Shows
Songwriters on ProcessMike Campbell (Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, The Dirty Knobs)ED NOTE: Here's my recent episode with Benmont Tench, keyboardist for Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers. Mike Campbell doesn't have songwriting rules. He doesn't need any because he's always creating. "I'm probably writing as I'm talking to you," Campbell told me. In fact, Campbell's problem is that he can't stop coming up with ideas and sometimes wishes he could dial it back a bit. But that's what happens when you keep a guitar next to every chair in your house. Not just in every room, but next to every chair. ...2025-04-1444 minSongwriters on ProcessJake Duzsik of HEALTHHere's a sampling of the authors and artists that Jake Duzsik of HEALTH mentioned in our conversation: Pascal, T.S. Eliot, William Blake, Vonnegut, Joan Didion, Truman Capote, Oscar Wilde, Thomas Pynchon, Camus, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Cormac McCarthy. And somewhere along the lines, we discussed postmodern prose. To be clear, Duzsik was not name checking. It reflects how deeply his creative mind operates. HEALTH's latest album Rat Wars is out now. And shameless plug: if you're a fan of HEALTH, you might also be a Lamb of God fan. So buy Desolation: A Heavy Metal Memoir by M...2024-09-161h 05Songwriters on ProcessDIIVAll four members of DIIV (Zachary Cole Smith, Andrew Bailey, Colin Caulfield, Ben Newman) joined me to talk about their individual songwriting processes. This interview could've gone on forever because they are so passionate about creativity. What's interesting is that their individual songwriting processes don't have too much in common, but perhaps how those differences play off each other is why they make such good music. DIIV's new album Frog in Boiling Water is out now on Fantasy Records. 2024-05-2858 minSongwriters on ProcessEric Earley of Blitzen TrapperDoes the mind of Eric Earley from Blitzen Trapper ever rest? I think not. After all, he told me that he liked to solve math problems in college while he was making breakfast. Earley is a voracious reader who just finished his self-proclaimed "Time of the Tomes," in which he read nothing but, well, tomes. (The longer, the better. Infinite Jest? Please. Kid's stuff).Earley has a family and his other occupation involves working with the homeless population in Portland, so he's not quite as active as he used to be. But that's only because he doesn't h...2024-05-1950 minSongwriters on ProcessDeerladyDeerlady is Mali Obomsawin and Magdalena Abrego, and their debut album Greatest Hits is my favorite album of the year, and this is also one of my favorite interviews because we had so much fun. I first heard Deerlady while listening to my old college radio station, WTHS at Hope College in Holland, Michigan. They played "Bounty," and it was one of those moments when you hear a song for the first time, stop whatever it is that you're doing, love it immediately, then listen to the entire album. The backstory to Greatest Hits is fa...2024-05-1154 minSongwriters on ProcessAaron Lee TasjanAaron Lee Tasjan has a pretty simple writing process: he gets up around 8am, has a glass of water, and pets his cat. Then he writes. But not every day. "I only write when my body tells me to, when I can go off yesterday's fumes," he told me. And in one of the best rituals I've ever heard, Tasjan always writes with a pencil--but never uses the eraser. "I hate erasers," he says.Tasjan lives in Nashville, where the Frist Art Museum serves as a tremendous source of inspiration for his songs. His new album Stellar...2024-04-2946 minSongwriters on ProcessJane Penny (TOPS)Jane Penny, co-founder of TOPS, makes her solo debut with her fantastic EP Surfacing, out now on Luminelle Recordings. Penny stops by the podcast to talk about how Barry White has influenced her songwriting; why she has to write her lyrics in cursive; and why when you see her in the audience at a show and she's looking at her phone, she's actually deeply engaged in the creative process. She promises!I'm a big fan of TOPS, so this was a lot of of fun. 2024-04-1550 minSongwriters on ProcessGrace CummingsOn this episode of the podcast, Grace Cummings talks about why her phone has been such a drain on her creativity and why she's making a conscious effort to stay away from it. But sometimes that phone can be pretty useful. For one, it allows Cummings to create her alter ego Cheryl. (You'll understand once you listen.) And it also allows her to create a fantastic filing system for her song ideas with labels like "excellent" and "very excellent" that we both agreed are pretty good mini pep-talks. Cummings's new album Ramona is out April 5 on ATO R...2024-03-3047 minSongwriters on ProcessHovvdyWill Taylor and Charlie Martin of Hovvdy take a deep dive into their songwriting processes on the podcast. We delve into, among other things, the nuts and bolts of the revision process and whether distance is important when writing about an event.Hovvdy's new (double!) album Hovvdy is out April 26 on Arts & Crafts Records.2024-03-2442 minSongwriters on ProcessDucks Ltd.Evan Lewis and Tom McGreevy of Ducks Ltd seem to be at opposite ends of the creative spectrum when it comes to organization. Lewis likes chaos: "The process should be a disaster," he says. McGreevy, on the other hand, needs order. His writing process involves emailing lyrics to himself, editing them, then sending the edited version to himself. Over and over. This allows McGreevy to see the version history of the lyrics in one giant email thread. The new Ducks Ltd. album Harm's Way is out now on Carpark Records. I'm very proud that not once...2024-03-1054 minSongwriters on ProcessFuture IslandsFuture Islands stops by today to talk about their individual and collective processes, which sometimes involves folding laundry and listening to trains. They've also earned the title of Most Well-Read Band I've Ever Interviewed: just listen to the dizzying number of favorite authors and literary influences they all have. That discussion alone could've been an entire episode. The new album by Future Islands is called People Who Aren't There Anymore, out now on 4AD Records. 2024-03-0347 minSongwriters on ProcessMartin Courtney of Real Estate, the sequelI had such a good time interviewing Martin Courtney of Real Estate back in 2022 for his solo album that we're doing it again! This time, Real Estate has a great new album out called Daniel on Domino Records. Courtney and I once again go deep into his songwriting process, including how it's changed since his solo album. And of course we talk children's literature too. 2024-02-2043 minSongwriters on ProcessJohnny MarrJohnny Marr (The Smiths, The Cribs, Modest Mouse, The The, so many more) is arguably one of the greatest and most influential guitarists of the last 50 years. So don't waste any time reading this intro. Just listen to the podcast. It's one of my favorites. Lots of talk about our favorite authors and some great stories too!Marr's latest album Spirit Power: The Best of Johnny Marr is out now. His book Marr's Guitars is out too. 2024-02-0955 minSongwriters on ProcessMary TimonyUntame the Tiger (Merge Records) is Mary Timony's first solo album in 15 years, and it's so good, from start to finish. For the uninitiated: Timony's bands have included Helium, Autoclave, Wild Flag, and Ex-Hex. All fantastic. Last year Rolling Stone named her #95 on the top 200 greatest guitarists of all time. To get to this stage of excellence, Timony's process involves writing garbage. "The only thing that works for me is writing a lot of bad stuff I really don't like," she says. Timony writes in the morning then sets it aside. "The most important part of my pro...2024-01-3149 minSongwriters on ProcessEliza McLamb & Sarah TudzinYou get two for one in this episode with Eliza McLamb and Sarah Tudzin! Both are songwriters: McLamb's debut album Going Through It is out now, and Tudzin is the founder and frontperson for Illuminati Hotties. We're here this week because Tudzin also produced McLamb's album. But you may also know McLamb as the co-host of the Binchtopia podcast, and I have a feeling you'll be hearing Tudzin's name a couple of times on February 4 because she has three GRAMMY nominations for her work on the boygenius album. 2024-01-2354 minSongwriters on ProcessCarrrie Brownstein of Sleater-Kinney"Writing is a form of contemplation," says Carrie Brownstein of Sleater-Kinney on the podcast. And while it's true that the actual act of putting pen to paper involves contemplating, Brownstein and I agree that the writing process is happening 24/7, not just during the act of transcription. You may not realize it, but you're writing and contemplating as you walk, talk, listen, sleep, eat, watch tv, whatever.But when it comes time for Brownstein to actually put pen to paper, nothing beats a good old cheap couch she found on Craigslist. As you'll hear, it's the cheapness that m...2024-01-1449 minSongwriters on ProcessJosh Radnor"When I write songs, I put on a miner's light and try to make it around the next corner."Josh Radnor found fame playing Ted Mosby on "How I Met Your Mother," but he's also a terrific songwriter (and stage actor) with a new album Eulogy: Volume 1. Radnor stops by the podcast as we take a deep dive into his songwriting process. We talk about how his creative process as an actor intersects with his songwriting process, why he often starts with a lyrical idea and not a melody, and why procrastination can be a very good t...2024-01-0150 minSongwriters on ProcessJaime WyattI was already a Jaime Wyatt fan before we talked, but our shared affinity for the poet E.E. Cummings made this episode even more fun. I also knew this would be a good convo after reading an Instagram post where Wyatt declared, "I love words. And language. Always been a word nerd and love phrases that have dual meanings." Amazing!Wyatt's latest album Feel Good is out now on New West Records. 2023-12-1947 minSongwriters on ProcessBuffalo Nichols"The times when I'm writing the most are when I'm reading a lot," Carl "Buffalo" Nichols says on today's podcast. And wow is this true: you cannot be a writer of any stripe unless you read. Nichols likes to read voices that he cannot relate to. He mentions writers like Flannery O' Connor and H.L. Mencken, as well as books like A Clockwork Orange and A Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy. He didn't even like them all, but he still felt that hearing those voices makes him a better writer.So on this episode...2023-11-2946 minSongwriters on ProcessDuff McKagan of Guns N' RosesDuff McKagan's latest solo album Lighthouse is dedicated to Cormac McCarthy, which is no surprise given the importance McKagan places on reading. The Guns N' Roses bassist reads without fail every day, so you get some great book recommendations in this episode of the podcast. McKagan doesn't just read for pleasure; he reads to make himself a better person. There's a great post on his Insta page of McKagan in the stacks at the Library of Congress, and he is one happy man in that photo.You'll also learn in this episode why McKagan still has to wr...2023-11-0854 minSongwriters on ProcessJonny Pierce of The DrumsJonny Pierce says that The Drums’ new album Jonny is “a little less practice, a little more mess.” That messiness finally made songwriting enjoyable for him because for a long time, it wasn’t. “I never loved songwriting. I was never the type of songwriter who couldn’t wait to get to the studio,” Pierce says on the podcast. It was always something stressful, he said, because he equated it with literal survival. But now Pierce is trying something different: the mess. Which includes, as you’ll hear, slithering down walls. And he’s much happier for it. Jonny is...2023-10-2754 minSongwriters on ProcessClem Creevy of Cherry Glazerr“I’m allergic to routine. I wake up and follow all my whims and desires. But inspiration strikes every couple of days, and when it does you don’t want to be around me because I have a one track mind,” Clem Creevy of Cherry Glazerr says. That applies even when Creevy’s on a date: she once rolled over in bed and starting singing a beat into her phone, much to the confusion of her bedmate. But when she’s not getting inspired in bed, many of Creevy’s songs start on the ba...2023-10-1344 minSongwriters on ProcessGenesis OwusuGenesis Owusu is the first songwriter to cite Samuel Beckett’s "Waiting for Godot" and Franz Kafka's "The Metamorphosis" as influences. Owusu stops by the podcast to talk about why he's such a huge fan of Beckett and Kafka, what it means to be a "selfish" songwriter, and why he never trusts lyrics that take too long to write.I saw Owusu this summer when he opened for Paramore. What a live show. And his music blows me away; I'm a huge fan. Owusu’s latest album Struggler is out now. 2023-09-2838 minSongwriters on ProcessDevendra Banhart"If you're writing alone, you're still collaborating," Devendra Banhart says on this episode of the podcast. I love that idea: even in solitary writing, you're always running ideas by yourself. Is it the unconscious against the conscious? Reminds me of the time Matt Nathanson told me that he calls his writing partner "The Assassin."What you can't see in the podcast is that behind Banhart was an entire wall of floor to ceiling books as we talked. You can't be a good (song)writer unless you read. No exceptions. And I loved our discussion of why poetry i...2023-09-1652 minSongwriters on ProcessM.C. Taylor of Hiss Golden Messenger“Surprising yourself is the only way to stay inspired,” M.C. Taylor of Hiss Golden Messenger says in this episode of the podcast. This is the second time I've interviewed Taylor, and here are three things I love about him: He's still the only songwriter in thirteen years of this site to discuss his love for haiku and how it influences his process. The thoughtful pause before he responds makes for some incredible answers. Everyone in the Taylor family--MC, wife, and kids--starts their day reading and ends their day reading (not collectively).HGM's latest album Jump for Joy is...2023-09-1057 minSongwriters on ProcessBlondshellSabrina Teitelbaum (aka Blondshell) wants more joy in her songs. But that can be a problem because happiness is not a productive state for her songwriting process. "When I'm happy, I don't feel the need to write as much," she told me. No matter her emotional state, though, the key Teitelbaum's fruitful songwriting process is not making it look too much like a process. The more precious she makes the process, the harder it can be to write. "Normalizing it makes me more productive," she says. For example, Teitelbaum often finds herself inspired at inopportune times, like w...2023-08-2852 minSongwriters on ProcessJerry Harrison of Talking HeadsAt some point in my interview with Jerry Harrison, guitarist and keyboardist for Talking Heads, I asked him to respond to a quote by the iconic Beat poet Allen Ginsberg. Harrison told me that Ginsberg was a friend. And that is why he is Jerry Harrison. Talking Heads are one of the most influential acts of the past 50 years. Call it new wave, art pop, post punk, whatever: any act with that label can at least partially thank Talking Heads. This conversation centers not just on the writing process--Harrison loves felt tip pens because of the "scraping...2023-08-2349 minSongwriters on ProcessJenny Owen YoungsJenny Owen Youngs had me at "Shitty First Drafts." This is the Anne Lamott essay espousing the idea that the first draft of anything is supposed to be atrocious. Just get it down, dammit. "Almost all good writing begins with terrible first efforts," Lamott writes. The polish comes later. I always assigned this essay to my students when I was a professor. The challenge comes when you're a parent, as Youngs is. (We have four kids, so I know the feeling.) How do you even find the time to create multiple drafts and feel like yo...2023-08-1749 minSongwriters on ProcessBethany CosentinoED note: I mispronounced Cosentino’s name in the podcast intro: the first “o” should be long (as in snow), but I used a short “o” (as in top). I’m sorry Bethany!If you have plans to meet Bethany Cosentino and she’s late, look outside. There’s a good chance she’s there writing. Cosentino loves to write in her car—when it’s not moving, of course. She gets great ideas just sitting in it. “I’ll be late to things because I’ve been sitting in my car for to...2023-07-2845 minSongwriters on ProcessJohn McCauley & Ian O'Neil of Deer TickJohn McCauley and Ian O’Neil of Deer Tick stop by talk about what makes for an effective songwriting process. In no particular order: laundry rooms, a kitchen, a nice rug, running shoes, recumbent bikes, Raymond Carver, and turn signals. Deer Tick’s latest album is Emotional Contracts, out now on ATO Records.2023-07-1945 minSongwriters on ProcessEmile MosseriAcademy Award nominee Emile Mosseri stops by the podcast to talk about the challenges that come with writing a solo album when all you’ve known is collaboration (his time in The Dig) and film & television composing (like his film score for Minari , for which he received a 2021 Academy Award nomination for Best Original Score). We talk about why he likes to write when he’s not supposed to be writing, why having a child is often good for his process, and why social media is never good for it. Mosseri’s debut solo album Heaven Hunters is out n...2023-07-0340 minSongwriters on ProcessJosh RitterJosh Ritter stops by Songwriters on Process to declare that while we like to think he writes with a quill pen, he actually writes almost all of his lyrics on his phone. That's a first: many songwriters tell me they write on a computer, but Ritter eschews even that because he prefers the spontaneity that his phone provides.Ritter's latest album is Spectral Lines, out now. 2023-06-1647 minSongwriters on ProcessJess Williamson"I'm pretty much always thinking about lyrics every day of my life." That quote represents the energy that Jess Williamson brings to this episode of the podcast. Her level of introspection and enthusiasm made this conversation so much fun.But what happens when you're always thinking about songwriting and you can't write a song? Williamson discusses the anxiety she felt during a year-long songwriting draught that lasted for all of 2022 and even into 2023. It eventually broke one day when she "threw the capo on the sixth fret, started playing some chords, and that was it."...2023-06-0549 minSongwriters on ProcessEtta Friedman & Allegra Weingarten of Momma"We don't write on lined paper. That's a big no-no." This episode with Etta Friedman and Allegra Weingarten of Momma goes deep. We dig into the whys of the writing process, not just the hows. We also discuss, for example, why mundane activities are never good for their creative process--a pretty unique answer among the songwriters I've interviewed. Most tell me that walking stimulates the writing process, but not these two: they use mundane activities like walking as a means to escape, not to create. I LOVE this band. Love them. Their 2022 album Household Name was one o...2023-05-1452 minSongwriters on ProcessDave Lombardo of Slayer, Testament, Mr. Bungle"A washing machine with a clumpy pair of shoes can be a beautiful thing."Legendary drummer Dave Lombardo, a founding member of Slayer, finds beauty in the mundane. And also in the annoying: "Even the rhythm of a jackhammer and the bumps in a road can be inspiring," he says in the latest Songwriters on Process podcast. Lombardo's debut solo album Rites of Percussion (Ipecac Recordings) is an instrumental effort consisting entirely of percussive instruments. What kind? Here's the list: two drum sets (single and double bass kits), a large concert bass drum, a timpani...2023-05-0240 minSongwriters on ProcessJosephSisters Natalie, Allison, and Meegan from Joseph talk about their individual and collective songwriting processes in this episode. And in that discussion, they each learn something about the others that they didn't know! Joseph's new album The Sun is out April 28 on ATO Records.2023-04-2152 minSongwriters on ProcessEric D. Johnson of Fruit Bats/Bonny Light Horseman"I'm a wrong hallway person. I like to make wrong turns."Eric D. Johnson of Fruit Bats and Bonny Light Horseman makes a lot of mistakes. And that's a good thing, he says, because that's when the good stuff happens. "The excitement is in the mistakes," he says. "The song is a house, and sometimes you walk into the wrong room."Johnson's talking in metaphors, of course, but his literal rooms need to be a place of chaos too. The room where he writes starts off clean, but by the end there's stuff everywhere: cables...2023-04-1141 minSongwriters on ProcessAmy Ray (Indigo Girls) and H.C. McEntire"I've written whole songs on dog walks," says Amy Ray of The Indigo Girls. "I write a lot when I'm on the lawnmower, says H.C. McEntire. What a great time this was listening to these two friends and fantastic songwriters go deep into their songwriting processes. For Ray, it involves writing five times a week for no more than two hours a day. For McEntire, it involves cork boards. We also discuss our shared love for Anne Lamott and Sharon Olds. Catch them on on tour together this May. 2023-03-2959 minSongwriters on ProcessAlex Skolnick of Testament(NOTE: This interview is from December 2020. I've converted the video to podcast form. You can watch the interview here.)It's like opening a time capsule now when I listen to songwriters talk in 2020 about how they were navigating the pandemic as artists. For some, it was a bane: the isolation paralyzed their creativity. For Alex Skolnick of Testament, it was a boon. Quite simply, he says, "Not having to travel has opened me up to different ways to be creative that I didn’t have before." But on those rare occasions whe...2023-03-1936 minSongwriters on ProcessShana Cleveland of La Luz"All the time in the world is too much pressure."Shana Cleveland of La Luz prefers a good deadline when she writes songs. And with a toddler in the house, her day is nothing but deadlines, which are also known as When Your Child Wakes From Their Nap. If you're an artist like Cleveland, the best time to write is nap time. (We have four kids, so I know the feeling.) She discovered her knack for writing in those precious moments once she became a parent. "I can write just as many songs...2023-03-0938 minSongwriters on ProcessSara Watkins of Nickel CreekI first interviewed Sara Watkins of Nickel Creek in 2013, and this latest conversation reminded me why she is one one of my favorite interviews. The thoughtfulness and introspection she brings to this discussion are wonderful.No matter the art you create, this episode is for you. We didn't focus on the practical aspects of the songwriting process nearly as much as we talked about Creativity (with a capital C): why we create and what it does to us when we do. Where does the urge come from? When is the drive the strongest? For Watkins, the ideal...2023-02-2349 minSongwriters on ProcessPhilip Selway of RadioheadPhilip Selway, Radiohead's drummer, says that his best writing happens when "I'm looking the other way. My songs come along when they choose." But while Selway may prefer to wait for the muse, there are a few things he does to stimulate the songwriting process:Selway likes to write on his drum stool, not a traditional chair. "It grounds me in my wider life," he told me.Selway draws a mind map using a blue pen, a black pen, and a pencil. His lyrics are spread all over the paper with little sense of order. He likes pens...2023-02-1252 minSongwriters on ProcessLiz Stokes of The BethsI love The Beths! So talking to Liz Stokes was a blast. The band's new album Expert in a Dying Field was on almost every 2022 year-end "best of" list. Listen to Stokes talk about the importance of journaling to her songwriting process, why distance is so important for revision, and the best headspace to write in. Of course, we talk about why walking around outside is so important to Stokes's process. Again: I love The Beths! 2023-01-2941 minSongwriters on ProcessThe Lone BellowOn this week's episode, I talk to all three members of The Lone Bellow! Zach Williams, Kanene Pipkin, and Brian Elmquist go deep into their songwriting processes and even learn a few things about each other that they didn't know before! In this episode, we discuss the impact that leaf blowing, linguistics, and literature have on their songwriting process. 2023-01-0853 minSongwriters on ProcessAly and AJAly and AJ Michalka have been writing and recording songs together since they were teenagers. It’s easy to see why: their processes are remarkably in sync. Listen to the sisters talk about this smooth creative relationship, as well as the important role that both reading and exercise play in their songwriting processes. Book recommendations included in this episode! 2022-12-2438 minSongwriters on ProcessTim Burgess of The Charlatans"I'm so much more prolific when I exercise."Tim Burgess of The Charlatans admitted to me during episode 55 of the podcast that "rock stars aren't supposed to exercise, but we all have our secrets, don't we?" Well, the cat's out of the bag. Burgess loves to exercise, and it's an important part of his songwriting process. Many of his song ideas come to him at the gym as he's listening to music and watching whatever is playing on the television there. But physical activity as way to stimulate creativity underscores a bigger theme in his process: "When...2022-12-1538 minSongwriters on ProcessDave Hause and Kathleen Edwards"When I sit down to write, the house has to be clean. Also, the dogs have to be walked because they need to fuck off and leave me alone," Kathleen Edwards told me. Now in podcast form, my 2020 joint interview with Edwards and Dave Hause! Listen now!2022-11-2954 minSongwriters on ProcessS.G. GoodmanS.G. Goodman was raised a farmer's daughter and studied philosophy in college. This means that not only does she love to ponder, she has time do it during those long days in the field. The product of all the pondering: amazing lyrics.It's not a surprise, then, that Goodman doesn't like to write on tour and doesn't like to be inside at all when she writes. In fact, when she's on tour, she can't wait to get back home, where she can be outside and work with her hands. "Whenever I can, I try to get...2022-11-1345 minSongwriters on ProcessJulian LageJulian Lage has been hailed as one of the "most prodigious guitarists of his generation," so this was a new one for me: an interview with a songwriter who doesn't write lyrics, only instrumentals. As someone steeped in improvisation, Lage isn't one for specific rituals. And that's why I loved this conversation: it's a deep dive into the abstract elements of creativity as we try to figure out where it all comes from. Lage is on the faculty at The New School, so we talked teaching philosophy too. (I'm a former academic.)Lage's latest album is called...2022-10-3049 minSongwriters on ProcessGavin Rossdale of Bush“A good song has fragmented fireworks. It needs to pull people in with interesting turns of phrases, word combinations that no one has heard before.”Hear Gavin Rossdale of Bush explain why the painters Francis Bacon and Lucien Freud are far and away the biggest inspirations to his creative process. We also discuss why great writers are so important to his songwriting and how he gets so many ideas while walking. (Audio note: I interviewed Rossdale while he was on his tour bus, so audio is a bit muffled.)2022-10-2033 minSongwriters on ProcessGrian Chatten of Fontaines D.C."I write all day, every day. When I'm in the thick of it, it's a struggle to focus on anything else."For Grian Chatten of Fontaines D.C. , there’s no such thing as a writing ritual if you never stop writing. He calls his writing process his "constant annoying companion. I have writing on speed dial 24/7." But Chatten says that he's always had a healthy relationship with writing because he's never forcing it. The key, he says, is to not take it too seriously or to make it appear to precious. "I treat it with a...2022-10-0747 minSongwriters on ProcessMadison Cunningham"When you have a regimen, it's ok to let up on yourself. Because you know that tomorrow, you'll be doing it again."Madison Cunningham firmly believes in the writer's regimen. You have to put in the work every day. None of this "waiting for inspiration" stuff. "Words on a page every day, even if it's not songwriting," she says. So she starts each day by writing for ten minutes because everyone can make time for ten minutes. No excuses.Cunningham also reads voraciously. "Books are one of my favorite wells to draw from," she says in...2022-09-2447 minSongwriters on ProcessWill Sheff of Okkervil River"If I have one piece of advice to give, it would be to write something the moment you wake up." Will Sheff of Okkervil River likes a good writing ritual. He believes in writing every day, just as a professional athlete needs to practice every day. But as you'll hear in this episode, he's also a firm believer in loafing. Sheff's first proper solo album, out October 7, is called Nothing Special. 2022-09-1251 minSongwriters on ProcessEmily Haines of MetricIn most workplaces, falling asleep on the job is not a good thing. But if you’re in Metric, Emily Haines says it's a great thing. In fact, she and her bandmates love it when they catch each other napping in the studio. Because that means they're being productive. Listen to the latest episode now!2022-08-3149 minSongwriters on ProcessMatt Nathanson and Butch Walker"I still have your cutlery, by the way," Butch Walker tells Matt Nathanson in this episode. Nathanson's latest album Boston Accent was produced by Walker. And while the two may have shared kitchen space and maybe even a utensil or two, their relationship in the studio worked because their creative processes were symbiotic: the limitation in one was offset by the complementary strength in the other. 2022-08-241h 05Songwriters on ProcessJohn MorelandPeople tell John Moreland that he writes "bummer songs," which we both agreed is ironic gives that he cannot be in a bummer mood when he writes. "If I'm doing anything creative, my mind needs to be in a good space," Moreland told me. "I need a measure of self-acceptance when I write."And when Moreland writes, he has a ritual. He likes to write between midnight and 4am. It has to be dark, and it has to be cool/cold, so he sets the thermostat to around 66 F. And here's my favorite part: Tokyo walking videos. Wh...2022-08-1544 minSongwriters on ProcessKelsey WaldonKelsey Waldon finds the beginnings of spring and fall to especially conducive to songwriting. A good yellow legal pad helps as well. Her latest album is called No Regular Dog on Oh Boy Records.2022-08-0633 minSongwriters on ProcessTaylor Goldsmith of DawesReady for some light summer reading? Taylor Goldsmith of Dawes isn't. He's currently reading Homer's The Iliad. This is the second time I've interviewed Goldsmith, and I remain in awe of his reading habits. He reads all the time. My PhD in English Literature ensures that I've always done a fair amount of reading, yet I feel silly around Goldsmith. What I love about Goldsmith is that he reads not just for fun but to be enveloped by the artist. "I get caught up in the story of the artist," he says. "That's a big part of...2022-07-2641 minSongwriters on ProcessKevin Morby"This is gonna sound gross, but I'm a 34 year old adult and I've just started flossing for the first time in my life."Come for the process, stay for the hygiene! Yes, there is a connection between Kevin Morby's songwriting process and his dental health: it all has to do with organization.But while Morby may not floss and write at the same time, he does have a few rituals. He likes a cheap Bic pen and a yellow legal pad for lyrics because the unfussiness of them allows him get messy. He likes to...2022-07-1445 minSongwriters on ProcessMartin Courtney of Real EstateMartin Courtney of Real Estate says that songwriting can be a "painstaking" process, so he's trying something new. "I'm trying to plow through it, take a step back, then chip away at it," he told me. He's also found fulfillment in writing about the small details of everyday life, trying to work those ideas into his songs.But he always has Strega Nona to fall back on.Courtney's new solo album is called Magic Sign. 2022-07-0740 minSongwriters on ProcessLaura VeirsFor Laura Veirs, the songwriting process involves giving the muse a good, long side eye. That's when she's not painting, surfing, reading, or exercising--all while being a single parent. "I try to do several things at once so nothing becomes too precious or too obsessive," Veirs told me in our interview. 2022-06-3047 minSongwriters on ProcessThe Black PumasSix-time GRAMMY nominees The Black Pumas are not a found sound band. But Adrian Quesada loves nothing more than a good turn signal. "I’m always superimposing a 6/4 rhythm on them whenever I’m at an intersection," he said. So much so that that his wife often has to remind him when the light turns green. This interview with Quesada and Eric Burton is from December 2020.2022-06-2038 minSongwriters on ProcessBJ Barham (American Aquarium) and S.A. CosbyBJ Barham of American Aquarium & I were reading S.A. Cosby long before it was cool! But seriously, now that Cosby has received universal acclaim for his books RAZORBLADE TEARS and BLACKTOP WASTELAND, the secret's out. Listen to my conversation with these two master storytellers as we discussed the writing process! (This interview is from April 2021).2022-06-0656 minSongwriters on ProcessCraig Finn of The Hold Steady"If the next record is about whaling, you'll know where that came from."Craig Finn takes it all in. He's the kind of songwriter who absorbs everything he sees and hears, and right now that involves reading "Moby Dick." Finn is a voracious reader, demonstrating something I've always maintained: the best lyricists read a lot. So when he sits down to write, he's efficient in his ritual: he writes quickly, usually giving himself 90 minutes to write four or five verses. Then he sets aside for a week, using fresh eyes in the revision process. This i...2022-05-2347 minSongwriters on ProcessJulia Cumming & Nick Kivlen of Sunflower BeanFresh off their new release Headful of Sugar, Julia Cumming (bass, vocals) and Nick Kivlen (guitar, vocals) of Sunflower Bean discuss how their sometimes divergent creative processes coalesce into an efficient whole. 2022-05-1541 minSongwriters on ProcessBardo Martinez of Chicano Batman“If I’m drawing a lot, I’m writing a lot. Those two processes are closely connected.” Bardo Martinez of Chicano Batman is, in his words, the “supreme doodler.” Whether he’s longboarding or reading to his kids or drawing, he's always thinking about his next song. This interview is from July 2021.2022-05-0731 minSongwriters on ProcessJonathan Russell (The Head and the Heart)"I like to have structure in my songwriting process in order to let chaos rule."Jonathan Russell of The Head and the Heart loves structure. It helps him in his domestic life: he often finds missing bridges in his songs when he’s cleaning the house, for example. “I love order,” Russell told me. “Clean kitchen, happy brain.” And he loves using lists to make his day easier. When I asked Russell what kind of writing he does outside of songwriting, his immediate response was simple: “I’m a listmaker."Russell likes structure in his songwriting pr...2022-04-2639 minSongwriters on ProcessS. Carey (aka Sean Carey)"With the stuff I've been through, I would just go outside and immediately start to feel better." S. Carey's (Sean Carey) new solo album Break Me Open was written during a time of tremendous domestic change: the dissolution of his marriage, the death of his father, and the growth of his children. Any three of these events, much less all three, would be time for introspection.On the deeply personal lyrics of Break Me Open, Carey channels this introspection. And these periods of reflection were made easier by time spent outdoors: under the occasional tree, of...2022-04-2133 minSongwriters on ProcessTim Kasher of CursiveTim Kasher's latest solo album is called MIDDLING AGE. The Cursive frontman explains why he's a "militant reader" and why he doesn't subscribe to the Hemingway credo of "write first, read later." But does he believe that you should always write when you're hungry? Listen for the answer to that, and hear why he thinks songwriters always sing about "walkin' down the street."2022-04-1737 minSongwriters on ProcessMolly Tuttle and Katie Pruitt“I’m better at writing songs after I’ve processed an emotion. I have to let myself feel an emotion before I can write about it.”—Katie Pruitt."I write the best when I’m not putting pressure on myself to write about what’s happening around me.”—Molly Tuttle. For Pruitt and Tuttle, dreams are an especially fruitful time for song ideas: both women have been awoken in the middle of the night by incredible melodies running through their head. (And as you’ll also hear, one of those daytime melodies actually caused a car crash.)2022-04-1437 minSongwriters on ProcessPaula Cole"The more evolved periods of my life are when I’m journaling. My journal is a backbone to my life, a conversation with my subconscious. It makes for a healthy mind and spirit.” For Grammy winner Paula Cole, the songwriting process is deeply contemplative and kinesthetic.But journaling is just one part of Cole’s very kinesthetic writing process. “I feel it in my body,” she told me. “It’s like feeling creatively pregnant.” Cole uses movement to bear those songs. They come from walking, swimming, gardening, and dancing (to Donna Summer, natch). Even the keyboard plays a role: the deep...2022-04-0948 minSongwriters on ProcessEric Pulido of MidlakeEric Pulido of Midlake takes a deep dive into his songwriting process on today's episode. Pulido is an avid runner, and we talk a lot about how that four mile loop in the local park is a great way to both get out of a rut and conjure up new ideas. Midlake's latest album is called For the Sake of Bethel Woods (ATO Records).2022-04-0539 minSongwriters on ProcessSarah Jarosz and Margaret Glaspy(This interview is from February 2021.) Listen to old friends Sarah Jarosz and Margaret Glaspy talk about their songwriting process! Four-time GRAMMY winner Jarosz and Glaspy have known each other since they were teenagers, so this was a fun conversation. But we did this in the middle of the first COVID winter, so it's a stark reminder that songwriters are only now beginning to emerge from a long spell of unemployment. You'll hear phrases like "when you lose your job, it's stressful" and "the reality of losing my job really got me down."2022-04-0247 minSongwriters on ProcessStu Mackenzie of King Gizzard and the Lizard WizardThis interview is from January 2021.You think you're prolific? Stu Mackenzie and his bandmates put out five albums in one year, and sixteen over the course of ten years. Not surprisingly, Mackenzie is always creating and gets anxious when he's not. He gets song ideas from everywhere: one song even came from the time signature of the alarm his car makes when he leaves the lights on. 2022-03-3142 minSongwriters on ProcessSteve Gunn“My receptors are always on because I don’t want to miss anything I see or hear. I try to collect everything," says Steve Gunn. The songwriting process is 24/7 for Gunn. Even when he’s not putting pencil to paper, he’s creating. This interview is from August of 2021.2022-03-2738 minSongwriters on ProcessAnand Wilder"If I have anything to give the world as a songwriter, I'm trying to explore the middle ground. That's not the most effective for songwriters because the most provocative things are clear statements of good and evil," says Anand Wilder, formerly of Yeasayer. In this podcast, you'll come for the process and stay for the impressions! Sure we take a deep dive into Wilder's songwriting process, but where else can you find impressions of John, Paul, and George (no Ringo). And Paul Simon?Impressions aside, Wilder is a fantastic interview and a great storyteller. But...2022-03-2248 minSongwriters on ProcessBartees Strange“There are days when the songs won’t stop coming. It’s like I’m holding a bucket in the rain and just trying to catch all the ideas.” Bartees Strange has a lot of song ideas. So how does he get them all down when all he does is think about creating?2022-03-1933 minSongwriters on ProcessBrian Fallon and Tracii GunsDid you know that "The Ballad of Jayne" by LA Guns was one of the first songs Brian Fallon learned on guitar? Or that Tracii Guns is a huge Brian Fallon fan?This interview is from the early stages of the pandemic, September 2020. It's interesting to hear people talk about making and playing music in what seemed like a different time. I got these two together after noticing that they always commented on each other's social media posts. Little did I know this was the first time they met! This is the third time I've interviewed Fallon...2022-03-151h 00Songwriters on ProcessErin RaeErin Rae needs three things for her songwriting process: a hardwood floor, a phone on airplane mode, and glowiness.Rae typically gets compared to 70s singer/songwriters like Joni Mitchell and Jackson Browne. It seems like every review has the obligatory "Laurel Canyon" reference. But heck: these are just good songs, period. No comparison needed.Erin Rae's latest album Lighten Up is out now on Thirty Tigers Records.2022-03-1233 minSongwriters on ProcessKathy Valentine of the Go-Go's“It's important to me as a writer to push myself out of my comfort zone in order to grow. That's what excites me now.”With her terrific memoir All I Ever Wanted, bassist Kathy Valentine of the Go-Go’s loves exploring new genres outside of songwriting.As one of the songwriters for The Go-Go’s, Valentine wrote two of their most popular hits in “Vacation” and “Head Over Heels” as well as several other songs. So we’ve been able to check "killer songwriter” off the list for a while. Now we can add “fantastic prose writer”: All I E...2022-03-0944 minSongwriters on ProcessTomberlinFor Tomberlin, songwriting is emotional and heavy work. It’s not always pleasant. There’s a lot of emotional prodding and digging.The word “processing” came up a lot in my interview with Sarah Beth Tomberlin (aka Tomberlin) when she discussed how she writes songs. She uses songwriting as a way to process the events in her life, much more so than most songwriters have shared with me. But it’s difficult to write songs when things are “pleasant” in her life. “There’s no urgency to the process in that case,” she says. It’s the difficult events...2022-03-0642 minSongwriters on ProcessEmily Scott RobinsonBank pens and vacuum cleaners: the keys to Emily Scott Robinson's songwriting process.Robinson and I both agree that having a writing ritual is important. Rituals give us confidence and comfort. But they also help us achieve a flow state where the writing just happens: you don't have to think about the words because they issue forth. It's when you're on a roll.Achieving this flow state is hard, so that's where the bank pens and vacuum cleaners come in. Robinson is a pen-and-paper person for her lyrics. And there's something about the smoothness of...2022-03-0437 minSongwriters on ProcessJeff Daniels“You’ve got to be open, you’ve got to fire the judge, you’ve just got to receive it all.”If you want to be a writer of any genre, says songwriter (and, yes, actor) Jeff Daniels, you also have to keep your radar on 24/7 for what you see and hear. And be prepared to steal it. Sure, you know Jeff Daniels from his many films, but he's also been writing songs and playing guitar since 1976. This is a conversation about the artistic process writ large, so if you're a songwriter, a playwright...2022-03-0146 minSongwriters on ProcessPatterson Hood (Drive-By Truckers) and Lilly Hiatt"The good songs happen like someone is playing a record in space, and I have an antennae to pick it up. I actually hear it, and write it down as quickly as I can.”—Patterson Hood."You don’t just get to have the muse all the time. It’s mysterious. But you have to experience stuff and have time to process those experiences to be able to write about them."—Lilly Hiatt.There are two different points during my interview with Patterson Hood of Drive-By Truckers and Lilly Hiatt when each reaches to the sky, grabs...2022-02-271h 13Songwriters on ProcessMartin SextonWhen singer/songwriter Martin Sexton gets in a rut, he turns to chaos.Some songwriters take a break, some take a walk, others plow through until they get a breakthrough. But Sexton needs disruption. He uses two radios at once, one on each side of his computer. Each radio plays a different genre. It could be talk radio and rock, classical and country. The sounds don't matter because the goal is to drive his editor crazy. Sexton says that his ruts happen when he gets in his own way: too much editing, too much thinking a...2022-02-2627 minSongwriters on ProcessKerry McCoy & George Clarke of DeafheavenFor George Clarke and Kerry McCoy of Deafheaven, it’s not the ritual of the process itself that’s important as much as the preparation before the process. Both use a meditative and repetitive activity to prepare their mind: for McCoy it’s surfing, and for Clarke it’s often running or driving.Clarke writes the lyrics for Deafheaven, while McCoy writes much of the music. For both men, it’s all about putting themselves in the best possible headspace to make something. Surfing is a big part of McCoy’s creative process; he tries to go every mornin...2022-02-2537 minSongwriters on ProcessWalter MartinWalter Martin’s most efficient writing process involves not sitting down with the intent to create. Also: being hungover helps. Like most songwriters tell me—Britt Daniel of Spoon was the last one—Martin does not sit down to write a song. “When that happens, it comes out the wrong way. I start to sound too smart or like poet,” he says. Instead, he’s writing all the time by constantly observing his surroundings. Song ideas come to Martin throughout the day, like when he’s mowing the lawn, and that’s when he whips out the phone to reco...2022-02-2336 minSongwriters on ProcessMorgan WadeMorgan Wade gets more done by 8am than you do. "The more active I am, the more energetic I feel. And that's when I get my best ideas," she told me.If you want to schedule a meeting with Wade, do it early. I mean really early. She's usually up and ready to go by 5am. "I get emails from people who want to schedule meetings at 10am, and that is way too late for me. I'm thinking 8am is a much better time," she told me. In fact, on those rare occasions when she’s slept in...2022-02-2232 minSongwriters on ProcessDebbie GibsonFor the uninitiated: Debbie Gibson is still the youngest female to write, produce, and perform a #1 single, with "Foolish Beat" at age 17. I think I was just learning how to make toast at that age. She wrote all the songs on her debut album Out of the Blue—at age 16. The album had four singles in the US top five and sold more than five million albums. Gibson's second album Electric Youth was the #1 album in the US for five weeks. It contains three singles in the top 20, including the #1 song "Lost in Your Eyes." With that so...2022-02-2139 minSongwriters on ProcessJulien Baker and Matt NathansonSome artists create because they like the process and the product. They like what they do and they’re good at it, whether they’re amateurs or professionals.But other artists create because they need to create. They have to write songs. It’s a self-actualizing and at times even a survival instinct, a primal drive. Because of this, external forces like love or relationships or world upheaval aren’t always drivers. These artists create because they must create. And at times, it may not even be enjoyable. This is what I thought about after my interv...2022-02-1951 minSongwriters on ProcessMichelle Zauner of Japanese BreakfastNo matter if she's writing great music or great books, Michelle Zauner goes by one credo: first thought, best thought. It's always garbage before the good stuff. "Raw source material is supposed to be crap,” Zauner says. “You have to allow yourself to be terrible," she told me. Zauner is the singer, songwriter, and founder of the band Japanese Breakfast. But she's also the author of the bestselling memoir Crying in H Mart, which ended up on many 2021 year-end "best of" lists and is also being made into a movie. 2022-02-1733 minSongwriters on ProcessBritt Daniel of SpoonSpoon's Britt Daniel finds that success as a songwriter comes when he's not trying to write songs. The less organization, the better. "When I try to write with intention, I come up empty," Daniel says. But if I'm not trying to do anything, I've been more successful. Trying to be organized can be a dead end." He told me that he likes to start writing without any direction. And Daniel often finds crowded bars and restaurants to be inspiring. Not only does he like the energy of the crowds, but he also uses what he hears and s...2022-02-1538 minSongwriters on ProcessLauren Mayberry of CHVRCHESLauren Mayberry of Chvrches has an impressively organized songwriting process that involves spreadsheets, Pinterest boards, and a jar full of paper. For Mayberry, that organization involves writing every day. She has the jar to show for it, a jar full of cut out words and phrases that she collects for inspiration or future lyrical Ideas. She also keeps notebooks. "Writing is very therapeutic for me," Mayberry told me. Mayberry has a keen and precise take on her creative process. She doesn't write much on tour. "Sad, soft, worried me d...2022-02-1344 minSongwriters on ProcessMia Berrin of Pom Pom SquadFor Mia Berrin of Pom Pom Squad, how a song looks is as important as how it sounds. And her latest album Death of a Cheerleader looks and sounds red. Pom Pom Squad’s video for “Head Cheerleader” is fantastic. (The song itself is amazing and one of my favorites of 2021.) It’s rife with colors, images, and symbols. But what Berrin did with the video is not surprising if you know her background: she first moved to New York to study acting at NYU. And while the video is awash in vivid colors, red stands out...2022-02-1130 minSongwriters on ProcessYolaFor Yola, songwriting is all about the colliculus. And sometimes a good vacuum.There’s a common motion many songwriters make when telling me where their songs come from: they start grasping in the air, mere conduits pulling songs out of the ether. But if you ask Yola, she’d probably tap her head. “I have an obsessive neurological approach to songwriting,” she told me. The most important part of Yola’s process is her colliculus, a midbrain region. And that’s why this interview was part songwriting, part science lesson. “I farm out my work to my coll...2022-02-1036 minSongwriters on ProcessAnais Mitchell and Charlotte CornfieldArtists are always searching for the ideal creative state, that perfect time when the songs effortlessly flow. With both Anaïs Mitchell and Charlotte Cornfield, that involves, well, not really being aware of when they’re in that ideal state. For Mitchell, it involves accessing the subconscious in dreams. If she’s lucky, a fellow songwriter might appear in those dreams to give her counsel, like David Rawlings once did. And for Cornfield, that brief moment right before sleep, when she’s just about to doze off, is an especially fertile time. Mitchell and Cornfield love a go...2022-02-0949 minSongwriters on ProcessKeb' Mo'“As a songwriter, my job is to figure out how to draw some optimism out of any situation.”Five-time GRAMMY winner Keb’ Mo’ draws that optimism from the “big bubbling river” of creativity. We can all use a little Keb’ Mo’ in our lives. As the world burns, Kevin Moore (aka Keb’ Mo’) sees cause for optimism everywhere—even in his own home, where he gets joy from mundane household chores that I certainly detest. While I may recoil at the sight of a big pile of laundry, Moore loves it: he finds comfort in folding clothes and...2022-02-0835 minSongwriters on ProcessAllison Russell and Aoife O'DonovanAllison Russell & Aoife O'Donovan talk about the songwriting process as full-time moms. Hint: there's not a process.“We’re working moms, so the best undisturbed time is between midnight and 4am.”—Allison Russell“I’m not the ‘lounge around’ type of person. There’s not one wasted hour in my day.” —Aoife O’DonovanRussell and O’Donovan are full-time songwriters of course, but they’re moms first. So what you won’t hear in our conversation is how wonderful it is to wake up, have a leisurely cup of coffee...2022-02-0752 minSongwriters on ProcessBen Bridwell from Band of HorsesBen talks to Ben: Songwriters on Process interviews Ben Bridwell from Band of Horses.Fun fact: this is not the first time I've interviewed Bridwell. The first was in 2015, when the amazing Sera Cahoone hooked us up with each other.Like most songwriters, Ben Bridwell from Band of Horses has found the past two years to be a bane to his creative process. With few exceptions, songwriters have told me that dark days are not conducive to creativity. As Carl Newman of The New Pornographers said to me, “Some people say that they write...2022-02-0638 minSongwriters on ProcessIntro to Songwriters on ProcessAn introduction to the Songwriters on Process podcast2022-02-0603 min