. See Dr. DingFei's relevant publications here: 1) Chinese Telecommunications Companies in Ethiopia: The Influences of Host Government Intervention and...2020-12-3133 minThe Belt and Road PodcastWho Decides and How Along the Belt and Road? with Thomas Hale & Johannes UrpelainenWho makes decisions about project approval, design, and the pursuit of sustainability - in China, in recipient countries, and beyond? A recent report entitled, 'Belt and Road Decision-making in China and Recipient Countries: How and To What Extent Does Sustainability Matter?' breaks this question down artfully to trace the interests and institutional structures shaping BRI projects. Listen to our interview with two of the three the authors, Thomas Hale (Associate Professor of Global Public Policy at the Blavatnik School of Government, University of Oxford) and Johannes Urpelainen (Prince Sultan bin Abdulaziz Professor of Energy, Resources and...2020-12-1848 minThe Belt and Road PodcastLucille Greer on China's Various Engagements in the Middle EastThe Middle East and North Africa (MENA) Region is vitally important to China, particularly as a source of oil but also increasingly as a staging ground for China's forays into global politics. Lucille Greer (@Lucille_Greer_), an expert on China-MENA relations, sheds light on a range of topics from the role of Xinjiang in China's Islamic world relations to the 'strategic alliance' between China and Iran. Lucille has written extensively on the topic, see for example, - "Last Among Equals: The China-Iran Partnership in a Regional Context,"- "Solidarity and Strain: China and the Middle...2020-11-2953 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina's Global Power Database: China's Global Power Plant Investments Data at Your Fingertips!China is a leader in global power generation - both through fossil fuel and clean energy technologies. Chinese capital has been involved in establishing at least 777 power plants across the world, providing 186.5 GW of power generation capacity. To track China's impact on global power generation, Boston University's Global China Initiative is launching "China's Global Power Database" which Erik & Juliet discuss with BU's Cecilia Han Springer and Ma Xinyue. This database tracks all the world's power plants financed by Chinese foreign direct investment and/or China's two global policy banks, the China Development Bank and the Export-Import Bank of China...2020-10-2839 minThe Belt and Road PodcastWithout Dreams in Sihanoukville: Chinese and Cambodian Construction Labor StrugglesLabor is a lightning rod for judgments of the benefits of the Belt and Road: Will Chinese projects generate work opportunities for the host country? Do Chinese employers follow different labor standards than others? When and how do workers speak out against poor labor conditions?Ivan Franceschini brings a few new angles to the labor question. He knows the domestic labor situation in China well, and draws connections between the domestic context and what is happening in Cambodia today. In his Cambodia research, he looks not only at Cambodian workers but also Chinese workers in the country...2020-10-1254 minThe Belt and Road PodcastPeople-centered Power: Chinese Knowledge Production, Networks, and Training Programs in Africa - Lina BenabdallahProf. Dr. Lina Benabdallah discusses her latest book, "Shaping the Future of Power: Knowledge production and network-building in China-Africa Relations." Lina looks at China's rise and the Belt and Road beyond the hardware investments - the major infrastructure projects which have been most emphasized. She compares three major types of professionalization interventions: military and security cooperation, media and journalist training, and educational exchanges such as those done through Confucius Institutes. She suggests that these person-to-person engagements in Africa have far reaching impacts and constitute an important angle on Chinese global engagements often less understood and studied. ...2020-09-2154 minThe Belt and Road PodcastGreen Development or Greenwashing? Tyler Harlan on China's Green Finance, Green Energy, and Green CooperationIn this episode, Dr. Tyler Harlan breaks down the discourses vs. reality of the green turn in the Belt and Road Initiative since Xi Jinping announced it in 2017. He describes the state of knowledge and realities of implementation of the three main aspects of the 'Green Belt and Road': green finance, green energy, and green development cooperation. He also reflects on his research on rural development within China and on China's renewable energy investments across the Mekong Region to shed light on specific cases explored. Check out his article, entitled "Green development or greenwashing? A political ecology...2020-08-2744 minThe Belt and Road PodcastHow Chinese Capital Alters Center-Periphery Relations in Kenya - Elisa GambinoHow does Chinese capital alter center-periphery relations in Kenya? Can peripheral groups have meaningful agency with Chinese state entities? Who determines, and what is considered "local" in local content agreements built into Chinese-financed infrastructure projects? On this Episode, Erik sits down Elisa Gambino to speak about her forthcoming paper entitled: "Chinese participation in Kenyan Transport Infrastructure: Reshaping Power-Geometries" that looks to answer these questions and more by using Kenya's Lamu Port as a case study. Elisa Gambino is a doctoral researcher on the African Governance and Space project at the University of...2020-07-3136 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe History of Ethnic Chinese Garment Manufacturing in South Africa - Dr. Xu LiangIn this episode, Juliet and Erik sit down with Dr. Xu Liang from Peking University's School of International Studies to talk about his latest research that chronicles historical and modern-day ethnic Chinese garment production in Newcastle, South Africa. Dr. Xu Liang's latest article "Factory, family and industrial frontier: A Socioeconomic study of Chinese clothing firms in Newcastle, South Africa" can be found here. (link) Thanks for listening! Follow us on BlueSky @beltandroadpod.blsk.social 2020-07-0250 minThe Belt and Road PodcastTurning Off the Tap: Tensions between China and Downstream Neighbors over Dams and DroughtAfter a year of record breaking drought, the Mekong River water has level reached a historical low. Continued water stress, which is likely due to climate change, will permanently change the ecology of the region and water stress is already impacting the lives and livelihoods of millions of people across the region dependent upon the river. Proponents of hydrological dam development along the Mekong, which is primarily done by Chinese developers both in China and in downstream countries (Laos, Thailand, Cambodia and Vietnam), have emphasized the potential for dams to regulate water flow. But recent conditions have raised questions...2020-05-2959 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Complexities of a Chinese Dam Project in Ghana - Dr. Xiao HanOn this episode, Erik speaks with Dr. Xiao Han on her latest work co-authored by Michael Webber - “From Chinese dam building in Africa to the Belt and Road Initiative: Assembling infrastructure projects and their linkages" that was published in the 77th volume of the journal of Political Geography.Dr. Xiao Han is a postdoctoral research fellow at University of Melboure’s Centre for Contemporary Chinese Studies. Recommendations: Dr. Xiao Han: 1. Cooking - COVID has all of us anxious, finding time to cook and bake goods is relaxing Erik: ...2020-05-1438 minThe Belt and Road PodcastTrans-Himalayan Power Corridors: A Grounded Analysis of Nepal/China relations - Dr. Galen MurtonOn this episode, Erik and Juliet speak with Dr. Galen Murton - Assistant Professor at the School of Integrated Sciences at James Madison University - about how China is establishing infrastructure across one of the most unforgiving landscapes in the world. Along the border between Nepal and Tibet, transport and energy infrastructure development are transforming lives and forging a new paradigm of geopolitical engagement between China and its South Asian neighbors. 1) “Trans-Himalayan Power Corridors: Infrastructural Politics and China’s Belt and Road Initiative in Nepal."2) “Facing the Fence: The Production and Performance of a Himalayan Border...2020-04-2244 minThe Belt and Road PodcastConnectivity in the Time of COVID-19: Johan van de Ven on BRI Country ResponsesIn the rapidly evolving context of a world impacted by the novel corona virus, Johan van de Ven discusses travel bans, material aid and donations, and border restrictions between China and Belt and Road Initiative partner countries. He focuses particularly on incidents of anti-Chinese discrimination in Moscow, material assistance to China given by countries from Thailand to Turkey, and stalls in Chinese infrastructural projects abroad. Check out Johan's articles in the Jamestown Foundation's China Brief: - Fair Weather Friends: The Impact of the Coronavirus on the Strategic Partnership between Russia and China?- Limited Payoffs...2020-03-3029 minThe Belt and Road PodcastProtests & Diplomacy in Central Asia: Shifting Roles of China, Russia, and Europe - Oyuna BaldakovaOyuna Baldakova, a PhD Candidate at the Free University of Berlin, shares her research on Chinese investment and Belt and Road developments in Russia (Lake Baikal, Siberia) and Central Asia. She explores how conflicting interests among local elites and domestic political leaders have fueled anti-Chinese sentiments and protests against BRI projects, as well as the implications of China's involvement in Central Asia for European diplomacy in the region. Our discussion is based on her two articles on the MERICS Blog: - Protests along the BRI: China's prestige project meets growing resistance - China's Central Asian...2020-03-1731 minThe Belt and Road PodcastCross-Continental Connections: Disconnects and Mismatches along the China-Europe Freight Train Initiative - Dr. Linda TjiaProf. Dr. Linda Tjia explains the costs and benefits, the links and disconnects, and the domestic and global implications of the China-Europe Freight Train Initiative which connects multiple areas of Western China through Central Asia all the way to Europe. Having worked in the railway sector before her academic career, Linda walks Erik and Juliet through Chongqing business dealings with HP, trade imbalances and "empty return trains" between China and Europe, and the logistical and political challenges of navigating new rail paths through Central Asia. Our conversation is based on Prof. Tjia's recently published article, "The Unintended...2020-02-1437 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina and the Taming of the Mighty Mekong - Brian EylerJuliet discusses the book "Last Days of the Mighty Mekong" with author Brian Eyler, Senior Fellow and Director of The Stimson Center’s Southeast Asia Program. Brian shares insights into the development politics of China's (and other countries') hydropower dam construction, the environmental impacts of dams, and the resulting shifts in the day-to-day reality of lives of communities living in along the river. His book is based on over a decade living and traveling along the Mekong River, and documents a watershed moment of change in one of the most culturally vibrant and biologically important river systems in the wo...2020-01-2540 minThe Belt and Road PodcastStill Outsourcing Coal But Striving for Solar: Chinese Energy Investments in Cambodia - Lili pikeIn this episode, Erik talks with the Robert Wood Johnson Foundation Fellow at NYU Journalism Institute - Lili Pike about China's involvement in Cambodia's energy sector, including an incredible story of a private Chinese furniture manufacturer who bought a closed-down 600MW dirty coal plant from a Chinese SOE and is now moving it piece by piece to Cambodia Read Lili's China Dialogue articles here:1. Coal plant deemed too polluting for China heads to Cambodia2. In Cambodia, solar power surgesLili's Recommendations:1. The Belt and Road Podcast - Courtney Weatherby and Mark G...2020-01-0934 minThe Belt and Road PodcastMore Friends, Fewer Funds Along the BRI - Cecilia Joy-PerezMore and more countries have signed on to China's Belt and Road Initiative, but "the increase in political partners has not led to a comparable increase in commercial activity." Cecilia Joy Perez discusses contracting amounts of capital invested along the BRI despite expanding formal participation, which she attributes to shrinking foreign exchange reserves and shifts in the sectors most actively targeted by BRI investments. Based on Cecilia's recent article, "The Belt and Road Initiative Adds More Partners, But Beijing Has Fewer Dollars to Spend" in The Jamestown Foundation's China Brief.And check out our recommendations...2019-12-1128 minThe Belt and Road PodcastView From the Provinces: How Sub-National Politics Fuel Transnational Networks - Tim SummersBreaking from a dominant focus on national and international scales, Dr. Tim Summers discusses how the Belt and Road works through sub-national institutions, builds upon regional scale development models, and uses provincial trade and political networks within China to expand abroad. Dr. Tim Summers is faculty at the Chinese University of Hong Kong's Centre for China Studies. Check out Tim's articles on the Belt and Road: 1. China’s ‘New Silk Roads’: sub-national regions and networks of global political economy2. The Belt and Road Initiative in Southwest China: responses from Yunnan provinceAnd our re...2019-11-1438 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChinese Investment Through the Eyes of Mozambique's Elites - Lauren BakerOn this episode of the Belt and Road Podcast, Erik Myxter-iino speaks with former MacroPolo Summer Associate Lauren Baker - about her article that looks at differing opinions of governmental and non-governmental elite opinion of Chinese investment in Mozambique. Read Lauren's article "Bridging Perceptions: China in Mozambique " here: https://macropolo.org/analysis/china-mozambique-elite-perceptions/Recommendations: Lauren - The entire MacroPolo website, and subscribe to their newsletter Erik - MacroPolo's Anecdotes video series 2) Decarbonizing the Belt and Road: A Green Financing Roadmap3) The Farewell Thanks for listening!...2019-11-0336 minThe Belt and Road PodcastSoy and Sinophobia: China's Place in Brazilian Agribusiness - Gustavo OliveiraOn episode 19, Dr. Gustavo Oliveira talks about Chinese agribusiness investments in Brazil, the rising importance of the soy trade between the two countries, and the ways domestic and international business interests have fanned the flames of Sinophobia for strategic gains. Dr. Oliveira is a Brazilian scholar and activist and an Assistant Professor of Global & International Studies at University of California, Irvine. Check out Dr. Oliveira's other work on Chinese investments in Brazil and more: http://faculty.sites.uci.edu/oliveira/Thanks for listening! Follow us on BlueSky @beltandroadpod.blsk.social 2019-10-211h 11The Belt and Road PodcastA Tale of Two Railroads: Financing Chinese-Built Trains in Kenya and Ethiopia - Yunnan ChenIn this episode, Erik and Juliet interview Yunnan Chen (PhD candidate at Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies) about two Chinese-built railway projects, one in Kenya and one in Ethiopia. The comparison between the two cases provides reflections on how host countries negotiate over debt funding for infrastructural projects, and the logistical and cultural challenges the developers have faced in getting both projects off the ground. Our discussion draws on Yunnan's recent article in Quartz entitled, "Ethiopia and Kenya are struggling to manage debt for their Chinese-built railways."RecommendationsYunnan"Chinese...2019-09-3034 minThe Belt and Road PodcastPerceptions and Practices of Chinese Hydropower Investment in Vietnam and Myanmar - Nga Dao and Vanessa LambFrom Vietnam to Myanmar, how does criticism of Chinese investment serve local politics, and how does it distract from broader environmental struggles? The Belt and Road Podcast's new co-host Juliet Lu welcomes Vanessa Lamb and Nga Dao to discuss anti-Chinese sentiment in the hydropower sectors of Myanmar and Vietnam, highlighting some key contrasts in the histories of Chinese investment in each country and the challenges of anti-hydropower activism across the Mekong Region. Their Paper: Perceptions and practices of investment: China's hydropower investments in Vietnam and MyanmarRecommendations: Nga: The Last Da...2019-09-1936 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChina’s New Debt Sustainability Framework - Ma XinyueOn episode 16 we introduce our new co-host Juliet Lu! Juliet and Erik speak with China Research and Project Leader at the Global Development Policy Center at Boston University - Ma Xinyue about her latest work on the PandaPaw DragonClaw blog “Assessing China’s Most Comprehensive Response to the “debt trap”: the Belt and Road ‘Debt Sustainability Framework’ https://pandapawdragonclaw.blog/2019/07/17/debt-trap-for-whom/ Recommendations: Ma Xinyue Two Articles from Chen Muyang State Actors, Market Games: Credit Guarantees and the Funding of China Development Bank https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/13563467.2019.1613353?af=R&journalCode=cnpe20Official Aid or Export Credit...2019-09-0327 minThe Belt and Road PodcastHow China is Changing the Development Financing Project Cycle in Latin America - Rebecca RayOn episode 15, Erik Myxter-iino talks with Postdoctoral Fellow at the Global Development and Policy Center at Boston University - Dr. Rebecca Ray Rebecca was one of the co-authors of a new report published in part by BU’s GDP center - China and the Amazon: Toward a Framework for Maximizing Benefits and Mitigating Risks of Infrastructure Development. linkWe talk about how Chinese developmental finance creates a different type of infrastructure project cycle in Latin America and what that means for local governments, civil society organizations, local populations, and the environment Recommendations: ...2019-08-0639 minThe Belt and Road PodcastHow Chinese Capital Alters the Calculation for Coal in Kenya - Michael BoulleOn this episode, Erik speaks with Michael Boulle - Ph.D. Candidate at the University of Cape Town and Senior Researcher at the Cape Town-based consultancy - Change pathways. We discuss his latest paper - The Hazy Rise of Coal in Kenya: The actors, interests, and discursive contradictions shaping Kenya’s electricity future that is featured in Volume 56 of the Energy Research and Social Science Journal.https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2214629618307072Recommendations: Michael: On Being with Krista Tippett - Biny...2019-07-1931 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Challenge of Safeguarding People and the Environment within Chinese Investments - Mark GrimsditchLast month, the international NGO Inclusive Development International released the second version of their Safeguarding People and the Environment in Chinese Investments: A Reference Guide for Advocates. On this episode, I will talk with the lead author of the reference guide - Mark Grimsditch. Mark is the China Global Program Director for Inclusive Development International and has been researching Chinese investments throughout the world for over a decade. We discuss the reference guide, their "following the money" approach and how Chinese firms differ or don't from other countries' firms in building infrastructure and mining internationally. 2019-06-1236 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChinese State-Backed and Flexible Capital in the Philippines - Alvin CambaOn this episode, Erik Myxter-iino has a conversation with Sociology Ph.D. Candidate at Johns Hopkins University Alvin Camba about his soon-to-be-published work - Reexamining China and South-South Relations: Chinese State-backed and Flexible Private Capitals in the Philippines.In it, Alvin analyzes the different types of Chinese capitals and how they interact with different political eras in the Philippines.Recommendations: Alvin - The China Boom: Why China will not rule the World by Ho-fung Hung Erik - Why is the White House Scuttling its Biggest D...2019-05-0329 minThe Belt and Road PodcastKazakhstan and the Belt and Road Initiative - Assel BitabarovaThis week's #beltandroadpod is all about #Kazakhstan - @emyxter spoke with PhD Candidate at Hokkaido University - Assel Bitabarova @BitabarAssel on how Kazakhstan is interacting with the Belt and Road, Chinese financing and construction of Kazakhstani infrastructure, and more.The podcast is based on Assel's latest writing in the Journal of Contemporary East Asian Studies, entitled: Unpacking Sino-Central Asian engagement along the New Silk Road: a case study of Kazakhstan (link) Recommendations:Assel:China's Belt and Road Initiative and its Impact in Central Asia...2019-04-2331 minThe Belt and Road PodcastIs the Belt and Road Initiative a 'Grand Strategy'? with Dr. Lee JonesOn the 10th episode of the Belt and Road Podcast, Erik sits down with Dr. Lee Jones to discuss his latest co-authored work with Zeng Jinghan in Third World Quarterly entitled: "Understanding China's Belt and Road Initiative: Beyond 'grand strategy' to a state transformation analysis". Dr. Lee Jones is a Reader in international politics in the School of Politics and International Relations at Queen Mary, University of London, and a Research Associate at the Asia Research Centre of Murdoch University in Perth, Australia. He specializes in the study of political economy, social conflict...2019-04-0334 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Push and Pull Factors for Chinese Energy Investments in SE Asia with Courtney WeatherbyOn this episode Courtney Weatherby - a research analyst with the Stimson Center’s Southeast Asia and Energy, Water, & Sustainability programs - discusses the different push and pull factors that have made China become involved with nearly a quarter of all energy projects in SE Asia, including an estimated 43% of all coal projects. Furthermore we look at what China and ASEAN countries can do to successfully transition to cheaper and more sustainable wind and solar projects. Podcast based on her article: It's Decision Time for Southeast Asia as Power Demand SoarsRecommendations: 2019-03-2527 minThe Belt and Road PodcastComparing the New Chinese and American Development Finance Agencies w/ Scott Wingo2018 saw the creation of two new high-profile development finance agencies. In China there was the creation of the China International Development Cooperation Agency, and in America the International Finance Development Corporation. On this episode, I speak with UPenn Ph.D. student Scott Wingo about his latest article “Too Much Risk or Not Enough? New Development Finance Agencies in China and the United States” that was featured in the Center for Advanced China Research’s blog. In our discussion, we talk about the domestic political economies that spawned these agencies and their ability or inability to carry ou...2019-03-0433 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChinese 'Land Grabs' in Laos - Juliet LuOn this episode Juliet Lu - Ph.D Candidate in the department of Environmental Science, Policy and Management at UC Berkeley - is on the show to talk about her recent research on Chinese SOE and private firm land investment in Northern Laos. Our discussion stems from her years of extensive fieldwork in Northern Laos talking with Chinese investors, Laotian officials and locals on their experience with land investments. Juliet has published multiple articles on the subject but this episode focuses mainly on her 2017 Journal of Territory, Politics and Governance article co-authored with Oliver Schonweger e...2019-02-1840 min
The Belt and Road PodcastRoad Tripping Along the 'New Silk Road' - Charles StevensOn this episode I interview Charles Stevens, who as part of the New Silk Road Project (www.newsilkroadproject.com) traveled over 10,000 miles on the "Silk Road Economic Belt" in a Jeep. Along the way he interviewed different local and Chinese stakeholders who are building, analyzing and using the new Chinese financed and built infrastructure. If you are looking for more on-the-ground stories of what is happening along the Belt, this episode is for you. Charles' recommendations: 1) China Steps Out: Beijing's Major Power Engagement with the Developing World - edited by Joshua Eisenman and Eric Heginbotham http...2019-01-2927 minThe Belt and Road PodcastThe Challenges to Greening the Belt and Road - A Case Study of Myanmar featuring Nicholas LoOn this episode, Yale School of Forestry and Environmental Studies master student Nicholas Lo talks about his field work that looked at Chinese infrastructure and natural resource investments in Myanmar, and how Chinese capital can bring specific challenges and some potential gains, to creating sustainable development outcomes in the country. This episode is based on Nicholas' article for the Beijing-based NGO Global Environmental Institute http://www.geichina.org/en/challenges-of-greening-the-belt-and-road-myanmar-case-study/Erik's Recommendation:China Challenges Global Governance? The Case of Chinese International Development Finance and the Asian Infrastructure Investment Bank https://www.cha...2019-01-0944 minThe Belt and Road PodcastChinese Infrastructure Building and its Effects on Economic Development - A Case Study in Mozambique featuring Ulrikke WethalThis episode features the dynamic researcher from the Centre for Development and the Environment at the University of Oslo - Ulrikke Wethal The topic of discussion comes from her latest article:Beyond the China Factor: Challenges to backwards linkages in the Mozambican construction sector from the June 2018 edition of the Journal of Modern African Studies Recommendations: Ulrikke: 1) Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies - China-Africa Research Initiative Data 2) Belt and Road Music Video Erik: 1) IIED's new documentary short on Mr. Forest, a Chinese investor who...2018-10-0533 minThe Belt and Road Podcast3: A History of the Hambantota Port in Sri Lanka - The Importance of Chinese State Owned Enterprises and Host Country Elite Politics in the Belt and Road - Xiao'Ou ZhuIn our third episode, I am excited to feature international development consultant Xiao'Ou Zhu. Before every newspaper was using the Hambantota Port as the fearful case of China using "debt diplomacy" Xiao'Ou was doing the on-the-ground fieldwork using China Harbour's Engineering Group's role in the creation of the port as a case showing how important Chinese State Owned Enterprises are in Belt and Road Countries and how many BRI projects are really a bottom-up phenomenon rather than the often reported top-down projects. Recommendations: Xiao'Ou Zhu: Read anything about the 1952 Rice-Rubber Agreement 2018-08-2042 minThe Belt and Road PodcastHow the Western Media Frames the Belt and Road - Tom BaxterOn our second episode Tom Baxter - who works in communications and focuses on the environmental impacts of Belt and Road investments at Greenpeace East Asia in Beijing - talks about his latest article for the blog Panda Paw Dragon Claw “Zooming in, Zooming out: the Frames Through Which Western Media See Belt and Road” https://pandapawdragonclaw.blog/2018/07/27/zooming-in-zooming-out-the-frames-through-which-western-media-see-belt-and-road/ Thanks for listening! Follow us on BlueSky @beltandroadpod.blsk.social 2018-08-0923 min
The Belt and Road PodcastChinese Sports Tourism and the Belt and Road Initiative with Emily WeinsteinOn the inaugural episode of The Belt and Road Podcast, host Erik Myxter-iino brings on Emily Weinstein, a research analyst at Pointe Bellow. Emily talks about her piece featured on the Jamestown Foundation's website "The Belt and Road Initiative: A road to China's World Cup Dreams?" which talks about the BRI and its relation to Sports Tourism and the World CupEmily's Recommendation: The China Soccer Observatory www.nottingham.ac.uk/asiaresearch/p…cso/index.aspxEmily's article: jamestown.org/program/the-belt-a…-world-cup-dreams/Follow the Belt and Road Podcast twitter: @beltandroadpod facebook: www.facebook.com/beltandroadpodThanks for listening! 2018-07-2924 min