Shows
Deconstructing MamasAllowed to Explore - Lizz Enns PettersOur episode this week is with our own Lizz Enns Petters, mom of two, author and podcast hostess.Our conversation is full of laughter, seriousness and our decision to have permission to explore our faith, along with Lizz's latest accomplishment of being published in a new children's Bible called God's Stories as Told by God's Children.We chat through these questions:1. You recently contributed to the Bible for Normal People’s publication of a children’s Bible. Why did you want to be a part of that? ...2025-05-2750 min
Deconstructing MamasRecovering Sex - the Sexvangelicals (Julia Postema and Jeremiah Gibson)“There's a misconception that once you leave religion, you magically learn everything you missed about relationships and sex” - The SexvangelicalsOur episode this week is with Jeremiah Gibson and Julia Postema, sex and relationship therapists, coaching and podcast hosts specializing in recovery from high-control religion as it relates to relationships and sexual intimacy.Our conversation is full of candor, surprises and mic-drop moments over and over again. We were blown away by one thing that will leave you wanting more. We chat through these questions:1. Even after all these...2025-05-201h 16
Deconstructing MamasBlessed are the Women - Claire K. McKeever-Burgett''Without women we don’t have Jesus. We don’t have Christianity. We don’t have any of it.” (Claire K. McKeever-Burgett)Our episode this week is with Claire K. McKeever-Burgett, mom of two and author of Blessed are the Women: Naming and Reclaiming Women's Stories from the Gospels.Our conversation is full of wisdom, both fierce and tender, and the reclamation of the divine feminine in all her forms. We chat through these questions:1. Were there any particular women in the Bible whose stories deeply impacted you perso...2025-05-1354 min
Deconstructing MamasRebellion or Integrity? - Jamin Coller'''Diligent study is precisely what got us here." Jamin CollerOur episode this week is with Jamin Coller, dad of six, podcaster and author of Dear Evangelicals.Our conversation is passionate, funny and so very eye-opening. We chat through these questions:1. Your book, Dear Evangelicals, frames deconstruction not as rebellion, but as a painful act of integrity after "stumbling upon information we didn't want." How can parents reframe their children's deconstruction as integrity, not betrayal? How can we help b...2025-05-0658 min
Deconstructing MamasI Would Pick You (Queer Advocacy) - Rachel Pinto-Martin'''Our job as parents is not to make other people comfortable with how we raise our kids, Our job is to make sure our kids grow up in a family where they’re comfortable being exactly who they are.'' Shelly RobinsonOur episode this week is with Rachel Pinto-Martin, founder of Self Love, Healthy Boundaries Coaching, mom of two, former Mormon and fierce Queer ally and advocate.On this episode, we talk with Rachel about what it means to have self-love along with healthy boundaries and help our kids to do the sa...2025-04-291h 03
Deconstructing MamasPowerful Parenting - Wendy Snyder"Where did we ever get the notion that in order for children to behave better, they first have to feel worse?" Our episode this week is with Wendy Snyder, founder of Fresh Start Family, mom of two teens, podcaster and certified positive (or as she likes to call it), powerful parenting coach.On this episode, we talk with Wendy about what it means to be an empowered parent and how can we parent out of compassionate connection and NOT fear and force.We chat through these questions:1. Wh...2025-04-2258 min
Deconstructing MamasJesus vs the Bad Guys? - Jared Neusch and Connor Shram"In the end, Jesus proved that forgiveness is more powerful than punches and kicks. And in the end, love wins over hate." - Jared Neusch and Connor Shram in their book: Jesus vs. the Bad GuysOur episode this week is with two dads, one a corn hole champion and Biblical scholar (Dr. Jared Neusch) and the other a comedian and change-maker (Connor Shram), both authors of a new book perfect for this time of year, Jesus Vs. the Bad Guys: a Story of Love and Forgiveness.On this e...2025-04-1554 min
Deconstructing MamasReimagining Easter - Sarah SwartzendruberYou don’t have to the answers to why Jesus died to talk about Easter with your kids. (Sarah Swartzendruber)Our episode this week is with our resident Children's Pastor, childhood development expert, mom to two and Bible scholar, Sarah Swartzendruber.On this episode, we talk with Sarah about reimagining the Easter story by diving into atonement theories and practical ways we can talk about it with our littles, middles and bigs.We chat through these questions:1. What's your current take on the Easter story? What do you personally be...2025-04-081h 03
Deconstructing MamasAligning Faith with Soul - Chelan HarkinThe worst thing we ever did is pretend God isn’t the easiest thing in this Universe available to every soul in every breath. (Chelan Harkin)Our episode this week is with Chelan Harkin, mama to two and mystical poet extraordinaire.On this episode, we talk with Chelan about growing up in the Baha'i faith, the courage it takes to question what you've been told all your life, how our faith can align with our soul and especially how this all fleshes out in our parenting.We chat through these questions:2025-04-011h 06
Deconstructing MamasHighly Unorthodox Gospel - Rabbi Brian Zachary MayerWith regard to the question, “Do you believe in God?” I do not care much about your answer. But if I were to ask the last five people with whom you’ve interacted if you were kind, about those answers I care very much. (Rabbi Brian Zachary Mayer)Our episode this week is with Rabbi Brian Zachary Mayer, dad, author of the brilliant book, Highly Unorthodox Gospel, (also known as HUG), French Horn player and our very first Rabbi.On this episode, we talk with rB (as he refers to himself) about...2025-03-2557 min
Deconstructing MamasAncestors, Art & Ancient Texts - Liz Charlotte GrantDoubt is another word for imagination. (Liz Charlotte Grant)Our episode this week is with Liz Charlotte Grant, mom, author of the new brilliant book, Knock at the Sky: Seeking God in Genesis After Losing Faith in the Bible, artist and lover of the Bible.On this episode, we talk with Liz about all things related to seeking God through Scripture even as our faith continues to evolve. We chat through these questions:1. What made you do a deep dive into Genesis specifically?2. H...2025-03-1845 min
Deconstructing MamasI've Got Questions - Erin Hicks MoonWhat we're learning is that God is comfortable with questions. In fact, our questions are often where God want to meet us. (Erin Hicks Moon)Our episode this week is with Erin Hicks Moon, mom, author of the new brilliant book, I've Got Questions, Zac Efron apologist (it's a thing y'all), and self-proclaimed Bible-nerd.On this episode, we talk with Erin about all things related to questioning, and why it's an necessary spiritual practice. Plus, we do find out more about why she has a obsession with Zac Efron, a reason...2025-03-1148 min
Deconstructing MamasUncovering and Recovering from Purity Culture - Joshua Harris"Purity culture presents a false dichotomy: restraint or chaos. The real alternative? Sexual empowerment - the freedom to experience intimacy on your own meaningful terms." (Joshua Harris)Our episode this week is with Joshua Harris, former pastor and the author of I Kissed Dating Goodbye, released at the height of purity culture, and currently on an highly sacred, evolving spiritual path. Here's where he finds himself today: I used to have all the answers—chapter and verse. Now I’m happily uncertain and enjoying the wonder and mystery of life.Purity culture is one of...2025-03-0454 min
Deconstructing MamasReimagining Christmas - Sarah Swartzendruber"When our faith shifts, sometimes stories that once felt magical like Christmas feel complicated. We can still feel empowered by the magical parts of the story while leaving room for age appropriate theology and curiosity with the story." (Sarah Swartzendruber)Our episode this week is with Sarah Swartzendruber, Sarah is a mama, pastor, kid's faith curriculum creator (Zippee) and cohort leader for Parenting After Deconstruction.Most of the parents who reach out to her know what they don't want to teach their kids, but they have no idea what they do want for...2024-12-031h 00
Deconstructing MamasEveryone Belongs - Mariko Clark and Rachel Eleanor"I’m writing the story Bible I wish to see in the world. Not just for my daughter, not just for girls, but for all kids. Because when it comes to the love of God, everyone belongs.” Mariko ClarkOur episode this week is with the author and illustrator of the new and wildly popular children's Bible story book, The Book of Belonging, Mariko Clark and Rachel Eleanor. Their passion to provide a resource for kids (and their parents) that is wildly inclusive, historically accurate and highly engaging has us buying copies left and...2024-11-261h 04
Deconstructing MamasUnbelieve, Jaded, Whole - Marla Taviano"We never had certainty we just thought we did. We convinced ourselves we could absolutely be sure. Now we know the truth and the next step is to find peace in that uncertainty and maybe even be happy about it, to have patience with everything unresolved in your heart and try to love the questions themselves." Marla Taviano in her new book “Whole” (with a nod to words by Rilke) Our episode this week is with Marla Taviano, the author of several books, some of our favorites being her trilogy of poetry called Unbelieve, 2024-11-191h 02
Deconstructing MamasNice Churchy Patriarchy - Liz Cooledge Jenkins"Our fight is not against men but against the systems of imbalanced power that keep women and nonbinary people from flourishing in the fullness of our gifts and offering this world the best we have to offer.” Liz Cooledge Jenkins Our episode this week is with Liz Cooledge Jenkins, preacher, writer and author of the book, Nice Churchy Patriarchy. Liz has a gentleness, yet brilliance about her and this conversation couldn't have been more enlightening and engaging.Some of the topics we explore are these:The definition of the Patriarchy and...2024-11-1248 min
Deconstructing MamasWhat Matters? - Sarah W. Bragg“If I widen the lens and see this concept from a new perspective, then yes, I do matter. I do have purpose. I’ve just redefined my view of purpose. I’ve taken the pressure off. And I’ve started to find fulfillment, contentment, and gratification in small actions that matter." Sarah W. Bragg Our episode this week is with Sarah W. Bragg, mom of two teens, author of the new book, Is Everyone Happier Than Me?, and podcast host.Sarah's humor, combined with her tenderness and strength, lends itself to an incred...2024-11-0552 min
Deconstructing MamasStar-Spangled Jesus - April Ajoy“Christian Nationalism is harmful to both Christianity and the country.” April Ajoy Our episode this week is with April Ajoy, author of the new book, Star-Spangled Jesus, former Christian Nationalist, podcast host and deconstructing mom of two.April has a fierce passion to recover from the wounds of toxic Christianity and how it plays out in the political arena and to help others do the same. If you feel like you would like to understand more about exactly what Christian Nationalism is and learn more about the hope we still have in th...2024-10-2939 min
Deconstructing MamasGet Your Spark Back - Rachel Marie Martin“Your soul is waiting for you to say yes to it again.” Rachel Marie Martin Our episode this week is with Rachel Marie Martin, the ever-popular social media site called "Finding Joy." She is the author of three books, the biological mom of seven, the bonus mom to four and the daughter of church planters.Rachel has a fierce passion to be vulnerable and tell her story in all its "rawness." Why is she so raw? Because that’s her heart and in sharing she hopes you too unearth and celebrate your own bravery...2024-10-2240 min
Deconstructing MamasSpiritual Sexuality - Kelly EdmistonBody and spirit marry in the chapel of the soul. They marry every minute of every day, in all activities and in all inactivity, in all thoughts and in all actions, or they marry not at all. (If) They don’t marry, we do not know sexuality with soul, and therefore our sexuality remains incomplete and insufficiently human. We do not find the soul of sex by spiritualizing the body but by coming to appreciate its mysteries and by daring to enter into its sensuousness. --Thomas MooreOur episode this week is wi...2024-10-151h 09
Deconstructing MamasOthered - Jenai AumanI found the freedom to take up space instead of trying to conform to a mold forged in the fire of the empire. The truth is that to become comfortable in my skin and with my scars, I had to leave a place where scars had to stay hidden. In the space of the wilderness, I learned to like all that was OTHER about me. And I hope you give yourself permission to like all that is OTHER about you, too.Jenai AumanOur episode this week is with Jenai Auman, a...2024-10-081h 00
Deconstructing MamasJoy Without Guilt - Chelsea HainesOne purpose of healing is to be able to experience joy. Our subconscious seeks what is familiar. Joy without guilt is not familiar to many. (Chelsea Haines)We start off Season Six (can you believe it?) with Chelsea Haines, otherwise known as @yourgutsygal and the founder of the Gut Health Agency. So many of you have asked "what do we do now" to move into a healthy and wholistic body/spiritual space, and if this is you, this podcast episode is for you.On this episode, we explore the idea of healing our...2024-10-011h 05
The BETWEEN PodcastLizz Enns Petters & Esther Joy Goetz: "The Deconstructing Mamas"Lizz Enns Petters and Esther Joy Goetz are our special guests on this episode of The BETWEEN Podcast. Lizz and Esther host The Deconstructing Mamas Podcast and... If you are trying to figure out how to navigate the tricky tightrope of parenting while you have questions, doubts and wonderings about your spiritual journey, their podcast is for you (and so is this episode of our podcast!)
Lizz Enns Petters is a passionate voice for so many people out there... she encourages her readers and listeners around the themes of MOTHERHOOD, MENTAL HEALTH, and MINDFUL CHRISTIANITY. Her father...2024-06-031h 03
Deconstructing MamasReclaiming Internal Authority - Esther Joy GoetzWe tend to look for answers outside ourselves. From books. Church. From friends or family. Even from society. We are called deeper, to sink down inside ourselves, where what we need is intertwined with what the Divine has to offer us. The place where we can trust and rest and then go and do. (Esther Goetz)Our guest this week is our very own Esther Goetz. Esther is a deconstructing mama of four, an author and spiritual director, dedicated to helping you take your next step in the growth of your soul.On...2024-05-2145 min
Deconstructing MamasGiving Up God - Sarah Henn Hayward“We are meaning-making machines. Chaos is uncomfortable, and thinking that everything that happens to us is due to random chance feels cold and impersonal. The brain seeks out patterns and order when they are not necessarily present.” Sarah Henn HaywardOur guest this week is Sarah Henn Hayward. Sarah is a mom of two, an author and our first self-proclaimed agnostic/atheist on the podcast. To say that our conversation was fascinating and enlightening would be an understatement.On this episode, we explore these topics:Unpacking the realization that...2024-05-1458 min
Deconstructing MamasIt's Not Complicated - Malynda HalePromote what you love instead of bashing what you hate. - Malynda HaleMalynda Hale, mom, activist, singer, author and actress, is our guest this week. Malynda uses her voice through her music and social media presence as an educating activist to effect change within social justice, female empowerment, LGBTQ+ rights, the Black Lives Matter movement, Antisemitism and Progressive Christianity.On this podcast episode, we dive deep into lots of that, but we also spend our time hashing out how to truly love ourselves and those around us, especially our kids. "...2024-05-0756 min
Deconstructing MamasLove Yourself - Amber SchultzThe Church needs to be called out and take responsibility for the damage it has done to people. The survivors should be heard. So no, I don't always talk about the good. Because until the darkness is exposed, and more people are removed from power that absolutely should not be in it, I will not be quiet. - Amber SchultzAmber Schultz, founder of Fundie Freed, a webcast devoted to telling religious trauma survivor stories, comes on the podcast as our guest this week. Amber is a single mama of three daughters and is highly...2024-04-3051 min
Deconstructing MamasDeconstructing Your Faith Without Losing Yourself - Angela J. HerringtonDeconstruction invites us to become really honest about what we believe, why we hold those beliefs sacred, how they influence the way we relate to our creator, and who is actually served by our beliefs. If we trust the process enough to lower our walls and honestly engage with our questions, deconstruction promises to reveal undiscovered bias, limiting beliefs, and any flawed doctrines that actively harm people. - Angela J. HerrringtonBack for round two, Angela J. Herrington, comes on the podcast as our guest this week. We are doubly-thrilled to have her back! Angela...2024-04-2355 min
Deconstructing MamasWalking Out of & Into Spiritual Rooms - Emily P. FreemanThe question we need to ask is this one: Am I being pushed by fear or led by love? (Emily P. Freeman)We are absolutely thrilled to have Emily P. Freeman join us on the podcast this week. Emily is a New York Times best-selling author, a mom to three, a spiritual director and podcast hostess. Her most important work is to help create soul space and offer spiritual companionship and discernment for anyone struggling with decision fatigue and trying to make a life in the process.Emily vulnerably speaks about h...2024-04-161h 00
Deconstructing MamasFinding My Voice Again - Leslie NeaseI want to be a voice for the invisibles. (Leslie Nease)What do a Survivor contestant, deconstructing mama of four bigs, former Christian radio broadcaster, life and faith transitions coach, author and newly-minted podcast hostess have in common? They are all named Leslie Nease, our podcast guest this week.Leslie is quick-witted, well-spoken and passionate about coming alongside of people in their ever-evolving spiritual journeys and making sure they feel seen, heard and absolutely not alone. She wants to make the "invisibles" (those of us who are afraid of speaking out about our dec...2024-04-0959 min
Deconstructing MamasDeconstructing Spanking - Matt Shantz*trigger warning*“My passion is to have a kinder and gentler world for our little people in faith spaces.” (Matt Shantz)Meet Matt Shantz, husband, dad, social worker in child and adolescent mental health, and spiritual mentor. Matt is our podcast guest this week and we are so grateful to have had one of the most complicated, difficult and needed conversations we've had on the podcast to date.This week, we tackle the subject of spanking and we do so in a way that will be informative and passionate, full of stor...2024-04-021h 00
Deconstructing MamasEssentially Good & Worthy of Love - Stephanie StalveyI’m trying to be in alignment with what I understand what the true principles of love to actually be. (Stephanie Stalvey)The passionate and kind Stephanie Stalvey is our guest this week on the podcast. Stephanie is a deconstructing mama of one, high school art teacher, and painter writer and comic book artist extraordinaire. She loves music and animals and going to the beach when its cold.She's been irresistibly drawn to making comics since she was a kid. Comics are intimate, they are rock and roll, they’re visual prose...2024-03-2653 min
Deconstructing MamasYou Will Always Belong - Matthew Paul Turner“God is like a fort, strong and secure with walls that are mighty and safe. Inside, there are hidden places to hold you when you’re scared or need a quiet place to rest.” What is God Like (Matthew Paul Turner & Rachel Held Evans)The spunky and amazing Matthew Paul Turner is our guest this week on the podcast. Matthew is a dad of three, New York Time's best-selling children's author, and accomplished photographer and journalist.Matthew's fiery, yet gentle spirit and his passion to help others belong to and be comple...2024-03-1951 min
Deconstructing MamasParenting After Deconstruction - Sarah Schwartzendruber“You aren't going to mess up your kids' theology." (Sarah Swartzendruber) The brilliant Sarah Swartzendruber is our guest this week on the podcast. Sarah is a mama, pastor, kid's faith curriculum creator (Zippee) and cohort leader for Parenting After Deconstruction. Most of the parents who reach out to her know what they don't want to teach their kids, but they have no idea what they do want for their families. Sarah's passion is helping parents in deconstruction create healthy spiritual practices for their kids that answer the question, "What now...2024-03-1253 min
Deconstructing MamasDiet Culture & Extreme Religion - Trisha Wilkerson“Self-discovery is the goal. Self-compassion is the vibe." (Trisha Wilkerson)We start off Season Five with Trisha Wilkerson as our guest this week on the podcast. And it's really good! Trisha is a deconstructing mama, author, former pastor's wife turned certified Nutrition Coach. She works with individuals and groups, guiding a behavioral change process towards increasing overall wellness. Her style is wholeheartedness, with curiosity and gentle challenges.Trisha's journey in Transformation, Healing, and Holistic Wellness began in the Church, where she learned to listen and love. 25 years in the Evangelical Church ta...2024-03-051h 06
Deconstructing MamasThe Struggle - Lizz Enns Petters and Esther Joy Goetz“Chronic trauma can overwhelm our internal coping resources. Trauma disrupts the same system that regulates our body’s stress response causing a hyperactive fight-or-flight reaction. It’s not just all in our head. It’s in our bodies too. (Brittany Moses) Guess what??? The guests on our podcasts this week are...drum roll please... us.We are closing out Season Four with a conversation with just the two of us.We dive deep into THE STRUGGLE to heal our spiritual trauma and how our bodies have suffered and how reconnecting with our them...2023-12-0558 min
Deconstructing MamasI Might Be Wrong - Zack Hunt“Admitting we could be wrong about the things we are most convinced of, that are so fundamental to who we are, is painful and becoming someone new is scary.” (an excerpt from Godbreathed, Zack Hunt)Zack Hunt (sometimes known as Zaack Hunt around the internet, a deconstructing dad, former pastor, prolific author and BBQ magician extraordinaire, is our guest this week. Zack has spent the last decade writing about the interplay of faith and politics and when not doing that good work, he can be found traveling and trying out new restaurants with his w...2023-11-2853 min
Deconstructing MamasMy Love, God is Everywhere - The Reverend Mamas“My love, God is here when you choose goodness and are living from your heart. When you follow the path of love, God is with you from the start. And God is there when you mess up, if you make a choice that isn’t best. It doesn’t mean you’re bad; it just means you’re human-like all the rest.” (an excerpt from My Love, God is Everywhere)Victoria Robb Powers and Cameron Vickrey, also known as the Reverend Mamas, are our guests this week on the podcast. Vic...2023-11-2146 min
Deconstructing MamasDeconstructing Hell - Chad Bahl"I would hope never to feel so confident in my theology as not to be willing to correct a wrong view once presented with compelling evidence." Chad Bahl (Deconstructing Hell)Chad Bahl is our podcast guest this week. Chad is a theologian, step-dad and author. Chad is also a kind, humble, deep, brilliant soul who is on a personal mission to seek the whole truth no matter what the cost.On this episode, after we find out one of Chad's fun and super unique hobbies and his surprising day job...2023-11-1449 min
Deconstructing MamasLiminal Space & Winter's Gifts - Kaitlin Curtice“In a time when we love to keep ourselves separated from one another with our ideologies and beliefs, liminality asks how we exist in those in between spaces.” - Kaitlin Curtis (Living Resistance)Kaitlin Curtice is our podcast guest this week. Kaitlin is an award-winning author, poet-storyteller, and public speaker. As an enrolled citizen of the Potawatomi nation, Kaitlin writes on the intersections of spirituality and identity and how that shifts throughout our lives.She also speaks on these topics to diverse audiences who are interested in truth-telling and healing.As an i...2023-11-0749 min
Deconstructing MamasStories and Solidarity - Dr. Drew Hart“Following Jesus out of the entanglements of Christian supremacy and white supremacy are deep convictions. We believe God desires so much more from the Church than the frequently empty religiosity and hypocrisy we have become adjusted to.” --Dr. Drew Hart Dr. Drew Hart, black activist, racial reconciliation expert, biblical studies professor and father of three boys, is our guest this week. Drew is the author of Trouble I've Seen and Who Will Be A Witness. Following Jesus out of the entanglements of Christian supremacy and white supremacy are deep convi...2023-10-3154 min
Deconstructing MamasFrom Constrictive to Expansive - Kyndall Rae RothausKyndall Rae Rothaus, a preacher, poet, feminist theologian, spiritual director, and preaching coach, is our guest this week. She is the author of Thy Queendom Come: Breaking Free from Patriarchy to Save Your Soul (2021) and Preacher Breath (2015). She is the co-founder and Executive Director of Nevertheless She Preached, a national, ecumenical preaching conference designed to elevate the voices of womxn on the margins and the founder of the Soul of Preaching Project.Kyndall is a sought-after public speaker whose piercing insights into the human spiritual condition are delivered with poetic and rhetorical brilliance. She is a...2023-10-1752 min
Deconstructing MamasDeconstructing Grief - Dr. Glenn SiepertThis Week on the Podcast:Dr. Glenn Siepert, a deconstructing dad, former pastor, author and podcast host of the What If Project, is our guest this week.Glenn creates a safe space for people to explore this idea: What if there are ways of thinking about God and faith that are different than what our traditions have handed us? .On this episode, we ask a big What If question: what do we do with our grief during deconstruction? What if there are ways of thinking about and approaching grief than what our traditions...2023-10-171h 04
Deconstructing MamasYour Body is a Revolution - Tara TengTara Teng, an Embodiment Coach who works in the intersections of spirituality and sexuality, is our guest this week. Tara helps people find their way back to their bodies, overcome shame, heal trauma and dismantle purity culture in a way that is in alignment with their values and beliefs so that they can build a healthy, sexual ethic and thrive in freedom and wholeness.On this episode, we explore the ways we have been separated from our bodies and consequently from each other and why that is so damaging to us.We also venture into...2023-10-0454 min
Deconstructing MamasEvolve to Survive - Ericka GrahamEricka Graham, freelance pastor and Bible-nerd extraordinaire, mama to two littles, recovering 12-stepper, and podcast hostess, is our guest this week. Ericka has a passion for reframing the Bible to be a source of life and healing and spreading that word far and wide.On this episode, we dive deep into the hard spaces of OCD manifested in scrupulosity, drug addiction and herky-jerky recovery and the ways that the Bible has been used to harm others.We also lean into the hopeful ideas of radically loving ourselves, fighting for our healing and how Scripture can h...2023-10-0351 min
Deconstructing MamasIs God Violent? - Dr. Eric SeibertDr. Eric Seibert, Old Testament scholar and professor, dad of tweens and teens, prolific author and Minecraft guru, (yes, you read that right) is our guest this week. Eric is passionate against churchce sanctioned violenebecause he is troubled by how much violence Christians condone and sometimes participate in. I do NOT believe this is what God intended," he says (with a little bit of umph in his voice).On this episode, we unpack why it's incredibly harmful to believe that God is a violent, but also supposedly loving God. Where does the notion come from? And why...2023-09-2649 min
Deconstructing MamasRewilding Our Soul - Mary DeJongWe continue Season Four with Mary DeJong. Mary lives in Seattle, Washington's Rainier Valley in Columbia City, at Hedgewood, a home that for over a decade has hosted community connection through the reclamation and restoration of a neighborhood forest.Mary finds herself an eco-theologian and urban naturalist who delves into why place matters, the sacramentality of creation, and how together this informs the development of our ecological self. Mary terms this work “sacred eco-awakening” and sees this as a critical and holy endeavor as it allows us to come to grievous terms of our human histo...2023-09-191h 02
Deconstructing MamasSafe Sex - Dr. Laura E. AndersonWe are so excited to launch Season Four with Dr. Laura E. Anderson, the author of that wisdom. Dr. Laura is a psychotherapist, trauma resolution coach and consultant, writer and educator specializing in complex and developmental trauma, dynamics of power and control and religious trauma. She views herself as still a work in progress. She believes healing is a life-long process rather than a point you get to where you say “there, I am done, healed.” However, who she is today is quite different and she is proud of who she's become as a result of healing her ne...2023-09-121h 01
Deconstructing MamasEmbodied Faith - Annalise HumeAnnalise Hume, is our guest on our perfectly-timed summer bonus episode. Annalise is a passionate, creative, down-to-earth mover who loves listening and asking questions to help others recognize the movement of God in their life.After growing up in Boise, Idaho, she earned a BFA in Dance, spending a year touring with a performing-arts organization in South Africa upon graduation.Before moving to South Africa, she met an amazing South African who happened to live in Idaho. They got married and landed in Princeton, New Jersey where Annalise earned her MDiv as well as my...2023-07-2550 min
Deconstructing MamasReparenting Ourselves - Bekah McNeelBekah McNeel is our final guest of Season Three. Bekah is a native of San Antonio, Texas, where she has been a reporter for nine years. Her work has appeared in print with Christianity Today, The San Antonio Current, and the Public Justice Review, as well as online with the Christian Science Monitor, Sojourners, the Texas Tribune, the Hechinger Report, The 74 Million, and numerous local outlets.Bekah calls herself a story-teller, but she is especially known for her ability to communicate the high stakes of education and immigration policy and bring clarity to complex systems. Bekah keeps t...2023-05-2347 min
Deconstructing MamasThe Space Between - Matt MattsonMatt Mattson, the "starter" of both the BETWEEN community and Today I Pray For You project on Instagram and Facebook, is our guest this week. Matt dreams of creating a global relational religious movement. Matt believes “church” (and faith exploration) can and should happen in our conversations with others.He's passionate that the space between us is sacred, a holy space. The way we fill that space — the choices about the way we interact with people — is our faith-come-to-life. He wants your coffee shop chats, your small talk in line at the grocery store, your social media interactio...2023-05-1647 min
Deconstructing MamasWhat About the Why? - Liz MallLiz Mall, apologist (fancy word for someone who uses "argument" and "reason" to make a point that something is or isn't true and she has her masters in this area of expertise), deconstructing mama of three littles and podcast hostess, is our guest this week.She and her cohost provide incredible resources for both faith deconstruction and reconstruction. They tackle subjects like hell, Biblical genocide, purity culture and even head-coverings (for those of you forced to wear them - yes, it's a thing). Liz is witty and smart and kind and knows her s...2023-05-0947 min
Deconstructing MamasTear Everything Down - Melissa NeebMelissa Neeb, author, deconstructing mama of two teens, avid photographer, and podcast hostess is our guest this week.Her mantra is "love big, live kind" and there could be nothing truer about Melissa. She's highly committed to loving without strings, inclusive of everyone who walks into her home or her life and kindness is her main squeeze.When she's not caring for babies at her day job, you can find her loving on all of her fur babies (six of them to be exact), writing furiously for social media, photographing nature and always always showing...2023-05-0248 min
Deconstructing MamasTwo Trees - Mike MorrellMike Morrell, coauthor of the Divine Dance with Richard Rohr (a pretty big deal), dad of two, an opti-mystic (which he likes to call himself), and Dudeist Priest (look it up here), is our guest this week.He's a contemplative-in-process, seeking a more grounded experience of God, life, himself and the world, not because of grand mystical aspiration, but in order to stay sane in the here and now.He's pretty sure his two girls are funny and brilliant – both my academically ‘gifted’ (as the school system names her aptitude) daughter and my...2023-04-2549 min
Deconstructing MamasPurity Culture Recovery - Dr. Camden MorganteDr. Camden Morgante, psychologist, coach, writer, and fellow mama is passionate about purity culture recovery, egalitarianism and reconstruction. She currently lives in Knoxville, TN with her husband and her two beautiful children.We know what is wrong with purity culture—now we need to know how to heal. As a licensed psychologist specializing in sexuality who grew up in the height of purity culture, Dr. Camden, as she is known around the internet, offers a path forward to help repair the movement’s harmful effects, overcome shame, and reconstruct healthier faith and sexuality.So if you...2023-04-1841 min
Deconstructing MamasThe Gift of the Unexpected - Jillian BenfieldJillian Benfield, author, mom of three, former TV news anchor, and fierce advocate for access and inclusion of all types, is our guest this week. When she and her husband Andy were just 27 years old, they unexpectedly found out their son would be born with Down syndrome. Originally, devastated, they later, through months and years of learning and unlearning, realized their grief was largely tied to their ignorance and unknowing ableism.It is not easy raising a child with a disability in an inaccessible world. It has been the most difficult and also the most beautiful experience...2023-04-1150 min
Deconstructing MamasWhat About Doubt? - Kat WordsworthKat Wordsworth, author, mom of two, avid swimmer, and experienced doubter, is our guest this week. Although she is constantly living with doubt and unpacking both the harm and the healing it has brought to her life, she is taking slow steps on her own path of faith.Our conversation with Kat, one of most gentle souls we've had the privilege of interviewing, was raw, vulnerable and not wrapped up in a nice neat bow. Her vulnerability and openness about her own continuing and difficult, yet sacred journey with doubt will help you to feel seen, heard...2023-04-0443 min
Deconstructing MamasParenting Deconstructed - Jason ElamJason Elam, grateful husband, author, proud dad of four amazing kids, host of the Messy Spirituality Podcast, and former church pastor, is our guest this week. Although he is deconstructing from toxic religion, he is still enamored by Jesus. Our time with Jason was refreshing and empowering, especially in the area of deconstructing and parenting. Speaking from his very own mistakes and frustration with his own early parenting based in rigid evangelicalism, he walks us through the hard part of forgiving ourselves and repairing what's been broken in our relationships with our kids, bringing the li...2023-03-2844 min
Deconstructing MamasIs God a Safe Grown-Up? - Meredith MillerMeredith Miller, mom, children's pastor and soon-to-be author of a legit book coming out in August titled Woven: Nurturing a Faith Your Kid Doesn't Have to Heal From, is with us this week. Meredith has over 20 years experience in children’s ministry and curriculum. In 2019 she and her husband Curtis started a small church on Zoom that wants to live the one-anothers, neighbor well, and do justice. And eat.For the 5 years prior she was Curriculum Director for the children’s ministry at Willow Creek Community Church in Chicago, Illinois, where she created the f...2023-03-2148 min
Deconstructing MamasStay Out of the Way - Sarah BesseySarah Bessey, mom, best-selling author of dozens of words and books, podcast host herself and co-creator of the Evolving Summit is with us this week. Sarah was born and raised in the prairies and foothills of western Canada. Now living in Calgary, Alberta, Canada (on the traditional territories of the people of the Treaty 7 region in southern Alberta and the Métis Nation of Alberta, Region 3), Sarah and her husband of twenty-one years are raising their four kids. She’s a pseudo-hermit bookworm, an enthusiastic knitter, tea-drinker, hockey fan, total hugger, endlessly fascinated with Jesus, and an emba...2023-03-1446 min
Deconstructing MamasI am Enough - Jonathan PuddleJonathan Puddle, dad of four, children's pastor and author, is with us this week. Jonathan was born in New Zealand and now resides in Guelph, Ontario with his wife Maija and their three kids. He love books, music, movies, dark beer, good food, and long walks on the beach.Jonathan feels passionately about living freely and loving powerfully. He believes that LOVE is a burning thing. It'll change your life forever. But as a word, it's also kind of meaningless. We love chocolate, we love puppies, we love God. God is love. God l...2023-03-0745 min
Deconstructing MamasLove is Not - Jamie EdelbrockJamie Edelbrock, mom of three tween and teenage daughters, children's author, mental health advocate and fellow deconstructing mama kicks off Season Three with us. Jamie was born and raised in Salem, Oregon. She's married to her high school sweetheart and has been all of the following at some point: homeschool mom, preschool director, family ministry director, author, and advocate for children's mental health.FUN FACT: She is also an ex-pat and travel and live around the world in a far-off land (you can hear more about that on the podcast).On...2023-02-2841 min
Deconstructing MamasCompassionate Curiosity - Shelly Robinson"Motherhood is the hardest and holiest work because my kids reflect back to me what I haven't yet resolved within myself." (Shelly Robinson)Shelly Robinson, mom of two, founder of Raising Yourself, certified family wellness coach, author of the Rebirth Journal, and creator behind the Connected Collection, a powerful bundle of transformational parenting tools, is our podcast guest this week and will round out Season 2.She's also a lover of tacos, coffee enthusiast, Enneagram 2, ENFJ, and a neuro-spicy (hello ADHD diagnosis at 43 years old), and homeschooling mama. Her top three values a...2022-12-0641 min
Deconstructing MamasOriginal Blessing - Danielle ShroyerThe funny, yet very insightful Danielle Shroyer, is our guest this week. Danielle Shroyer is an author, speaker, spiritual director, and former pastor. A founding member in the emerging church movement, Danielle served as the pastor of one of the nation’s first independent emerging communities of faith for nearly a decade. Her primary goal as a pastor was to help people going through a season of spiritual deconstruction find healthy, sustainable, and meaningful ways to reconstruct their faith.Danielle has a particular heart for the spiritual-but-not-religious, and has long advocated for fresh approaches to spiritual community. Ov...2022-11-2947 min
Deconstructing MamasPastoring, Potatoes and Parenthood- Ben CremerThe fabulous Ben Cremer is our guest this week. Ben is all these things: Wesleyan. Writer. Chronic student. Constant investigator. Idahoan (Lizz and Esther had never met anyone before from Idaho). He is very well-known for the black boxes on social media filled with mic drop after mic drop of wisdom and cut-to-the-chase snippets that speak to where we find ourselves in modern Christianity in America.What happens when you talk about pastoring, potatoes (he is from Idaho, people) and parenthood in the same Zoom space? You get an amazing podcast episode! Ben i...2022-11-2259 min
Deconstructing MamasSpiritual Misfits - Joy VetterleinThe very wonderful Joy Vetterlein is our guest this week. Joy is a lifelong church girl and former-pastor-turned-misfit-rebel who got tired of being hurt and seeing other people get hurt by evangelical Christianity. She's here to help you find your own path to spirituality, especially if you feel like a "spiritual misfit" just like her.Joy is a fellow deconstructing mama who spent much of her journey being the poster child for Christianity while at the same time being miserable. When she lost her pastoral job (along with her calling and identity), she also lost her willingness...2022-11-1553 min
Deconstructing MamasThis Little Light of Mine - Torri Williams“To be human in an aching world is to know our dignity and become people who safeguard the dignity of everything around us.”-Cole Arthur Riley-This Week on the Podcast:Torri Williams, our guest this week, is an activist and brilliant soul. Growing up in a small town which was prominently white and highly evangelical as a a black charismatic fundamentalist, she found herself constantly curious about her faith and how it played out, not only for herself as a black woman, but for others who were...2022-11-0843 min
Deconstructing MamasMama God - Daneen Akers"As long as a masculine god remains at the top of the pyramid, nothing else we do matters." Dr. Rev. Will GaffneyDaneen Akers is the author of Holy Troublemakers and Unconventional Saints, an illustrated children's book about people of diverse faiths working for more love and justice in their corners of the world, even when that means rocking the religious boat.Daneen believes deeply in the power of stories. Her past projects have explored faith, identity, and belonging. Daneen loves the gloaming, the time of day when it’s starting to...2022-11-0141 min
Deconstructing MamasInternal Family Systems - Molly LaCroix"Why do Christians talk so much about love but often, fail to be loving?"Molly LaCroix is the author of that quote, a speaker and licensed marriage and family therapist (LMFT). She specializes in treating the impact of early adverse experiences and trauma, using the Internal Family Systems (IFS) Model she finds as a comprehensive, evidence-based approach to healing, and a model deeply congruent with Christian spirituality.Molly and her husband live in Central Oregon, an outdoor paradise offering, among many things, Molly’s two favorite activities: hiking and downhill skiing. In 2018, Molly be...2022-10-2552 min
Deconstructing MamasWho Do I Trust? - Angela J. Herrington"Deconstruction is an opportunity to deepen your faith, not just a rejection of what you believed in the past."The author of those beautiful words, Angela J. Herrington, a fellow deconstructing mama of FIVE and a faith deconstruction coach, walks us through how unhealed trauma informs our ability to trust ourselves. We walk through how difficult and necessary it is to be on this journey to heal ourselves and the beauty that's on the other side of that healing. Listen in as we take the water slide that leads to life (and not the slippery s...2022-10-1849 min
Deconstructing MamasFaith Jenga - Cassie Gottula ShawIn this episode, Cassie Gottula Shaw, a fellow deconstructing mama and brilliant faith researcher, walks us through something she's deemed "faith Jenga." Listen in as we chat through the blocks of our faith, the carefully constructed faith towers we build, what we do with the blocks we want to pull out and throw away, and what we can work with the ones we want to keep going forward as we rebuild our new faith structure. She says this: "I finally took out that last block in my “faith Jenga” tower and it all came crashing down. I expected it to hit...2022-10-1136 min
Deconstructing MamasWhat is Seeping In? - Pete EnnsThis week on the podcast, we dive deeper with Pete Enns as we continue to navigate the tricky tightrope of parenting while deconstructing toxic religious systems and reconstructing our faith with love and freedom. One of the big questions we ask each other is this: WHAT IS SEEPING IN?You definitely don't want to miss out on the sarcastic and very funny banter between Pete and Lizz and Esther's somewhat futile attempts to bring the two of them back in line (insert funny emoji here).SHOW NOTES:Pete Enns, wife to...2022-10-0450 min
Deconstructing MamasBetter Than Purity - Brittany Meng"We need to embrace better questions when we try to help relationships thrive, rejecting shame and judgment, and instead focusing on love, respect, and boundaries that encompass the entire expression of what it means to be human and healthy. "In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Brittany Meng of the Bam Blog, dives deep with us into the toxic nature of purity culture. SHOW NOTES:Brittany is a mom of five, military wife, fellow sojourner in "curious faith" land, crafter and Etsy shop owner, brilliant and br...2022-09-2752 min
Deconstructing MamasBegin with the End in Mind - Brian McLaren"Faith before doubt is about correct beliefs. Faith after doubt is about revolutionary love. Love is our ultimate goal." (Faith After Doubt) In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Brian McLaren, author of that quote, is a stalwart in the arena of faith and deconstructing. Brian wisely and warmly guides us gently through the four stages of childhood/faith and how to work through them in ourselves and in our own parenting.Plus, you'll find out his secret passion (hint: has something to do with sea wi...2022-09-2046 min
Deconstructing MamasGood (Hard) Grief - Lizz & EstherWho knew that when we asked our first question about the faith that was either handed down to us or we grabbed onto with all our might when someone shared the "good news," there would be so much loss associated with it.We were just asking a question, right?We were just pulling back the curtain to see what was going on behind there, right?But here we are, and one question turned into another and another and another, and we perhaps find ourselves with more questions than answers and the curtain has not only...2022-09-1348 min
Deconstructing MamasYour Next Step - Erica Garthwaite (*BONUS SUMMER EPISODE*)"I can't see a way through," said the boy."Can you see your next step," said the horse."Yes," said the boy."Just take that," said the horse.(Charlie Mackesy) In this BONUS SUMMER episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Erica Garthwaite, friend of Lizz and Esther (and part of their book club) brings her mic-drop wisdom to the table when it comes to navigating difficult topics with your kids as you deconstruct and they have questions.SHOW NOTES: Erica is the "So...2022-08-0234 min
Deconstructing MamasConnecting to Your True Self - Liz Milani"Life is always moving. You have permission to move with it, to leave behind the things that do not serve you, and become someone new, someone more like you, more like your true self."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Liz Milani, author of that quote, author of the PracticeCo app (daily devotionals that are holistic, inclusive and cliche-free) shares her heart with us and our need to discover and connect with our true selves.SHOW NOTES:Liz is one-of-a-kind. Her tender, yet very passionate heart, along w...2022-05-2443 min
Deconstructing MamasThe Relief Grief Sandwich - Cindy Wang Brandt"Parenting may be less about raising our children and more about raising ourselves. It compels us to break our own cycles of shame and pain as we bring healing to our own childhood."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Cindy Wang Brandt, author of that quote, cohost on the Parenting Forward podcast and author of Parenting Forward, really digs deep into the subject of religious trauma and how that plays out in parenting. How can we heal ourselves, make good boundaries with our families of origin and give ourselves grace and space in the process? 2022-05-1743 min
Deconstructing MamasLove Matters More - Jared Byas"You can't love and control at the same time."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Jared Byas, author of that quote, cohost on the Bible for Normal People podcast and author of Love Matters More, not only tells us what brought him to the place of deconstructing and reconstructing his faith, but speaks about the impact it has had on his parenting. There are so mic drops moments where Jared unpacks what it really means to love well and why we cannot love and control people (and especially our kids) at the same...2022-05-1036 min
Deconstructing MamasTrusting Myself - Sarah Meassick"I sink beneath the swirling surf of words, fears, expectations, conditioning, and advice—and feel for the Knowing." Glennon Doyle)In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Sarah Meassick, daughter of podcast host, Esther Joy Goetz, takes us deep into her childhood journey of fear, anxiety and the desire to be the "good girl" and how this manifested in full-blown OCD at a very young age, reinforced and perpetuated by the rigid faith system she grew up with (which many of us can relate to).Sarah and Esther walk through the...2022-05-0343 min
Deconstructing MamasYou're Not Alone - Jordan Harrell"When I started writing about deconstruction, I shared because I needed to know there were others out there like me. Now I share because I sincerely believe what I'm learning is good news."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Jordan Harrell, author of that quote, brings her full self to this raw and healing conversation surrounding issues of rejection and exclusion in the small (c) church today. She unpacks her own story down this road to freedom and reminds us all that we are not alone no matter how much it feels that way. Phew! Li...2022-04-2634 min
Deconstructing MamasOut of Oppression - NakedPastor (David Hayward)"If we had total support, we would change more easily. It's the fear of rejection that prevents our transformation."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, David Hayward, author of that quote, and known as NakedPastor around the internet, allows us to pepper him with your (and our) questions in this "Q&A" style format on this episode. Here are some of our favorites:1. Why "naked," why "pastor," and why those two words together?2. What was the turning point in your spiritual journey that gave you new lenses to see cl...2022-04-1937 min
Deconstructing MamasYou Do Not Have to Be Good - Jenny Shannon"If you, too, find yourself eating your words when a crisis hits: 1. You're not alone and, 2. Being wrong can suck, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't also be delicious."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Jenny Shannon, author of that quote, tackles the harmful and toxic ideology of "being a good girl" and how that one phrase by renowned poet, Mary Oliver, "You do not have to be good" brought great healing to her broken heart and freed her up to figure out what had been haunting her all her life and what could change...2022-04-1238 min
Deconstructing MamasComing In - Shelby and Kahrin Spear"When love speaks and both sides listen, hearts connect and healing begins." In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Shelby, author of that quote, and her daughter, Kahrin, share their heart-breaking and hope-filled "coming in" story about the journey to healing for both of them after Kahrin discovers that she likes girls.Shelby and Kahrin's fierce desire to finding healing and love after years of hopelessness and destruction from rigid faith systems and toxic beliefs will leave you dumbfounded, grabbing for tissues and a lot more healed yourself. If you know someone, love someone o...2022-04-0550 min
Deconstructing MamasWho Doesn't Love Cheese? And Freedom? - Stevie Swift"You don't HAVE to get married." In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Stevie Swift, author of that quote, shares her story of reorienting herself from a narrow and rigid place of falling in line with social constructs to the wide-open space of freedom to be herself and what it means to gift that to her son.Stevie's "out-of-the-box" lifestyle and down-right wisdom about what it means to have permission to live freely will feel like a breath of fresh air and you may want to "be her when you grow up." We sure...2022-03-2941 min
Deconstructing MamasSnakes Don't Talk - Pete Enns“When the dust clears and in the quiet of your own heart, what kind of God do you believe in, really? And why?” (The Sin of Certainty - CHECK IT OUT HERE).In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Pete Enns, author of that quote and Lizz's dad, candidly shares his own journey of deconstruction and how his own "sin of certainty" played out in his parenting, especially the harm it caused to his children and to himself.Pete's wisdom as a Bible nerd and scholar, along with his witty humor and down-to-earth explanations (for...2022-03-2252 min
Deconstructing MamasTake a Smoke Break - Sarah Bragg“Curiosity is the opposite of certainty. Curiosity isn’t about right or wrong or should or shouldn’t. Those words are about certainty.” (page 163 of A Mother's Guide to Raising Herself - CHECK IT OUT HERE)."Raising kids highlighted just how uncertain life was, but my faith was wholly tied to certainty. Therein lies the tension. So I decided to be curious."In this episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Sarah Bragg, author of those two quotes and fellow deconstructing mama of two tweens, dives deep into the ways she has had to lean away from cer...2022-03-1542 min
Deconstructing MamasUntil It Doesn't - Esther Joy GoetzIn our second episode on the Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Esther Joy Goetz, the second half of the dynamic hosting duo, shares her story of growing up in a developing war-torn country with her Evangelical missionary parents and how this impacted her faith journey. Listen in to hear how it all came down to this formula: “Do all the right things, make all the right, godly choices and life goes the way it should.” UNTIL IT DOESN'TWhat happens then? How can we be led by love instead of pushed by fear...2022-03-0844 min
Deconstructing MamasNot Quite Enough - Lizz Enns PettersTo launch our Deconstructing Mamas podcast, Lizz Enns Petters, one of the dynamic hosting duo, shares her story of hardship, heartbreak, and hope. Find out how "not quite good enough and not quite bad enough" landed her in some very unlikely real life spaces and why she started to go down the path to deconstruct her faith and what good words she has for you today.SHOW NOTES:Lizz Enns Petters, daughter of Bible scholar, Pete Enns, is on a mission to bring hope into the most awful of places, where mental health s...2022-03-0143 min