Shows
Public Defenseless383 | How Can Texas Solve its Shortage of Rural Public Defender Crisis? w/Scott Ehlers Today, Hunter was joined once again the Texas Indigent Defense Commission Executive Director, Scott Ehlers. This time, Scott and Hunter explore a slow moving crisis in Texas Public Defense: an absolute lack of attorneys in rural parts of the state. As with so many states with large rural areas, attorneys are retiring faster than they can be replaced. Scott and his team at TIDC tried to get more funding from the legislature, but as it stands now, the legislature does not seem to be taking this issue as seriously as they should. So what will happen to public defense...2025-08-121h 02
Public Defenseless376 | How a Law School Clinic is Trying to Prevent Gun Violence Through Litigation w/Megan Walsh and Anthony BenzToday, Hunter was joined by Professor Megan Walsh and Anthony Benz from the University of Minnesota. As we did on Tuesday, Hunter sat down with these two to highlight the work of a law school clinic. This clinic focuses on combating gun violence through both offensive and defensive litigation. Guest Megan Walsh, Director, Gun Violence Prevention Clinic, University of Minnesota Anthon Benz, Student Attorney, University of Minnesota Resources: Contact Megan https://law.umn.edu/course/7408/spring-2023/gun-violence-prevention-clinic/walsh-megan ht...2025-07-171h 06
Public Defenseless371 | The Cruelty Kids Face at the Intersection of Criminal and Immigration Law w/Claire Valentin and Hayley Upshaw Today, Hunter was joined Claire Valentin and Hayley Upshaw to discuss how the intersection of criminal and immigration law impacts kids. So far on the show, Hunter and various guests have explored the “Crimmigration” intersection as it pertains to adults. Now, Hunter, Hayley, and Claire unpack the ways this already cruel system is especially cruel for kid. Guest Hayley Upshaw, Deputy Public Defender, San Francisco Public Defender Officer Claire Valentin, Managing Director of Innovation and Advocacy, Children’s Law Center of Massachusetts Resources: US Citizen Picked U...2025-07-031h 01
Public Defenseless370 | How Public Defenders Can Make a Difference in Immigration Defense w/Ali SaidiToday, Hunter was joined by Ali Saidi, Deputy Public Defender in Contra Costa County, California. On this episode, Hunter and Ali discuss how Public Defenders can have a larger impact in immigration defense by bringing the services to the communities who need them the most. Guest Ali Saidi, Deputy Public Defender, Contra Costa County, California Resources: Contra Costa County Public Defender https://www.cocopublicdefenders.org/ https://www.facebook.com/ContraCostaPublicDefender/ https://www.instagram.com/cocopublicdefenders/ https://x.com/cocodefender Contact Hunter...2025-07-021h 09
Public Defenseless368 | The Fight to Abolish the Death Penalty in Delaware w/Kevin O'Connell Today, Hunter was joined once again by the Chief Public Defender of Delaware, Kevin O’Connell. This time, the two focused on the see-saw history of death penalty abolition in the state of Delaware. It may come as a surprise to many, but Delaware has historically been one of the most prolific death penalty states in America, and today, Kevin and Hunter discuss the politics and policies that kept the death penalty alive and thriving in the state. Finally, they discuss what lessons those interested in death penalty abolition can learn from the meandering path that Delaware took to ge...2025-06-261h 00
Public Defenseless359 | Is There a Better Way to Teach Criminal Law? Part I w/Alice Ristroph Today, Hunter was joined by Professor Alice Ristroph for the first of a two-part focus on how and why we teach Criminal Law the way we do. On today’s episode, Hunter and Alice explore the historical roots of criminal law teaching, critique it, and discuss ways in which we can improve how criminal law is taught to law students. Guest Alice Ristroph, Professor of Law, Brooklyn Law School Resources: Contact Alice Here https://www.brooklaw.edu/contact-us/ristroph-alice/writings/ Read Alice’s Law Re...2025-05-271h 02
Public Defenseless355 | How Missouri Public Defenders are Leading the Nation In Statewide Holistic Defender Services w/Missouri Public Defenders Today, Hunter was joined by a whole host of characters from the Missouri Public Defender System. When Hunter last looked into Missouri Public Defense, he spoke with Annie Legomsky to discuss the remarkable project of implementing Holistic Defense statewide. As one of the only statewide systems with holistic defense, Missouri stands as a great example of how finding creative sources of funding can allow Public Defenders to demonstrate to legislators the potential Public Defense has to improve the community once it has the funding to work outside of the four corners of the court room. Gue...2025-05-151h 29
Public Defenseless354 | With so Many Good Things Happening in Massachusetts, When Will Public Defenders Finally Get They Pay Raises they Deserve? w/Anthony Benedetti Today, Hunter was joined once again by Anthony Benedetti, Chief Counsel of the Massachusetts Committee for Public Counsel Services. This time, Hunter and Anthony dive into what can be done about the low hourly rates for CPCS’s contract counsel and how recent courage from the bench and the state house gives them hope that those pay increases are in fact possible. Guest Anthony Benedetti, Chief Counsel, Massachusetts Committee for Public Counsel Services Resources: CPCS Website https://www.publiccounsel.net/ Listen to my first...2025-05-131h 08
Public Defenseless353 | After 18 Years in Prison, How One Man is Still Fighting to Prove his Innocence w/Ivery Dorsey Today, Hunter was joined by Ivery Dorsey, a man who for the last 18 years was incarcerated for a homicide he did not commit. On a previous episode on the show, Hunter spoke with one of the students, Kerrie Liang, who have been fighting to prove Ivery’s innocence, but today, Ivery joins the show to tell his story. From the representation he received, the conditions of his confinement, and how he hopes to pursue his dreams of shoe design and music production, Ivery's hope for a better future is contagious. Guest Ivery Dorsey, Mus...2025-05-081h 02
Public Defenseless329 | Prosecutorial Reform and the Myth of Individualized Enforcement w/Justin Murray Today, Hunter spoke with Professor Justin Murray about his recent law review article, Prosecutorial Reform and the Myth of Individualized Enforcement. On several past episodes, Hunter has explored the field of Progressive Prosecution. As he has uncovered, much of the push back to these types of prosecutors is their decision not to prosecute certain types of crimes. Today, Justin is here to show how that critique does not comport with the history of prosecution, and he asks us to rethink how we understand how Progressive Prosecution should/does operate in our society. Guest J...2025-02-181h 10
Public Defenseless325 | Is Kansas Public Defense on the Verge of a Crisis? w/Heather Cessna Today, Hunter spoke once again with Heather Cessna, the Executive Director of the Kansas Board of Indigents’ Defense Services. This time, Hunter and Heather discuss how Kansas Public Defense could be close to collapsing due to a lack of lawyers and a legislature that has yet to properly address the issue. Guest Heather Cessna, Executive Director, Kansas Board of Indigents’ Defense Services Resources: Contact KBDIS https://www.ksbids.gov/ Contact Heather hcessna@sbids.org Rural Justice Report ...2025-02-041h 10
Public Defenseless305 | How Prosecutors Might get Rewarded for Messing Up the Harvey Weinstein Case w/Amanda Jack Today, Hunter is joined by Amanda Jack of the New York Legal Aid Society. Today, Amanda and Hunter are discussing the Harvey Weinstein trial. Specifically, they are discussing why the conviction was overturned, why the New York legislature is trying to change the rules of evidence, and why it’s a terrible idea for them to do it. Guests: Amanda Jack, Policy Director Criminal Practice, NY Legal Aid Society Resources: Follow Amanda on Twitter https://x.com/brooklynpd Federal Rule of Evidence 413 and Harv...2024-11-271h 13
Public Defenseless304 | One Step Forward and Two Steps Back Mississippi Public Defense w/Andre de Gruy Today, Hunter is joined once again by Andre de Gruy, Chief Public Defender of Mississippi. The last time Andre was on the show, he and Hunter discussed some positive changes he was hoping to get out of the 2024 legislative session. While not everything from the last episode came to pass, Andre believes Mississippi public defense is ever so slowly improving. Guests: Andre de Gruy, State Public Defender, Mississippi Resources: OSPD Website https://www.ospd.ms.gov/ Marshall Project Mississippi https://www.th...2024-11-2658 min
Public Defenseless303 | How A.I. Can Help Public Defenders Challenge Police and Prosecutors Part 2 w/Prabhas Pokharel Today, Hunter is joined be the Co-Founder of Reduct, Prabhas Pokharel. Building from Tuesday’s conversation about tech, AI, and Public Defense, Hunter and Prabhas explore the ways AI and Reduct can help Public Defenders take on Police and Prosecutors. Guests: Prabhas Pokharel, Co-Founder, Reduct Resources: Reduct Website, Socials, and Contact https://reduct.video/ https://x.com/ReductVideo prabhas@reduct.video Standford Legal AI Study https://www.lawnext.com/2024/06/in-redo-of-its-study-stanford-finds-westlaws-ai-hallucinates-at-double-the-rate-of-lexisnexis.html https://hai.stanfo...2024-11-211h 03Public Defenseless302 | How A.I. is Helping Police and Prosecutors Surveil, Arrest, and Incarcerate People w/Andrew Ferguson Today, Hunter is joined once again by Professor Andrew Ferguson. Last time Andrew was on the show, he and Hunter discussed the state of the 4th Amendment in the digital era. This time, Hunter and Andrew dive into three law review articles Andrew has recently published. The first discussed a new framework for analyzing the 4th Amendment. The second and third articles are all about new, dangerous was police and prosecutors are relying on AI. Guests: Andrew Ferguson, Professor of Law, American University Washington College of Law Resources: ...2024-11-201h 19Public Defenseless299 | How NAPD is Fostering a National Forum for Public Defense Innovations w/Jeff Sherr Today, Hunter is joined once again by NAPD’s Jeff Sherr. This time, they sat down to discuss NAPD’s new Change Maker Forum, what Hunter learned from attending, and how NAPD hopes to use it to spark new, impactful changes in Public Defense. Guests: Jeff Sherr, Director of Training, National Association of Public Defense Resources: NAPD Changemaker Forum 2025 https://publicdefenders.us/event/the-changemakers-forum-napd-strategic-exchange-3/ Notes from 2024 https://publicdefenders.us/blogs/napd-changemakers-forum-tackles-public-defense-challenges/ Contact Hunter Parnell:2024-11-1337 min
Public Defenseless298 |What the History of ULCA’s Police Department Tells Us About the Issues with Campus Police w/Andrew Guerrero Today, Hunter is joined by Ph.D. candidate and law student Andrew Gurrero to discuss his research about the evolution of the UCLA police department. In this episode, Hunter and Andrew explore the origins of the department and the forces that drove the department away from its original mandate. Guests: Andrew Gurrero, Ph.D Candidate, Harvard Resources: Read Sources Discussed in the Episode Here https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/12_jIy21jUCsPS4qEqSAMjxxvx1Tlce6r?usp=sharing Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com2024-11-1246 min
Public Defenseless276 | The Highest Law in the Land: How the Unchecked Power of Sheriffs Threatens Democracy w/Jessica Pishko Today, Hunter is joined by Jessica Pishko to discuss her new book The Highest Law in the Land: How the Unchecked Power of Sheriffs Threatens Democracy. So far on the show, Hunter has spent a lot of time discussing the corruption and abuses of police and prosecutors, but the show has not spent much time discussing the issues of sheriffs. Thanks to years of incredible investigative journalism, Jessica provides an in depth and distributing account for how sheriffs around the country are posing a threat to civil liberties and our systems of checks and balances. G...2024-09-171h 13
Public Defenseless275 | How NACDL is Helping Public and Private Defenders Fight Back Against New Oppressive Policies w/Lisa Wayne Today, Hunter is joined by Lisa Wayne, the Executive Director of the National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers. In this episode, Lisa and Hunter discuss how NACDL is trying to help give Public and Private Defenders the tools, skills, and policies they need to fight for their clients in and out of the court room. Guests: Lisa Wayne, Executive Director, National Association of Criminal Defense Lawyers Resources: Trial Penalty https://www.nacdl.org/Landing/TheTrialPenalty NACDL https://www.nacdl.org...2024-09-1259 min
Public Defenseless274 | Between 46%-99% of Colorado Public Defenders are Overworked. Why is the State Waiting Two Years for Workload Standards w/James Hardy and Kayleigh TenBarge Today, Hunter is by two Colorado State Public Defenders, James Hardy and Kayleigh TenBarge. When this episode was first recorded, James, Kayleigh, and Hunter were primarily focused on a piece of legislation that the Defenders Union of Colorado attempted and failed to get through the state house. That bill sought to get workload standards in place in Colorado by mid-2025. After recording that segment, an audit of the Colorado State Public Defender dropped, and revealed that at least 46% and maybe as many as 99% of Public Defenders in Colorado are exceeding workloads. Considering that, OSPD has stated they will get...2024-09-101h 39Public Defenseless270 | What Was Happening in Grants Pass, Oregon Before the Supreme Court OK'd Criminalizing Homelessness w/Jeremiah Hayden Today, Hunter is joined by journalist Jeremiah Hayden. Over the past several months, Jeremiah has been covering the reality for homeless people in Grants Pass, Oregon. If you are familiar with that town, it is likely because it was the town at the center of the recent Supreme Court case saying it was okay to criminalize homeless people. Instead of diving into the decision, Jeremiah is here to help people understand what it was like for a homeless person living in the town and what will happen now that their very existence can be criminalized. a...2024-08-291h 16
Public Defenseless266 | With a Conservative Supreme Court, Do State Courts Offer the Best Path for a Better Criminal Legal System? w/Kathrina (Kasia) Szymborski Wolfkot Today, Hunter is joined by Kathrina “Kasia” Szymborski Wolfkot from the Brennan Center for Justice. On today’s episode, Hunter and Kasia explore a rare area for hope on the show: State Courts. While much of the focus of teaching and discussion about our legal system starts and ends with the Supreme Court, state courts offer a path to meaningful, major changes to our criminal and constitutional legal systems. Guests: Kathrina (Kasia) Szymborski Wolfkot, Senior Counsel, Brenan Center for Justice, Managing Editor of the State Court Report Resources: Commonw...2024-08-201h 06
Public Defenseless265 | The Problems with Public Defense in Guam w/Aditi Goel Today, Hunter is joined by the Sixth Amendment Center’s Deputy Director Aditi Goel. This time, Hunter and Aditi the Sixth Amendment Center’s newest report on the state of Public Defense on the island of Guam. Relative to Public Defense systems in the continental United States, Guam’s Public Defender system is in its infancy, but the problems are familiar. Lack of independence, lack of lawyers, and an Attorney General who thinks better Public Defense=more crime all create a system that is in desperate need of help. Fortunately, the Public Defender Community on the island are deeply committ...2024-08-151h 09Public Defenseless258 | What Actually Happened to Minnesota's Legal and Public Defender System After the Murder of George Floyd w/Bill Ward Today, Hunter kicks off a week about Public Defense in Minnesota by speaking with the Chief Public Defender of the State, Bill Ward. Throughout this episode, Bill and Hunter discuss workloads, workload refusal, the recent budgetary victories he’s helped secure, and what is needed to ensure Public Defenders in Minnesota are not drowning in cases. Guests: Bill Ward, Chief Public Defender, Minnesota Resources: Minnesota Public Defender Website https://www.pubdef.state.mn.us/ Minnesota Public Defender Twitter https://x.com...2024-07-231h 06Public Defenseless255 | The Dangers of a Conviction Based on the Testimony of One Person w/Eric Tindal Today, Hunter is joined by Eric Tindal, a criminal defense attorney in Iowa. Today’s discussion focuses on the question, how much evidence does it take to convict someone. Specifically, Hunter and Eric discussed how a single uncorroborated testimony can be sufficient to secure a conviction. This episode kicks off a miniseries comparing what evidence is perfectly fine for prosecutors to rely on and what evidence is barred from even being heard when the defense wants to use it. Guests: Eric Tindal, Criminal Defense Attorney, Iowa Re...2024-07-1657 min
Public Defenseless244 | Grant Miller: The Utah Public Defender Campaigning to Bring Big Changes to the Utah State Legislature Today, Hunter sat down with Grant Miller a Utah Public Defender running for Utah House District 24. Throughout the course of the show, Hunter and numerous guests have discussed the importance of getting the public defender experience into legislatures around the country. Part of the reason our laws are so skewed towards police and prosecutors is because police and prosecutors drastically outnumber the public defenders in the legislature. Grant aims to change that with a campaign that revolves around injecting the humanity that public defenders use in their daily fights for their clients. Guests: G...2024-06-131h 15
Public Defenseless242 | Eve Primus: The Hollowing Out of Miranda Rights, and What we Can Do About it Today, Hunter is joined once again by University of Michigan Professor of Law Eve Primus. So far, Eve and Hunter have discussed Public Defender Systems, Structures, and how Law Schools can do better at getting students interested in Public Defense. However, today’s conversation is focused on her upcoming law review article about how courts around the country have eroded the famous Miranda warnings and what we can do about it. Guests: Eve Primus, Professor of Law, University of Michigan Resources: The State...2024-06-061h 12Public Defenseless238 | Patricia Warth: The Budget Moves Threatening Vital New York Public Defender Services Today, Hunter is joined once again by Patricia Warth, Director of the NY Office of Indigent Legal Services. This time, Hunter and Patricia discuss the in the weeds budget moves that are threatening vital programs in New York Public Defense. Specifically, they talk about the failing family court system and how a sweep up of funds may endanger an already struggling practice. Guests: Patricia Warth, Director, New York Office of Indigent Legal Services Resources: Coverage of the Fund Sweep Up https://brooklyneagle.com/art...2024-05-231h 06Public Defenseless234 | Stephen Hanlon: Case Withdrawals, Federal Funding, and the Five Year Plan to Fix Public Defense in Oregon Today, Hunter is joined once again by Public Interest lawyer Stephen Hanlon. This time, Hunter and Stephen are breaking down the five year plan that he hopes will fix Public Defense in Oregon. While it is surely an ambitious plan, this plan gives urges public defenders to do all that they can to force the powers that be to take the crisis seriously: case withdrawals. Guests: Stephen Hanlon, Public Interest Lawyer Resources: Oregon Report 5 Year Plan https://www.opb.org/article/2024/03/21/oregon-public-defense-report-more-attorneys/ Contact Hunter Parnell: Publicdefenseless@gmail.com ...2024-05-091h 02Public Defenseless231 | Dorsey Nunn: From Banning the Box to Restoring the Right to Vote, One Man's Struggle for the Rights of the Current and Formerly Incarcerated Today, Hunter is joined by the powerful Dorsey Nunn. At 19, Dorsey was given a life sentence. Over the next 11 years, Dorsey would be exposed to violence, abuse, and the political education that would awaken in him a lifelong desire to fight our prison system. Today, Hunter talks with Dorsey about his new book, What Kind of Bird Can’t Fly to discuss his lifetime of organizing for the rights of the current and formerly incarcerated. Guests: Dorsey Nunn, Executive Director Legal Services for Prisoners with Children, Co-Founder All of Us or None, Co-Founder Forme...2024-04-301h 01
Public Defenseless222: The Case for Decriminalizing Domestic Violence w/Leigh Goodmark Today, Hunter starts on part one of a three-part series on criminalized survivors of domestic violence. Kicking off this miniseries is Professor Leigh Goodmark. A former Public Defender herself, Leigh brings multiple decades of experience working with and writing about criminalized domestic violence survivors. On today’s episode, Hunter and Leigh primarily discuss her journey to abolition, decriminalization, and the stories/data that made her conclude that the carceral system is not the appropriate response for domestic violence. Guests: Leigh Goodmark, Professor of Law and Director of Gender Prison and Trauma Clin...2024-04-021h 13Public Defenseless217: Securing Life over Death in the Aurora Theater Shooting Case w/Doug Wilson Today, Hunter sat down once again with the former Chief Public Defender of Colorado, Doug Wilson. This time, Doug and Hunter discuss the Aurora Theater Shooting case. Just like the episode about the Parkland shooting, today’s episode is designed to help people understand how such a heinous crime could end in a life over death sentence. In examining these cases, hopefully people can understand the power of mitigating evidence and a well- funded criminal defense team can have on a criminal case. Guests: Doug Wilson, Former Chief Public Defender of the State of...2024-03-141h 23Public Defenseless215: As States Criminalize LGBTQ+ People, How can Lawyers Fight Back? w/Richard Saenz In just this past year, there have been over 400 anti-LGBTQ+ bills proposed in state houses around the country. Many have no hope of passing, but some will end up creating new was to criminalize and ostracize already vulnerable members of the LGBTQ+ community. Joining Hunter today to talk about these laws and their impacts is Richard Saenz from Lambda Legal. Throughout this conversation, Richard and Hunter explore the many ways our legal system disregards the unique needs of LGBTQ+ folks being processed through it. Most importantly though, Richard lays out key ways that the legal community can help to...2024-03-071h 09Public Defenseless199: The Incredible Success of Missouri's Holistic Public Defense Program w/Annie LegomskyToday, Hunter spoke with Annie Legomsky, the Holistic Defense Service leader for the Missouri State Public Defender. On this episode, Hunter and Annie discuss the incredible success stories from the implementation of a state wide holistic defense practice. For many, holistic defense seems like a great idea, but they feel they cannot muster the resources to make it happen. This story is an excellent example of the ways an office can creatively find the money to make holistic defense possible Guest: Annie Legomsky, Holistic Defense Services, Missouri State Public Defender 2024-01-1658 min
Public Defenseless183: After Serious Positive Overhauls, What is Next For Delaware Public Defense? w/Kevin O'Connell Today, Hunter is once again joined by Delaware Chief Public Defender, Kevin O’Connell. Last time, Kevin came on to discuss the uniquely terrible Delaware Law Enforcement Bill of Rights. This time, Hunter and Kevin did a deeper dive into the past, present, and future of Public Defense in the state of Delaware. Of all the important parts of this episode, the journey taken by Delaware Public Defense following their Sixth Amendment Center report is strong evidence that meaningful change is possible! Guests: Kevin O’Connell, Chief Public Defender, Delaware 2023-11-141h 06
Public DefenselessBONUS: A New Database Providing Public Defenders the Latest Social Science Data for Court w/Eve Primus Part of the goals of this show is to remind Public Defenders that they are not alone in their fight. There is a massive network across the nation of people from all walks of life fighting both in and out of the court room to try and make a more just legal system. Today, Hunter is once again joined by University of Michigan Professor of Law Eve Primus. This time, Hunter and Eve are talking about the MDefenders latest program, the Data for Defenders. This new tool from the University of Michigan is designed to provide Defenders with motions...2023-09-2539 min
Public Defenseless159: The Communication Breakdown Eroding Trust in the Colorado Public Defender System w/Kiyomi Bolick, Mike Kubicek, and Oliver Rose Katz Last year, Hunter spoke with members of the newly formed Defenders Union of Colorado (DUC) to discuss their reason for unionization and the challenges facing all employees of Colorado Public Defense. Today, Hunter is once again speaking with DUC, but this time, they discussed the complete failure of leadership to be transparent with them and how that is eroding trust between the two. Guests: Kiyomi Bolick, Long Time Colorado Public Defender and a Founding Organizer of DUC Mike Kubicek, Investigator, Durango Office of the Public Defender Oliver Rose Katz, A...2023-09-081h 29
Public Defenseless141: The Horrifying Surveillance Tech Coming to a Neighborhood Near You w/Dhruv Mehrotra With every passing day, a new technology becomes available for police, prosecutors and the state to further side step the Fourth Amendment. On today’s show, Hunter sat down with Dhruv Mehrotra, staff writer for Wired Magazine, to discuss the latest horrifying surveillance tech coming to a jurisdiction near you. Covenant Eyes started out as a way for couples and churches to “help” people fight they perceived to be an addiction to porn, but from the very beginning the obvious potential for abuse was on full display. Join Hunter and Dhruv as they unpack the story of how an...2023-07-2847 minPublic Defenseless131: How to Solve the Public Defender Shortage in Rural America w/Patrick Crowley, Michael Naughton and Jonathan Sacks Today, Hunter spoke with Patrick Crowley, Michael Naughton and Jonathan Sacks to talk through the attorney shortage crisis in rural America and what we can do to reverse the trend. While today’s episode focuses a lot on what is happening in rural Michigan, make no mistake, this is a problem facing nearly every state in the country. As rural, small town America has declined over the past decades, it has become harder and harder to entice young public defenders, laden with outrageous student debt, to want to practice in the rural parts of a state. So what can be...2023-06-271h 35
Public Defenseless128: Fostering the Public Voice of the Public Defender w/Kay Levine and Russell Gold Today, Hunter spoke with two law professors, Kay Levine and Russell Gold, to discuss their law review article calling for an increase in the public advocacy of public defenders. As a natural extension of the main goals of the show, Hunter loved exploring the potential political power public defenders could wield if they were more vocal. Interestingly as well, both Kay and Russell offered important juxtapositions between public defenders, prosecutors, and corporate attorneys and the way each engages with public advocacy out of the court room. Guests: Kay Levine, Professor of Law, Emory La...2023-06-151h 16Public Defenseless125: You Might Go to Prison Even Though You're Innocent w/Justin Brooks On previous episodes, Hunter spoke with Chris Fabricant and Daniel Medwed to discuss various aspects of the innocence movement. With Chris, they discussed the type of junk science that contributes to wrongful convictions. With Daniel, the discussed the unnecessary legal processes and hurdles that stand in the way of getting people out of prison once they are there. Today, Hunter sat down with another lawyer, author, and leader in the innocence movement, Justin Brooks, to discuss the many other things that contribute to sending people wrongfully to prison. As the founder and director of the California Innocence Project, Justin...2023-06-061h 05Public Defenseless114: How A Coalition of Prosecutors, City Attorneys, and Public Defenders Produces Better Working Conditions w/Alexandra Pray Today, Hunter sat down with Alexandra Pray, Deputy Public Defender in San Francisco and Board Member of the Public Defender Union, to discuss the unique arrangement the City Attorneys, Prosecutors, and Public Defenders have in SF. When we’ve discussed Public Defense Unions, we ordinarily hear about coalitions of Public Defenders and sometimes all staff members coming together to advocate for better conditions, better workloads, and better pay, but in San Francisco, Public Defenders have a strange ally in the fight for better working conditions. In what may better be described as a collective bargaining agreement, the City Attorneys, Pr...2023-05-021h 07Public Defenseless113: A Broken Legal System, A Lack of Health Care, and How the US Keeps Puerto Rico Under its Thumb w/Diego Alcala Today, Hunter spoke with Diego Alcala, a criminal defense attorney in Puerto Rico, to better understand the challenges the island faces in the criminal legal system. From years of experience as a criminal defense attorney in Puerto Rico and other parts of the United States, Diego cuts through the complicated legal layers to get at a core issue plaguing Puerto Rico: For more than a century, the island has been subjected to the whims of the United States, and the lack of self-determination, access to health care, and continued imposition of the United States’ will serves as a severe de...2023-04-271h 04Public Defenseless112: How Mitigation Confronts the Biases of Jurors, Judges, Prosecutors, and Public Defenders w/Victoria Rusk “Well I grew up poor and I didn’t go off committing crimes!” Arguably, this is the most common response those that work in the field of mitigation hear when they are trying to explain what mitigation is. To tackle this question and discuss take another look at the importance of non-capital mitigation, Hunter spoke with Victoria Rusk. She is a mitigation expert, author, and founder of Mitigation University and Heart of Justice, and on today’s episode, Victoria and Hunter take another deep dive at trying to understand the best way to confront the biases that jurors, judges, prosecut...2023-04-2559 minPublic Defenseless111: A New Path for Public Safety in San Francisco w/Mano Raju If you spend anytime watching news in the past 3 years, you have likely heard about San Francisco. Normally, that conversation revolves around the state of public safety in the city, and often, it is presented from the perspective of progressive prosecution. Today, Hunter had on Mano Raju, Chief Public Defender of the San Francisco, to give a different perspective on the path forward for public safety in the city. As an elected official, Mano is uniquely situated to speak with community leaders and organizers to explain why a reversion to the tough on crime era is not best for...2023-04-201h 31Public Defenseless109: What are a Lawyer's Ethical Obligations to Society? w/David Siegel Today, Hunter spoke with David Siegel, Professor of Law and Director of the Center for Law and Social Responsibility at New England Law, to discuss the ethical and social obligations of attorneys. Specifically, Hunter and David unpack the ways in which law schools are failing to educate and equip future lawyers with an understanding of a practical understanding of the law. Law school does a wonderful job of teaching students the theory of the law, but in failing to show the ways the theory falls short of the practice of law, students can graduate without an understanding of the...2023-04-131h 09Public Defenseless105: Why it is so Difficult to Get the Innocent out of Prison w/Daniel Medwed In theory, the criminal legal system is designed to find the truth of a matter. In reality, the legal system has been sometimes intentionally and sometimes unintentionally constructed to be as efficient as possible while maintaining its institutional integrity. From plea deals to Executive Clemency, the legal system is often cruelly efficient at convicting the innocent and keeping the innocent looked in prison for decades. Why is that? Today, Hunter sat down with Professor of Law, Daniel Medwed, to discuss his book Barred: Why the Innocent Can't Get Out of Prison to answer th...2023-03-301h 06Public Defenseless101: Reflecting on Gideon v Wainwright, the Past, Present and Future of Public Defense w/Justine Olderman and Wes Caines 60 years ago, Clarence Gideon changed the legal landscape of America forever. Thanks to his self-written petition to the Supreme Court, it was finally recognized at the federal level that any person charged with a felony who cannot afford to hire was entitled to one under the 6th Amendment. Soon, that right would be extended to a person facing any possibility of confinement, and thus, our modern understanding of Public Defense was born. On today’s episode, Hunter spoke with to members of the Bronx defenders to reflect on the legacy of Gideon. Justine Olderman, Executive Dir...2023-03-171h 18Public Defenseless100: Do Sex Offender Registries Make Us Safer? w/David Garlock Today, Hunter spoke with David Garlock, a formerly incarcerated and current criminal justice reformer, to discuss how David’s journey from victim, to prison, to life after prison has landed him advocating to end sex offender registries. As a child, David endured nearly a decade of child sexual abuse. Eventually, he and his brother sought revenge against the man who committed the acts, and they made the decision to murder that man. David and his brother would go on to be convicted of murder and spend a decade locked away in an Alabama prison. Following his prison time, David be...2023-03-161h 08Public Defenseless99: There is no Public Defense Without Investigators w/Jon Lyon On today’s episode, Hunter spoke with Jon Lyon, the Investigator Resource Coordinator for the National Association for Public Defense, to talk all things investigator related. As Public Defense is focused on the practice of law, it makes sense that most of our conversations are lawyer centric, but part of the role of this show and of the NAPD is to remind everyone involved in Public Defense that it takes an entire team of people to represent someone. You may be the best lawyer on Earth, but if there is no one to assist you in collecting evidence, interviewing wi...2023-03-141h 14Public Defenseless94: Where Will Maryland Public Defense Go With A New Chief Public Defender w/Natasha Dartigue Today, Hunter spoke with the newest Chief Public Defender for the State of Maryland, Natasha Dartigue. Throughout her career, Natasha worked in every imaginable part of the Maryland Public Defender system. As such, she is acutely aware of the strength, weaknesses, and challenges she will face as she leads the office into the next decade. As with all of the conversations we have with leaders of a state wide Public Defense system, Natasha brings with her a vision for a safer, more vibrant community through the revitalization of public defense in the state of Maryland. ...2023-02-231h 04Public Defenseless91: If Iowa Public Defense is About to Collapse, What is Happening in Juvenile and Immigration Defense w/Rachel Antonuccio and Julia ZalenskiWhile the main focus of the podcast is the representation that adults receive in felony and misdemeanor cases, there are countless other areas of law where indigent people need the help of attorneys. There are few states capable of providing the resources and care necessary to create a functioning public defense system for adult representation, so we shouldn’t be surprised when things like Juvenile and Immigration representation fall to the wayside. Iowa is no exception. Recently, the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court stated Public Defense in Iowa was on the verge of collapse. If that’s the case...2023-02-141h 11Public Defenseless88: The Most Important Public Defense Victories Don't Happen in the Court Room w/Sam Allison NataleWhen we think of zealous Public Defense, we often think of triumphant victories in the court room, but today’s guest wants Public Defenders to realize their greatest victories must come outside of the court room. Joining Hunter today once again is Sam Allison-Natale. He is the Executive Director of the Kansas Holistic Defenders, the only holistic public defender office in the state of Kansas dedicated to representing only misdemeanor clients. Unlike most states, the Kansas Public Defender system provides representation only to those accused of felony crimes. So, when Sam moved with his family fro...2023-02-021h 06Public Defenseless87: How to Make the Case for Public Defense in a Conservative State w/Diane LozanoToday, Hunter spoke with Diane Lozano, the Wyoming State Public Defender, to discuss how she’s been able to secure support for Public Defense in the challenge political landscape of Wyoming. With more than a decade at the helm of the state’s public defender system, Diane’s use of data and public advocacy has allowed her to maintain support through multiple state Congresses and Gubernatorial administrations. Despite the turmoil that comes with changing faces of a constantly rotating political body, Diane found a way to build the necessary relationships and compile the necessary data to make convincingly and consis...2023-01-311h 11Public Defenseless85: The Challenges Public Defense Faces in Rural Georgia w/Michael SmithToday on the show, Hunter spoke with Michael Smith, an Assistant Public Defender in Chattooga County, Georgia, to talk about the unique challenges he faces as a rural public defender. After college and law school took him away from his home in Chattooga, County, Michael Smith returned home with a new found understanding of the inequities his community faced. As the only public defender in the county, Michael is responsible for ensuring the rights of every person in the county are protected. As if that burden was not enough, the county, like so ma...2023-01-241h 01Public Defenseless84: How Anne Arundel County, MD Prosecutors Over Incarcerate the Community w/Felipe Gonzalez Over the last year of Public Defenseless, Hunter spent a lot of time speaking with Chief Public Defenders from commissions and state-wide offices around the country. This top down view of Public Defense is extremely valuable and will be something that you hear more of on the show, but Hunter also realized he neglected to get the voices of line public defenders on the show. Over the course of the year, more episodes with line public defenders, like the one today, will be coming your way! Today, Hunter spoke with Felipe Gonzalez, a fel...2023-01-1958 minPublic Defenseless82: The Tech NonProfit Accelerating People Out of the U.S. Justice System w/Serena ChangAcross the country, outdated and disconnected data systems keep thousands of people stuck in prison or on community supervision long after they should technically be free. Today, Hunter spoke with Serena Chang, a product manager at Recidiviz, a tech nonprofit working to solve this problem and make the criminal justice system fairer, smaller, and more effective. As discussed in the episode with Jason Tashea, the legal system is slow to incorporate new technology. Yet for States and organizations around the country, it’s becoming obvious they can no longer operate a legal system based on ind...2023-01-121h 00Public Defenseless81: How to Craft Ethical Tech Solutions to the Many Issues with the Legal System w/Jason TasheaOn this episode, Hunter spoke with Jason Tashea to discuss the exciting intersection of tech and the legal system. As the Director and Co-Founder of the Georgetown Judicial Innovation Fellowship, Jason is constantly thinking about ways to ethically integrate technology into the legal world. As an institution predicated on tradition, precedent, and intentionally inefficient legal protections, the legal profession has been incredibly slow to adopt the forward thinking, efficiency mindset so prevalent in the tech world. It is the juxtaposition of the two that sits at the center of today’s conversation. How do w...2023-01-101h 04Public Defenseless80: Staff Assaults, A Decade in Solitary, and the Many Horrors of Massachusetts' Prisons w/Elizabeth MatosFrom the denial of basic healthcare needs to decades in solitary confinement, prisoners stuck in the Massachusetts prison system face near daily deprivation of basic human and Constitutional rights. Today, Hunter spoke with Elizabeth Matos to understand how her organization, Prisoners' Legal Services of Massachusetts, challenges this system of relentless brutality. Guest: Elizabeth Matos, Executive Director, Prisoners' Legal Services of Massachusetts Key Topics: How Lizz’s family history got her into this line of work [6:55] The problems in Massachusetts’ Prisons [10:09] Are th...2023-01-051h 16Public Defenseless77: The Fallout of the Dobbs Decision on Louisiana Reproductive Healthcare w/Gwyneth O'Neill, Ellie Schilling and Michelle ErenbergSince its inception, Supreme Court decisions play a terrifying role in controlling the lives of Americans. Few decisions in living memory now play a greater role than the overturning of Roe v Wade. To understand the impacts of Dobbs v Jackson, Hunter is joined by three guests from the state of Louisiana. Gwyneth O’Neill is an associate at the law firm Schonekas, Evans, McGoey and McEachin. Ellie Schilling is a partner at the same law firm and serves on the board of the non-profit LIFT Louisiana that Michelle Erenberg is the co-Executive Dire...2022-12-212h 05Public DefenselessTrying to Keep Public Defense in North Dakota from Collapsing w/Travis FinckRight now, a three-attorney public defender office in North Dakota has zero attorneys on staff. And with public defender turnover rates on the rise, the state makes it difficult to provide legal representation for all. In this episode, Hunter speaks with Travis Finck, the Executive Director of The Commission on Legal Counsel for Indigents (CLCI). He brings with him an infectious optimism and deep knowledge of North Dakota public defense. The first half of the episode will teach you all about the formation of the public defense system in North Dakota an...2022-12-161h 02Public Defenseless75: Opioids, Addiction, and the Alabama Despair Machine w/Leah Nelson and Stacey FullerFor many, the hearing about the opioid epidemic invokes images deindustrialized towns in West Virginia and Kentucky, but it was actually Alabama with the highest rate of per capita prescription. Today on the show, Hunter Spoke with Leah Nelson, Research Director at Alabama Appleseed, and Stacey Fuller, a Certified Recovery Support Specialist, to discuss the impacts of opioids and addiction in the state of Alabama. As with most states, Alabama approached addiction not as a illness to be treated, but as a wrong to be punished. For deca...2022-12-141h 07Public Defenseless73: How a Sixth Amendment Center Report Sparked Change in Utah Public Defense w/Richard MauroToday, Hunter spoke with Richard Mauro, Executive Director of the Salt Lake City Legal Defender Association, to talk all things Utah Public Defense. Not even a decade ago, Utah and Pennsylvania stood as the last two states who provided exactly zero dollars towards Public Defense. As expected, this created a patchwork system in the state that left places like Utah and Salt Lake County able to afford full time public defense offices while the more rural areas of the state were forced to rely on the cheapest flat rate contract imaginable. As...2022-12-071h 05Public Defenseless72: Why it is Time to End Life Sentences w/Alexandra Bailey and Nazgol GhandnooshMost people believe that life sentences keep people safe, but the evidence actually points to the opposite. In fact, life sentences were never originally designed to last for life. In this episode, Hunter speaks with two individuals from the Sentencing Project: Campaign Strategist to End Life Imprisonment Alexandra Bailey and Senior Research Analyst Nazgol Ghandnoosh. They will share evidence to support their claim that safer communities can be created without harsh sentencing. Then, they’ll explain ways that life imprisonment and mandatory minimum negatively affect both families and the criminal system as a w...2022-12-021h 03Public Defenseless70: Challenging America's Punishment Bureaucracy w/Alec KarakatsanisToday, Hunter spoke with Alec Karakatsanis, Founder and Executive Director of Civil Rights Corps, for a discussion about dismantling America’s punishment bureaucracy. With his work at Civil Rights Corps, Alec brought to light the immense human suffering caused by the punishment bureaucracy by highlighting the stories of people caught in it and then pushing massive class action lawsuits. This model of story collecting, storytelling, and then systemic challenges is one the Alec hopes public defender offices around the country will replicate as the success his organization gets in challenging cash bail becomes more widespread....2022-11-2539 minPublic Defenseless68: Why do we Punish People? w/Kaelen PerrochetWhy do we punish people? What are the goals of punishment and the legal system? At some point in time, we stopped asking ourselves these questions and it led to a legal system that is disjointed, inconsistent, and unnecessarily cruel. Today, Hunter spoke with Kaelen Perrochet, a Law Student at UCLA Law School, to dig through some of the philosophical underpinnings of any criminal legal system. For many, people will say that we punish people because it is what they deserve, but what should our legal system look like if...2022-11-211h 03Public DefenselessManaged Assigned Counsel: A Savvy Solution or a Simple Stop Gap? w/Jim BethkeCan a managed assigned council system be a workable solution to indigent defense problems? Jim Bethke is the former executive director of the Texas Indigent Defense Commission and the current director of the Managed Assigned Counsel Office in San Antonio. In this episode, he talks about the system that he helped create and the areas he thinks still need work. There are three main types of indigent defense representation delivery models: full-time public defender, office contract counsel, and assigned counsel. Texas relies heavily on assigned council, and there are both pros and...2022-11-181h 08Public Defenseless66: Is Incrementalism Enough to Fix the Criminal Legal System w/Jeff BlackburnCan people incarcerated afford to wait for small, gradual change? What happens to the people incarcerated if the system breaks? What is the right balance between the needs of the current case vs the needs of the future case? How do Public Defenders counter the decades long strategy of the Conservative legal movement with their own strategy? All these questions, and more, are pondered by Hunter and his guest today, Jeff Blackburn. During his career, Jeff worked as a criminal defense attorney, impact litigation lawyer and helped to found and operate the Texas Innocence Project. Through it...2022-11-161h 17Public Defenseless65: What Happened to the People Stuck in Jail During Hurricane Ian? w/Kathy SmithFor Public Defenders who serve in coastal areas, the story on toady’s show will be all too familiar. As Hurricane Ian barrelled toward the Florida coast, a state of emergency was declared and evacuation plans started to come together, but as is almost always the case, no one thought of those incarcerated. Today, Hunter spoke with Kathy Smith, Chief Public Defender in the 20th Judicial District of Florida, to discuss the impacts of the storm on those left in jail. Dating as far back as memory allows, state’s failed their obligations to protect the l...2022-11-1446 minPublic DefenselessWhy do We Punish Domestic Violence Survivors? w/Alexandra BaileyWhen does a victim become a suspect? Very often, our legal system cares about someone's status as a victim when it allows the system to incarcerate someone. As soon as you stand in that goal, any harm done to you matters not. On today's episode, Hunter spoke with Alexandra Bailey, Campaign Strategist to End Life Imprisonment at the Sentencing Project, to discuss the ways our legal system punishes Domestic Violence Survivors. Specifically, they dive deep into the "Failure to Protect laws" that showcase the latent sexism prevalent in our legal system and the twisted ways in...2022-11-091h 03Public Defenseless61: Uncovering the Misconduct of Police, Prosecutors, and Judges w/Johann DrolshagenThanks to the 1963 case of Brady v. Maryland, prosecutors are supposed to give the defense attorneys any evidence that may be beneficial to the defense’s case. Despite this requirement, police misconduct has been allowed to fester for decades as prosecutors and judges openly flaunt their mandates share this evidence. Furthermore, the legal profession itself fails to police prosecutors and judges who allow the misdeeds of police to go unchecked. This entire cycle calls into question decades worth of prosecutions because of potential failures to disclose evidence, but what can be done if everyone in the system is playing a...2022-11-041h 20Public DefenselessHow Kansas Public Defense Got Headed in the Right Direction w/Heather CessnaHeather Cessna, executive director of the Kansas Board of Indigent Services, is dedicated to positively transforming public defense in her state. Since she’s come on board, the quality of services has drastically increased as well as the working conditions for public defenders. In this episode, you’ll learn the structure of the Kansas Indigent Defense System, its current problems, and recent wins within the state. Heather has successfully reformed much of the system, and she’ll walk you through her methods and tactics. This episode proves the difference it makes when an i...2022-11-021h 07Public Defenseless59: The Lawsuit Pushing to Change the Wisconsin Public Defense w/John Birdsall and Hank Schultz Today, Hunter is joined by two guests hoping their lawsuit against the state of Wisconsin will bring vital changes to the State’s Public Defender System. Hank Schultz and John Birdsall have a combined experience of more than 40 years of working as criminal defense attorneys in Wisconsin. Through this experience, they are acutely aware of the history of inadequate pay for contract counsel and tough on crime policies that have pushed indigent defense to a state of crisis. For decades, the state of Wisconsin paid the attorneys willing to serve as contract counsel for i...2022-10-281h 08Public DefenselessAndrea Lyon on the Need for the Defender GeneralEvery minute of the full conversation with Andrea Lyon is available to listen to, but Hunter wanted to make sure everyone had an easy time accessing the last 30 minutes of the conversation where the discuss a potential Office of the Defender General at the Federal Level! Guests: Andrea Lyon, Capital Defense Attorney, Former Capital Public Defender, Author, Educator, and Former Dean of Valparaiso Law School Resources: Andrea Lyon Website Follow Andrea on Twitter 2022-10-1435 minPublic Defenseless55: Capital Representation and the Office of the Defender General w/Andrea LyonDubbed by the Chicago Tribune as “The Angel of Death Row”, Andrea Lyon is one of the most successful Capital Case Public Defenders in the country, but she is so much more than that. As an author, educator, former law school dean, and advocate for criminal justice reform, there is next to nothing that Andrea has not done in her career. On today’s episode, Hunter and Andrea discuss her experience as a Capital Public Defender, in Academia, and most importantly, her push to create the Office of the Defender General at the State Level. There a...2022-10-141h 22Public Defenseless53: What is Causing the Crisis in Oregon Public Defense w/Chris O'ConnorThe Oregon Public Defender System is broken. Due to a shortage of attorneys willing to take on the cases, hundreds of people wait for months without ever having an attorney appointed to their case. During this wait, they are often required to return to court to mandate another hearing because attorneys are not available to take the case. With each passing day, evidence grows harder to find, the memories of potential witnesses fade away, and whatever trust the accused had in the legal system withers and dies. To help Hunter understand how this cr...2022-10-071h 15Public Defenseless52: The Court Fines and Fees that Fund Alabama with Adam Danneman and Leah NelsonWhat is the true impact of fines and fees? In this episode, I speak with two inspiring individuals—Adam Danneman, the Chief Public Defender of Jefferson County, Alabama, and Leah Nelson, the Research Director of Alabama Appleseed. They bring with them two unique perspectives and a boatload of passion for public defense. Alabama does not have a universal indigent defense system and there is no obligation for any county in the state to operate a specific type of public defender system. Together, Adam and Leah talk about the specific challenges that this...2022-10-051h 22Public Defenseless51: The Texas Capital Punishment System is Designed to Kill w/Ray KeithWhen people discuss the criminal legal system, you may often hear someone say, “the system is not broken. It is acting exactly was it was designed.” On today’s episode, Hunter and guest Ray Keith discuss the ways in which the legal system in Texas is designed to kill people. As the head of the Regional Public Defenders for Capital Cases in Texas, Ray is intimately familiar with the statutory language and process that directs the jury towards a death penalty over life. While this is a highly technical episode, it is important to dig down in...2022-09-301h 16Public Defenseless50: The Fees Making People Pay for Their "Free" Attorney w/Marea BeemanToday, Hunter sat down with Marea Beeman, Director of Research Initiatives for Defender Legal Services at the National Legal Aid and Defender Association (NLADA), to discuss their recent report, “At What Cost? Findings from an Examination into the Imposition of Public Defense System Fees. If you ask the average person what the word “free” means, they will likely tell you it means whatever is considered “free” does not have any cost associated with it. So, when people hear, “If you cannot afford counsel, one will be appointed to you at no cost to yourself”, people would likely as...2022-09-281h 06Public Defenseless49: How did Arizona Become so Pro-Mass Incarceration and What Can be Done About it? w/Nate Wade and Katie Gipson-McLeanToday Hunter had the distinct pleasure of speaking with Nate Wade and Katie Gipson-McLean, two public defenders from the Arizona. Of all the episodes, this may be the one that makes you the most pissed off. From the outset, Katie and Nate drop story after story that reveals the deeply regressive and reactionary structure sustaining the status quo of mass incarceration in Arizona. From the powerful money interests in the DOC, to the work of a single, motivated individual, Arizona can easily be described as one of the most pro carceral states in America. Constantly r...2022-09-231h 23Public Defenseless48: The Recent Victories Igniting New Hope for Missouri Public Defense w/Mary FoxToday, Hunter revisited Public Defense in the state of Missouri with a conversation with Mary Fox. Mary is the Director of the Missouri State Public Defender system, and this conversation picks up where Hunter’s conversation with ACLU attorney, Anthony Rothert left off. Back in March, Hunter and Anthony discussed the history of Public Defense in Missouri and why the ACLU brought sued the state for its failure to provide counsel to all who could not afford it. While Hunter highly recommends checking out that episode, it stopped short of talking about the ways in whi...2022-09-211h 07Public Defenseless47: In Small-Town Georgia, A Broken Taillight Can Lead to Spiraling Debt w/Nick BarberToday, Hunter sat down with Nick Barber, author of a recent piece in the magazine In These Times called “In Small-Town Georgia, A Broken Taillight Can Lead to Spiraling Debt”. In his investigation and writing, Nick uncovered a corrupt private probation system that keeps people under control of the state for years in what appears to be an effort to generate revenue for Clayton, Georgia and for the company. As is so often the case, Nick highlights the story of two poor people who lives were upended by this abusive system of debt, and it is cl...2022-09-161h 05Public Defenseless46: Fighting Gun Violence Without Using Mass Incarceration in Cook County, IL w/Sharone MitchellToday, Hunter spoke with Sharone Mitchell Jr., Chief Public Defender in Cook County about a few extremely timely topics: Guns and Bail Reform. Born and raised in Chicago, Sharone understands the needs of his community and you can easily see how his experience helps to inform the way he pushes for and speaks about reform in Cook County. At the center of those pushes are tackling the issue of gun violence in the city without feeding America’s addiction to mass incarceration. Hunter really enjoyed the nuanced conversation about the ways in which gun violence and...2022-09-141h 04Public Defenseless45: Lawyers, Social Workers, Investigators, and the Whole Team that Makes the NAPD w/Lori James-TownesToday, Hunter sat down with Lori James-Townes, Executive Director of the largest Public Defense Association in the country, the National Association of Public Defense. After conversations with Jeff Sherr, Heather Hall, and countless other members of NAPD, listeners will likely be familiar with the organization, but Hunter wanted to speak with Lori to highlight a specific aspect of the association and the Public Defense movement at large: it is about more than lawyers. Lori is not an attorney by trade, and her experience in social work reminds us how essential it is to build public defender teams with more...2022-09-091h 06Public Defenseless44: Community Outreach and Staffing Shortages in Miami Public Defense w/Carlos MartinezToday, Hunter sat down with Carlos Martinez, the Chief Defender in the Miami Public Defender Office. With more than 30 years of experience as a Public Defender in Miami, Carlos Martinez has seen a little bit of everything in the office, but his experience extends past the court room. As a native son of Miami, Carlos relies on his personal experiences to help shape his offices outreach into the community. In speaking with Carlos I was struck by the thoughtful manner in which he approaches his responsibilities as an elected official and the importance of being an office that is...2022-09-071h 08Public Defenseless43: The Problem with Plea Deals with Professor Carissa Byrne HessickIf you believed the many legal dramas in TV reflected actual court proceedings, you would be under the impression that our legal system is driven by the battle of wits between two lawyers at trial. If, however, you examine how our legal system operates, you would see that long ago our system became one where trials are rare. Instead, it is the plea bargain sitting at the bedrock of our legal system, but how did this happen? How did our country go from outright rejecting plea bargains so that a jury trial may happen to a country that actively...2022-09-021h 27Public Defenseless41: Turning Public Defender Priorities into Public Policy Victories with Brad Haywood and Bryan KennedyThere are only so many victories that can happen for Public Defense in a court room. Of course, we should the goal should be zealous advocacy and the best outcome for each client, but a single victory in a single case is not enough to stem the tide of Mass Incarceration. Real victories for the accused come at the policy level, and that is what this week’s conversation is all about. Joining Hunter this week is Brad Haywood and Bryan Kennedy, two public defenders in Virginia and members of the non-partisan policy advocacy group, Justice Forward Virginia! ...2022-08-261h 15Public Defenseless40: How Moral Injury, Stress, and Trauma Impact Public Defense with Jenny AndrewsJenny Andrews is the Director of Training for California’s Indigent Defense Improvement Division. She’s here today to teach you what public defense is truly like from the defender’s side. Public defenders are often trapped between a rock and a hard place because they want to provide equal representation access, yet are expected to work too many hours for not enough pay. Because of this, “martyr complex” is prevalent in this field. You’ll learn that public defense is an area of service, but that this often comes at the expense of...2022-08-241h 11Public Defenseless37: How to Train the Next Generation of Public Defense Leaders with Jeff Sherr and Heather HallThis week, Hunter spoke with Jeff Sherr and Heather Hall of the National Association of Public Defense to discuss the importance of training the next generation of Public Defense Leaders. Over their careers, Jeff and Heather have seen first hand the transformation in the types of people drawn to Public Defense. This evolution from warriors in the court room to advocates in the policy realm has only be possible thanks to the development of new training methods that focus on the communication skills of Public Defender leaders, but this training must extend to more than just Public...2022-08-121h 11Public DefenselessPublic Service Loan Forgiveness and Student Debt with Jane Fox and Kyle Morris This week, Hunter sat down with Jane Fox and Kyle Morris to discuss one of the pressing issues facing millions of Americans: Student Loans. As of today, there is roughly $1.75 trillion in student loans that remain outstanding. For many, these debts will carry with them until they hit retirement age. This is a debt that cannot be discharged via bankruptcy and the high interest rates make it extremely difficult for those in low paying public service jobs to ever pay off the principle. That is where Public Service Loan Forgiveness (PSLF) comes into play. 2022-08-051h 34Public DefenselessThe History of Public Defense with Sara MayuexSara Mayeux is a law professor at Vanderbilt University and the author of the book Free Justice, A History of the Public Defender in 20th Century America. Sara discusses the progressive era, the 1950s and the development of public defense of modern America, and the supreme court's role throughout it all. The development of public defense has largely been dictated by the growth of the nation through urbanization, industrialization, and economic inequality. Sara and Hunter talk through how culture impacted the development of law as it stands today. This episode lays a fo...2022-08-0359 minPublic Defenseless32: Why Nevada Public Defense Failed and the Plan to Build it Back w/Franny ForsmanFranny Forsman has been working in Nevada indigent defense for several decades, and today she brings her impressive breadth of experience to the show! Franny is a former Post Conviction Indigent Defense Counsel in Nevada who has worked long and hard to improve the system. Today, she speaks with us about how the ACLU lawsuit has brought drastic changes to the state of Nevada and why there are still so many weaknesses. She’ll explain how the Nevada public defense system handles the massive amount of rural coverag...2022-07-201h 09Public Defenseless30: How Tennessee Fails to Protect Children Accused of Crimes w/Mark StephensIn this episode, I speak with Mark Stephens, the former chief public defender of Knoxville Tennessee. Tennessee public defense has been stuck in neutral, if not reverse for a long time. In fact, almost everything was established in the 90’s and hasn’t changed much since. Rutherford county incarcerated approximately 48% of children referred to juvenile court in 2014, and the statewide average for juvenile incarceration is 5%. Today, we talk about two alarming reports that have been released discussing the representation of juvenile offenders in the state. In Tennessee, public defenders are el...2022-07-061h 02Public Defenseless29: The Role a Judge can Play in Reforming Public Defense w/Tom BoydToday, you’ll hear about public defense from the judge’s point of view. Tom Boyd is a former Michigan District Court Judge who currently works in the court administration office. At one point one of the weakest systems in the United States, his work to improve the indigent system has driven forward the future of Michigan public defense and has left a positive precedent for other states. The 6th amendment is the ultimate protection against government power that is designed to keep people safe from a government acting out of control. 2022-06-2958 minPublic Defenseless26: Junk Science and the Makings of a Wrongful Conviction with Chris FabricantLike most people, shows like CSI, Law and Order, or even Dexter, may have you convinced that the science used to convict people is airtight. Everything from bite marks, blood spatter, and even finger prints, must be scientifically valid...right? What if I told you, almost all of it is predicated on junk science and the failings of the legal system to catch it? Today’s guest is on the show to highlight this and the infrastructure that has been created to support wrongful convictions. Chris Fabricant is the Director of Strate...2022-06-151h 10Public Defenseless24: How the Media Poisons Criminal Justice Discourse with Scott HechingerScott Hechinger is the founder and executive director of Zealous. Through his work, he is fighting hard to challenge injustice through the media and topple the imbalance of power within the criminal justice system. As a former public defender in the Bronx system, he comes on today’s episode to talk all about New York Public Defense and his work to make it fairer for all. He explains how he collaborates with the media to change the narrative around public defense and break long-held stigmas. He also shares how he encourages all members of the publ...2022-06-011h 03Public Defenseless20: Representing Mothers in Tulsa, Oklahoma with Aisha McWeayAisha McWeay is a former public defender and the Executive Director of Still She Rises, the first holistic defense office in the country dedicated exclusively to the representation of mothers in both the criminal and civil legal systems. Today's episode brings to light the unique challenges that mothers face as they navigate the complicated legal world they face in the greater Tulsa community. Still She Rises stands out as an organization that seeks to use the skills of a broad team of attorneys, social workers, client advocates, and community resources specialists to get the needs o...2022-05-041h 04Public DefenselessPublic Defenseless 202In this special solo episode, I share some thoughts on the first 16 episodes, thoughts from my interactions with people who have reached out, and the direction the show will be going over the next few points I wanna first thank all the people who have gone through the system who have reached out for help/advice/or to share your story. This project is designed to correct the system so that it helps people like yourself, so thank you! In light of the nomination hearings for soon to be Justice Jackson, I was yet again s...2022-04-1359 min
Public Defenseless01: Public Defense 101If you are new to Public Defenseless or the topic of public defense, here’s where you should start! In this special solo episode, host Hunter Parnell introduces himself, describes the background of this podcast, and shares everything you need to know about public defense before listening. No matter how much you know about public defense, Hunter’s wise insight and gift for explaining complex topics in an easy-to-understand way will leave you with fresh knowledge to walk away with. By listening, you’ll learn that the public de...2021-12-201h 00
Public DefenselessWelcome to Public DefenselessAnyone paying attention can tell you that our criminal justice system is broken, but the complexity of the legal world overwhelms most people simply trying to get through another day. Public Defenseless explores the rot in the justice system and what we can do about it. Join host, Hunter Parnell, as he interviews top defense attorneys and criminal justice stakeholders from across the country as they pull apart the convoluted web of our criminal justice system. Like so many of you, Hunter is not an attorney, simply tired of a news cycle and talking heads...2021-12-1410 min