Shows
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E9 - What Does it Mean to "Buy American"?Do you “buy American?” If so, what does that mean? Does it mean you “buy American” all of the time? Does it mean you purchase only those items that are both sourced and manufactured in the United States? Or, does it mean you purchase items that are “made in the USA” but with materials that come from outside the country? What about services?To “buy American” may not be as easy as it once was, with or without tariffs. In today’s podcast Lamar and Tom talk about their experiences of buying American, how it has changed over t...2025-04-281h 00
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E8 - Truth, Truthiness, and Not So Truthy ConversationsCivil conversations and dialogue are made more difficult when participants are not speaking honestly, are simply parroting the ideas of others, or are unwilling to consider being changed through dialogue. In this episode, Lamar and Tom talk about conversations in which truth is illusive, and truthiness is not valued.Learn more: The work of Alan Yarborough and his organization, Habits of Discourse, was part of the inspiration of this episode:https://www.habitsofdiscourse.com/How We Check OurselvesFact Checking: Because there are a lot of things happening…some tru...2025-04-1446 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E7 - Oddly True for April Fools' DayOn this April Fools’ Day eve Lamar and Tom have a bit of fun with some of the odd but true stories in the news. Hey, we all need a break when things have been pretty heavy in the world, right? Thankfully we have April Fools’ Day to help us out. Learn more: News stories that inspired today’s show: The price of eggs is coming downhttps://www.newsweek.com/price-eggs-rising-falling-cost-2042992 Royal Shrovetidehttps://apnews.com/article/royal-shrovetide-ashbourne-ancient-soccer-murder-880658c923b33288df42af109d25e458?utm_source=copy&utm_m...2025-03-3148 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E6 - A Table Talk on Crime-Punishment-and-PardonsPresident Trump pardoned or commuted the sentences of nearly 1,600 people who committed “certain offenses” at the United States Capitol on January 6, 2021. As these folks return to their homes, how do their communities respond to them? Inspired by a story of one such J6 defendant in the New York Times, Lamar and Tom have a Table Talk on crimes, punishments, and pardons. Learn more: Pardoned for January 6, She Came Home to a New Reality: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/21/nyregion/jan-6-capitol-pardon.html?unlocked_article_code=1.zU4.-MQ9.AiB_aYF8KsAL&smid=url-share Presidential Actions: Grantin...2025-03-1759 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E5 A Table Talk on the Early Days of the New AdministrationWhat is new was old. What is old is new again. This is true of many things, including politics. On January 20th Donald J. Trump became President of the United States again for the second time. It has been a fast-paced and interesting (some would say “frightening”) few weeks. In this podcast Lamar and Tom scootch up to the kitchen table, pour a cup of coffee, and talk about what has been happening. Join us!Learn more: News stories that inspired today’s show: What is Elon Musk’s job? https://www.nytimes.com/2025/0...2025-03-031h 01
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E4 - Heidi & Guy Burgess - Part 2Part 2 of 2. Lamar and Tom talk with Heidi and Guy Burgess who have been life and professional partners for more than 50 years. They received their PhDs in sociology in the same year from the University of Colorado.
In the late 1980s they received a grant from the Hewlett Foundation to start a conflict resolution "theory-building center" that is now known as the Conflict Information Consortium. In addition to directing the Consortium, both Guy and Heidi taught peace and conflict at the University of Colorado, the University of Denver, and in George Mason University's School for Conflict Analysis...2025-02-171h 08
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomSE3E3 - Guy & Heidi Burgess - Part 1Part 1 of 2. Lamar and Tom talk with Heidi and Guy Burgess who have been life and professional partners for more than 50 years. They received their PhDs in sociology in the same year from the University of Colorado.
In the late 1980s they received a grant from the Hewlett Foundation to start a conflict resolution "theory-building center" that is now known as the Conflict Information Consortium. In addition to directing the Consortium, both Guy and Heidi taught peace and conflict at the University of Colorado, the University of Denver, and in George Mason University's School for Conflict Analysis...2025-02-031h 16
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E2 - More Conversation on The Social Dilemma - Part 2What is your relationship with social media? Do you love it? Do you hate it? Do you avoid it? What if there are good reasons to love it, hate it, and avoid it - all at once? In this podcast Lamar and Tom are joined by their friend, colleague, and charity culture catalyst Ed Shrager from London. They each had the assignment of watching the Netflix documentary/docudrama “The Social Dilemma” that provides an inside look at social media through the perspective of the people who developed it in the past…but now question its value. In this two-part podcas...2025-01-2044 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS3E1 - Conversation on The Social Dilemma - Part 1What is your relationship with social media? Do you love it? Do you hate it? Do you avoid it? What if there are good reasons to love it, hate it, and avoid it - all at once? In this podcast Lamar and Tom are joined by their friend, colleague, and charity culture catalyst Ed Shrager from London. They each had the assignment of watching the Netflix documentary/docudrama “The Social Dilemma” that provides an inside look at social media through the perspective of the people who developed it in the past…but now question its value. In this two-part podcas...2025-01-0737 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E21 - It's a Wrap! 2024 and Season 2About this Episode
It’s a wrap on Season 2 of Getting to 3rd Space with Lamar and Tom and on 2024. In this episode Lamar and Tom talk about holiday traditions and foods and they discuss their favorite Christmas movies. They take a few minutes to reflect on what they’ve learned doing the podcast in 2024 and what they would like to do in the future. They wander briefly into politics to discuss the most recent Congressional budget debacle. Finally, they remember the contributions of Tony Campolo to their lives, a minister and sociologist who passed away on Nove...2024-12-2348 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E20 - Journalist Alex BhattacharjiToday Lamar and Tom welcome award winning journalist Alex Battacharji to Getting to 3rd Space. Alex is the author of ‘We Didn’t Know What Was Next. Nobody Tells You.’ on Inc.com published on December 2,2024. The article is about the mass shooting at Excel Industries eight years later. Excel is where Lamar was the head of human resources at the time of the shooting. Previously we have aired an interview with Lamar about his experience. As with those previous podcasts, we want to let people know that some of our discussion may include descriptions of violence. If this podcas...2024-12-091h 21
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E19 - Donald Trump's Cabinet Picks and Our Thanksgiving SpecialDuring this past couple of weeks President-elect Donald Trump has been making nominations for his cabinet. In today’s podcast Lamar and Tom talk about a few of his nominations. Please note, though, that politics and news changes quickly and so did at least one of his nominees discussed in this podcast. By the time we posted this podcast to the internet about 4 days later, the nominee had withdrawn. That’s how things happen sometimes, and so we have to be prepared to swerve and then keep going. Also, this podcast is also a Thanksgiving Holiday Special for Lamar and...2024-11-2555 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E18 - The 2024 Presidential ElectionThe 2024 Presidential Election
The 2024 Presidential Election is over. It’s been a long and eventful political season. In this episode Lamar and Tom discuss their thoughts on it.
About This Episode
They also talk about errant tumbleweeds, meteors (or possibly space junk), and upcoming podcasts.
Please note: In the last few minutes of the podcast, a software issue caused our images to "flip" (change places) on the screen. You are not imagining it and it is nothing to be concerned about. It did not impact the flow of the podcast. We jus...2024-11-111h 04
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E16 - We Are Back...AlmostWow, life happens and sometimes it can be exciting even if it is disruptive. In our case it has been both exciting and disruptive, and we needed to suspend our podcast briefly but we are working our way back. We’ve recorded this brief podcast to catch you up on what has been happening. And, wow, have we missed a lot of stuff while we’ve been away.
We are taking a brief hiatus but we’ll be back sooner than you might imagine. Maybe even sooner than you had hoped!
Thanks for your patience and ke...2024-09-2224 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E15 - Quieting the Noise of this Political SeasonWhether we like it, love it, or hate it, we are now in the midst of a full-blown Presidential campaign. The news just keeps happening. After the assassination attempt on former President Donald Trump, President Joe Biden decided to end his run for a second term. He endorsed his Vice President, Kamala Harris, and all political parties are now in full campaign mode. As a result, conversations about politics will be unavoidable for most of us. Though we try to avoid politics in our podcast, we are going to try something a bit different. We are going to talk...2024-08-0551 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E14 - An Assassination Attempt and Turning Down the TempWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
As we were preparing for our next podcast, former President Donald Trump survived an assassination attempt in Butler, Pennsylvania. One bullet grazed his right ear and bullets struck three people in the audience. One died and two others were seriously wounded. In this episode, Lamar and Tom talk about the escalation of violent rhetoric in the 2024 U.S. Presidential campaign and the need to turn down the temperature by choosing our words and language more carefully. They discuss four suggestions for making this campaign more civil in the...2024-07-2254 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E13 - Excel Shooting Part 2Welcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
CONTENT ADVISORY: THIS EPISODE OF GETTING TO 3RD SPACE WITH LAMAR AND TOM DISCUSSES A MASS SHOOTING, WITH FATALITIES, AND ITS AFTERMATH.
In our last podcast we started a conversation with Lamar about the February 25, 2016 mass shooting at Excel Industries in Hesston, Kansas. Lamar was the Director of Human Resources at Excel and his leadership role thrust him into the midst of dealing with the shooting and its aftermath on behalf of the company. That’s what we discussed in our last podcast.
Today, tho...2024-07-0847 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E12 - Excel Shooting Part 1Welcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
CONTENT ADVISORY: THIS EPISODE OF GETTING TO 3RD SPACE WITH LAMAR AND TOM DISCUSSES A MASS SHOOTING, WITH FATALITIES, AND ITS AFTERMATH.
On February 25, 2016, Lamar Roth, cohost of Getting to 3rd Space with Lamar and Tom, was Director of Human Resources for Excel Manufacturing in Hesston, Kansas. Cedric Ford, an Excel employee, entered the building and began shooting. That day four people died, including Cedric, more than a dozen others were wounded, and many, many more in Hesston, Kansas were traumatized by the events.
In this podcast, and the next...2024-06-2752 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E11 - Conversation with Kansas State Senator Carolyn McGinnLamar and Tom talk with Kansas State Senator Carolyn McGinn
In today’s podcast Lamar and Tom welcome Kansas State Senator Carolyn McGinn. Senator McGinn has represented the 31st District as a Republican since 2005. Prior to serving in the Kansas Senate, she was a Sedgwick County Commissioner. She and her husband, Mark, own and operate McGinn’s Grapes and Grain, a family farm outside of Wichita, Kansas.
In 2012 Senator McGinn was one of nine Kansas senators whose seats were targeted by members of the “Right Wing” of the Republican party. She was the only one who was a...2024-06-1059 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomA Getting to 3rd Space Redux: Barriers, Bears, & Gummy Bears (S1E3)Welcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
If you are in the United States, it is a holiday (Memorial Day). Tom’s out chasing a golf ball around a local golf course and Lamar is out taking more beautiful photos. At least, that’s what we hope we are doing today. In our absence, we are offering a redux of one of our earliest podcasts from October 21, 2023. We titled it Barriers, Bears, and Gummy Bears.
We won’t say it is a “Best of” Getting to Third Space because we were still learning a lot about...2024-05-2742 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E10 - A Table Talk about Gun RegulationAbout Today’s Episode - A Table Talk on Gun Regulation
Today’s show features a Table Talk about gun regulation. You’ll remember that Table Talk is a new, occasional feature that we’ll include in Getting to Third Space. It was inspired by the kitchen table in the farm homes we grew up in where it was a central gathering place. Not only did we eat there, but we played games, entertained guests, and had conversations. Sometimes the conversations were light and fun. Sometimes they were serious conversations about differing ideas and perspectives on important issues...2024-05-1348 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E9 A Table Talk about Self-Driving VehiclesWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this episode we introduce a new feature for the podcast: Table Talk. In the farm homes where we both grew up, the kitchen table was a central gathering place. Not only did we eat there, but we played games, entertained guests, and had conversations. Sometimes the conversations were light and fun. Sometimes they were serious conversations about differing ideas and perspectives on important issues. In this Table Talk, we will pose a question and then discuss it together, much in the same way we would as if w...2024-04-2937 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E8 - Perception & RealityWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast Lamar and Tom tackle the subject of perception and reality. They talk about how one’s perception informs, even creates, their reality and how that can impact one’s credibility in dialogue and conversation.
Learn more:
Links to items related to the show, for example:
What we know: South Carolina's SEC tourney ends with fight, multiple ejections (ESPN) https://www.espn.com/womens-college-basketball/story/_/id/39703311/south-carolina-lsu-fight-sec-women-ncaa-tournament-kamilla-cardoso
Katie Britt Accused of Misleading Statement in State of the Union Respons...2024-04-1659 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E7 - April Fools, Technology & Authentic CommunicationWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
Technology can be either a friend or foe in Third Space dialogues. In this show Lamar and Tom pick up on a comment from a listener who felt we were missing an important point in having Third Space dialogues: the role of technology in communication. Today Lamar and Tom explore the ways it can be useful and not so useful in Third Space.
Learn more:
Here is a mixture of articles (business, personal opinion, and academic) and a video that highlight some of the i...2024-04-0146 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and Tom20240318 S2E6 What are First and Second SpacesWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
You know that a Third Space is a place of conversation and dialogue where everything can be on the table for open, straightforward, honest, and respectful inquiry. If this is a Third Space, what does a First and Second space look like? That’s the question Lamar and Tom explore in this episode. What do you think? How does your experience of First and Second space line up with theirs?
Ways to Hear and See Getting to Third Space
Getting to Third Space is on...2024-03-181h 01Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E5 - Part 2 - Conversation with Ed ShragerWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
This is part 2 of our conversation with Ed Shrager. In this podcast Lamar & Tom talk with Ed from his home in London. Ed is a Charity Culture Catalyst who works with charities (nonprofits) in the United Kingdom to help them strengthen their organizational culture. Through resources and facilitation he helps them create more human and humane organizations for employees and their clients. Ed is also the creator The King Prawn, an app to help people in the workplace build more connected relationships for collaboration. Finally, Ed has become...2024-03-0448 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomA Conversation with Charity Culture Catalyst Ed Shrager - Part 1Welcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast Lamar & Tom talk with Ed Shrager from his home in London. Ed is a Charity Culture Catalyst who works with charities (nonprofits) in the United Kingdom to help them strengthen their organizational culture. Through resources and facilitation he helps them create more human and humane organizations for employees and their clients. Ed is also the creator The King Prawn, an app to help people in the workplace build more connected relationships for collaboration. Finally, Ed has become quite comfortable working with Artificial Intelligence and talks...2024-02-1947 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E3 - Lamar & Tom Talk About Third PLACESWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast Lamar & Tom talk about third spaces and third places. explore what and where the third space is and if we just visit or if we reside there. During our interview with Seth Kaplan in the last podcast, he responded to a question about what Tom and I could do to build trust in communities. Seth suggested that it is important to literally share the table with others. Eat meals, drink, and socialize together as a way to build trust. Oftentimes in the literature, a Third...2024-02-0548 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E2 - A Conversation with Seth Kaplan - Part 2Welcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
This is the second part of a two-part interview with Seth Kaplan, who is the author of a new book titled “Fragile Neighborhoods.” Seth Kaplan is recognized globally for his expertise in “fragile states” and has applied some of his understanding of fragile states to the neighborhoods in which people live. If you haven’t listened to Part 1, we strongly encourage you to do so. You can find it on your favorite podcast platform and a video version can be found on the Tenacious Change Channel on YouTube. Part 1 is...2024-02-0145 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomMeet Lamar, Tom, and Getting to Third Space (Trailer)Isn't it time you checked us out?
Join Lamar Roth & Tom Klaus (two former clergy, former counselors, and still lifelong friends) in this newish podcast on how to talk with one another. Together they explore how to get to a Third Space - a space where two or more people with opposing viewpoints, ideologies, and worldviews can come together to hear, listen, share, and connect with one another. Together Lamar and Tom hope to carve out a Third Space where everything can be on the table for open, straightforward, honest, and, yet kind and respectful inquiry.
...2024-01-0801 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS2E1 - A Conversation with Seth Kaplan-Part 1Welcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
To kick-off Season 2, Lamar & Tom have a special guest. Seth Kaplan is the author of a new book titled “Fragile Neighborhoods.” Seth Kaplan is recognized globally for his expertise in “fragile states.” A “fragile state” is one that has experienced the loss of physical control of its territory or a monopoly on the legitimate use of force; an erosion of legitimate authority to make collective decisions; an inability to provide reasonable public services; and the inability to interact with other states as a full member of the international community. B...2024-01-0854 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS1E6 - Season 1 Wrap Up and Seasons GreetingsWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
To mark the end of Season 1, Lamar & Tom talk about their lessons learned since they started this podcast adventure. From cameras to microphones to attempts at humor, nothing escapes their consideration. The wrap up this podcast with season’s greetings and stories of an unexpected ingredient in a Chopt salad and a man obsessed with the movie “Titanic.” The podcast will return after January 4th for Season 2.
Learn more about the healing of a divide in Silverton, CO: https://www.nytimes.com/2023/11/30/us/politics/silverton-division.html?search...2023-12-0740 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS1E5 - Conversation with Representative Stephen OwensWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast, Lamar & Tom talk with their first ever guest, Stephen Owens, representing the 74th District in the Kansas House of Representatives. They talk with Steve about the unique challenges facing politicians in a highly charged and divisive environment which can make civil conversations challenging and sometimes even impossible.
Learn more about Stephen Owens, representing the 74th District in the Kansas House of Representatives:
State of Kansas, House of Representatives House Web - https://www.kslegislature.org/li_2022/b2021_22/members/rep_owens_stephen_1/
Representative Stephen...2023-11-2753 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS1E4 - Five Factors for Civil Conversations & Unusual Health Risks in the NewsWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast Lamar and Tom discuss five factors that contribute to having civil conversations: trust, respect, honesty, reciprocity (or mutuality or shared responsibility), and ownership.
See for Yourself! Links for Episode 4:
Iowa woman attempts to bring giraffe feces into state: https://www.huffpost.com/entry/bc-us-odd-giraffe-poop-seized_n_65202924e4b091a3dc2714a0
Wales children’s charity says “thanks but not thanks” to donated sex toys: https://www.upi.com/Odd_News/2023/10/27/wales-Barbardos-thrift-store-marital-aids/1631698426631/
Craig Ferguson: Does This Need to Be Said? Fu...2023-11-1145 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS1E3 - Barriers, Bears, and Gummy BearsWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast, released on October 21, 2023, Lamar & Tom discuss barriers and guidelines for productive civil conversations. The barriers they consider are internal barriers - those attitudes, ideas, expectations, even beliefs we hold - that may hold us back from engaging in civil conversation with people whose ideas, opinions, experiences, and lives are different from our own. Then they offer four guidelines for overcoming or “checking” those barriers to make it easier to engage others.
They also take a moment to talk about and enjoy the antics of b...2023-10-2041 min
Getting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS1E2 - Noam Chomsky, Exhausted Americans, & Bob the Old GoatWelcome to Getting to Third Space with Lamar & Tom!
In this podcast, released on September 26, 2023, they discuss this quote, submitted by a listener, from Noam Chomsky, which appeared in his 1998 book, “The Common Good.”
“The smart way to keep people passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum. That gives people the sense of that there is free thinking going on while all the time the presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limit put on the range of the debate.”
Th...2023-09-2640 minGetting to Third Space with Lamar and TomS1E1 Introducing Getting to Third Space with Lamar & TomJoin Lamar Roth & Tom Klaus (two former clergy, former counselors, and still lifelong friends after all these years) in this podcast on how to talk with one another. Together they explore how to get to a Third Space - a space where two or more people with opposing viewpoints, ideologies, and worldviews can come together to hear, listen, share, and connect with one another. Together Lamar and Tom hope to carve out a Third Space where everything can be on the table for open, straightforward, honest, and, yet kind and respectful inquiry.
Honestly, getting to Third Space ha...2023-09-1331 min