Shows
Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsWhat is really known about consciousness? A conversation with Rupert Sheldrake & Mark VernonYou may agree that the so-called hard problem of consciousness exposes the deep inadequacies of a materialist worldview. But the alternatives - various forms of panpsychism, panentheism and idealism - raise rich and fascinating questions, too. In this episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore the leading edge of consciousness research, with Rupert just back from The Science of Consciousness Conference 2025 in Barcelona. They discuss the impact of Indian researchers of consciousness and the proposals of microchip inventor, Federico Faggin. They consider trainings in extra-ocular vision and questions thrown up...
2025-07-2647 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsAn Implosion of Light. Talking mystical experiences with James Harpur and Mark VernonJames Harpur’s new book, "Dazzling Darkness: The Lives and Afterlives of the Christian Mystics", begins with an account of a mystical experience that happened to him - “an implosion of light”, as he describes it. That led to his book, Dazzling Darkness, in pursuit of the path that leads to ultimate reality: God.Mark Vernon’s new book, "Awake! William Blake and the Power of the Imagination", is the result of Mark’s engagement with his local mystic, William Blake, as well as practices based on encounters and texts including The Cloud of Unknowing.In this co...
2025-07-0654 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe most insightful poet that ever lived. Iain McGilchrist & Mark Vernon on William BlakeIain McGilchrist calls William Blake “the least cosy of poets and one of the most insightful that ever lived.” Blake is cited more often than most figures in Iain’s great book, "The Matter With Things".So what did Blake express that might much matter now? How did he understand key features of our humanity such as the imagination and inspiration, as well as the character of our day?In this conversation, prompted by the publication of "Awake!", Iain and Mark often land on wonderful quotes of Blake to unpack them. ”To the eyes of the man...
2025-06-241h 00Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLoosening the mind-forged manacles. William Blake in words and songsA live conversation with Mark Vernon, Katy Carr and Dexter Bentley from the Hello Goodbye Show.Who was William Blake? What might his music have sounded like? What did he say about the imagination? Why might he understand our predicament today?Mark Vernon and Katy Carr joined Dexter Bentley on Resonance FM to talk William Blake on Saturday 31st May 2025. Katy played six songs - her settings of the Introductions from the Songs of Innocence and also from the Songs of Experience, as well as The Lamb and TheTyger, and finally London and T...
2025-06-0141 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLiving in an Age of Spiritual Crisis. A conversation with Rupert Sheldrake & Mark VernonMuch of the modern world has become uncoupled from the transcendent in a cultural experiment Nietzsche called the death of God. But might this spiritual crisis prove to be a time of rebirth? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, recorded live at an event organised by the Temenos Academy, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the evolution of wisdom traditions from west and east alongside the great modern enterprise called science and its continuing development. As the materialist, progressive ideology that has dominated the sciences for two centuries wanes, and as scientific studies show that religious an...
2025-03-0557 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Abolition of Man, That Hideous Strength, Till We Have Faces. CS Lewis as prophet of dark timesA discussion with Jason Baxter, Nicholas Colloff and Mark Vernon.The Abolition of Man is a series of three lectures given by C.S. Lewis in defence of objective value, arguing that modernity has undermined our humanity by uncoupling intellect from instinct. With hearts divorced from minds, first the world empties of presence, then life empties of meaning and people become “men without chests”.That Hideous Strength is a fictionalised version of the abolition, exploring the impact of transhumanism, aggressive rationalism, absent gods, and an inability to contemplate and know reality as it is....
2025-02-141h 18Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Turn of the Tide. Martin Shaw & Mark Vernon talk about discerning the New Christian momentMartin Shaw and Mark Vernon return for a second conversation following Martin’s embrace of Orthodox Christianity. The first conversation, entitled The Mossy Face of Christ, can be found on my YouTube channel.They discuss what is happening with the apparent resurgence of interest in Christianity, not least in relation to Martin’s new course, The Skin-Boat and the Star. How can we discern the times and best participate in it?They explore the legacy of Christianity that can be such a block for people today and how the withdrawal of faith in contemporary culture may...
2024-11-011h 21
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesPurposes in Nature and MindsOne of the premises of modern science is that nature is devoid of purposes. Instead, purposeless explanations for phenomena are sought. And the strategy has proved hugely productive. Except that allusions to purpose never quite fade from the scientific imagination. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore the ways in which the natural world is indeed full of purposes, both at the level of the so-called inanimate, as well as in the living world, and the reality we know most immediately and best, namely our own lives and consciousness. The discussion ranges over...
2024-10-2530 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsPurposes in nature and minds. A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeOne of the premises of modern science is that nature is devoid of purposes. Instead, purposeless explanations for phenomena are sought. And the strategy has proved hugely productive. Except that allusions to purpose never quite fade from the scientific imagination. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore the ways in which the natural world is indeed full of purposes, both at the level of the so-called inanimate, as well as in the living world, and the reality we know most immediately and best, namely our own lives and consciousness. The discussion ra...
2024-10-2530 min
Dante's Divine ComedyIs hell forever? The Inferno. Jason Baxter & Mark Vernon on Dante’s film noir“Circles of hell" has become commonplace in language. But what was Dante trying to show us when he wrote the inferno? What has been lost in translation, with this first canticle in Dante’s trilogy now part of a secular culture?Jason Baxter talks about his new translation of the Inferno with Mark Vernon. They discuss what Dante could convey in language and why the text never ceases to offer fresh insights. How can we understand his encounters with figures from Virgil to Ulysses? What is it truly to be trapped in a hellish state? Why is the...
2024-10-0459 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsForce Fields. Behind the fog of maths. A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeEinstein remarked that there was physics before Maxwell and physics after Maxwell, the difference being the introduction of field theory. So what difference did fields make and, more to the point, what are they? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore how electromagnetic, gravitational and quantum fields shape modern science. Together with Rupert’s idea of morphic fields, which contain an inherent memory, they discuss how fields have revived Aristotle’s notion of formal and final causes and look at the fact that fields aren’t energetic or material causes. They...
2024-05-0937 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesMatter is Frozen LightThe everyday stuff called matter turns out to be both more fascinating and stranger than we usually assume. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask just matter is, beginning with contemporary ideas from quantum physics, in which matter is frozen light, as the physicist David Bohm put it. They consider the relationship between matter and gravity, as well as matter and ancient notions of potentiality, which turn out to be surprising relevant today. The differences between quantity and quality offer another conversational thread, with the discussion also drawing in wider questions, such as...
2024-04-0940 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsMatter is frozen light. A conversation with Rupert Sheldrake & Mark VernonThe everyday stuff called matter turns out to be both more fascinating and stranger than we usually assume. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask just matter is, beginning with contemporary ideas from quantum physics, in which matter is frozen light, as the physicist David Bohm put it. They consider the relationship between matter and gravity, as well as matter and ancient notions of potentiality, which turn out to be surprising relevant today. The differences between quantity and quality offer another conversational thread, with the discussion also drawing in wi...
2024-04-0940 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsStrangeness is the new real. Martin Shaw & Mark Vernon in conversationA couple of years back, Martin Shaw had a visionary experience that led him to Christianity. We talked about it as the Mossy face of Christ - https://youtu.be/8luN8bDDRBs?si=c7jHUt-Ih5xKlVWqSo it was great to talk again about what's been happening. Which is much. The conversation ranges over what might be happening now with Christianity, Martin's recent participation in the Symbolic World Summit, the strangeness, weirdness and terror of Christ, being in the world but not of it, and the importance of myths, stories and fairytales.We mentioned Martin's...
2024-03-281h 14Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Nature of Energy. A conversation with Rupert Sheldrake & Mark VernonEnergy is a key organising principle in modern science, the conversation of energy being a grounding and universal law. But what is energy? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon examine the history of the idea and the word. In science, energy is a relatively recently notion, emerging in its current form in the 19th century, drawing much on mechanics. The word itself was coined by Aristotle, in the 4th century BCE, carrying a sense of vital actuality and living presence. That meaning is still remembered in Orthodox theology, which describes the en...
2024-03-0136 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesThe Speed of GravityIsaac Newton is best known for his theory of gravity. And yet, the great scientist also insisted: "the cause of gravity is what I do not pretend to know.” In other words, notions like gravity, and force in general, are deeply mysterious phenomena. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask just what gravity might be. The conversation begins with a feature of gravity that is typically overlooked by physicists, namely that gravity has a speed. According to the physicist Tom van Flandern, the speed of gravity is at least **20 billion times faster than li...
2024-01-2632 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Speed of Gravity. A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeIsaac Newton is best known for his theory of gravity. And yet, the great scientist also insisted: "ye cause of gravity is what I do not pretend to know.” In other words, notions like gravity, and force in general, are deeply mysterious phenomena. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask just what gravity might be. The conversation begins with a feature of gravity that is typically overlooked by physicists, namely that gravity has a speed which is far faster than the speed of light. They consider how gravity might be l...
2024-01-2632 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsHumanity’s role in nature. Are we more than just a problem? A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeEnvironmental degradation caused by technological progress is in the news almost everyday. So can any sense be made of an ancient intuition that human beings are not just part of nature but have a distinctive and positive role to play in nature? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss issues from the significance of consciousness to cosmic emergence in order to explore a vision of humanity in nature that goes well beyond our life being the meaningless byproduct of random processes. Humanity contributes to the diversification and beautification of th...
2023-12-2035 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsOn the Incarnation or the real meaning of Christmas. Conversation with Russell Jefford & Mark VernonChristmas risks losing its meaning not only because of the commercial frenzy but because of the way it is talked about in churches.In this conversation, Russell Jefford talks about his discovery of the understanding of the incarnation conveyed in the writings of the early church fathers. They were unknown to him as an evangelical Christian and have refreshed his love of Christianity now.Together with Mark Vernon, they consider the iconography of the nativity. Why is Jesus born in a cave? Is that a coffin rather than a manger? They consider phrases of three...
2023-12-1957 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLove, power and public life. A conversation with Claire Gilbert & Mark VernonWhat is the role of love in public life? Can it have a place given the scrutiny faced by leaders and the processes of bureaucracies? Or is love what we need to face the huge challenges of today, from distrust of public institutions to the environmental crisis?Claire Gilbert is the author of several books, a fellow of Jesus College, Cambridge, has served on several public and advisory bodies, and is the Director of the Westminster Abbey Institute. In this conversation, we talk about soulfulness as well as morality in public life, for which Claire is convinced...
2023-11-2341 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsPrinciples of love and the wisdom of constellations. With Robert Rowland Smith & Mark VernonConstellations, also called family systems, is a way of visualising the dynamics of love that operate in any group that has to do with creativity or life. A constellation workshop brings people together to look at predicaments with which people are wrestling, be they personal or organisational. The goal is to find a design that releases and acknowledges the love that yearns to find a way forward, though can be thwarted or become stuck.In this conversation, Robert Rowland Smith and Mark Vernon, explore what in the constellations world is called the orders of love. T...
2023-11-2139 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesThe Extension of Mind Through Space and the Sense of Being Stared AtDo our minds reside solely inside our heads, or perhaps bodies? Or do they extend into the wider world, perhaps even reaching to the stars? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the extended mind theory, taking a lead from recent work of Rupert’s on the sense of being stared at, and also the problems that contemporary science has with understanding vision. The discussion considers new research carried out by Rupert and others, as well as the theories of A.N. Whitehead. The way in which science since Maxwell has considered light as...
2023-11-1142 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe extension of mind through space and the sense of being stared at. Conversation with Rupert SheldrakeDo our minds reside solely inside our heads, or perhaps bodies? Or do they extend into the wider world, perhaps even reaching to the stars? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the extended mind theory, taking a lead from recent work of Rupert’s on the sense of being stared at, and also the problems that contemporary science has with understanding vision. The discussion considers new research carried out by Rupert and others, as well as the theories of A.N. Whitehead. The way in which science since Maxwell has cons...
2023-11-1042 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLoving AIs. Reducing risk & building intelligence. Mark Vernon talks with Eve PooleThinking carefully, not just apocalyptically, about AIs requires a combination of skills - technological, sociological, psychological, philosophical, organisational. So I was delighted to talk with Eve Poole, who is a rare individual capable of bringing all these elements into her work. Our central question was how to build AIs so as to design out risk and design in love. It turns out that the two elements are deeply connected.We began by thinking about the nature of the threat and opportunity. In her book, Robot Souls, Eve draws attention to the "junk code" that, ever s...
2023-11-0245 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsCan we do without organised religion? A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeChurches are in decline, certainly in the western world. People tend not to think to turn to a priest for spiritual insight or advice. But is a lived relationship with the sacred and wisdom traditions denuded as organised religion disappears? In this Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon talk about religious institutions for good and ill. Rupert picks up on a new book by Alison Milbank, Once and Future Parish, to ask how churches can maintain connection with the seasons, place and community, and speak to the whole of our humanity in its rituals and rites o...
2023-10-2137 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsChrist consciousness and final participation. Max Leyf, Landon Loftin & Mark Vernon. #OwenBarfieldOwen Barfield talked of an evolution of consciousness towards final participation. But what is that state or quality awareness? How does it relate to the life of Christ? How was it described by Rudolf Steiner? Can we see and know intimations of it now?In this second discussion with Landon Loftin and Max Leyf, we explore the ideas of freedom and individuality, modernity and language, kenosis and romanticism come of age to press Barfield’s great insight and see whether we can help give it voice.For more on Landon and Max’s book see http...
2023-10-071h 08Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLove and Attachment Styles. A conversation with Robert Rowland Smith & Mark VernonWhy do we love? Is love inevitably a foolhardy endeavour? Or does it lead to a knowledge of reality beyond reason?In this discussion, Robert Rowland Smith and Mark Vernon discuss the ideas of Freud and Lacan, Bowlby and Winnicott, who had differing ideas about the nature of love and where it leads.Is love the idealisation of another, which inevitably leads to frustration and loss? Is love the realisation of a wider reality which, without it, we would neither feel drawn to or be prepared to know?And why are love and...
2023-10-0736 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsHeaven in a Wild Flower. Plato, Cusa, Shakespeare & Blake. Valentin Gerlier & Mark VernonWhat golden thread might link these writers across the centuries? Why might each matter now?Taking a lead from Valentin’s book, Shakespeare and the Grace of Words, we explore how the finite and infinite meet in dialogue, analogy, play and contrary, arguing that Plato, Nicholas of Cusa, Shakespeare and William Blake directly address our times of crisis and separation.For more on Valentin’s book see www.routledge.com/Shakespeare-and-the-Grace-of-Words-Language-Theology-Metaphysics/Gerlier/p/book/9781032121406He teaches an MA in Poetics of Imagination: https://campus.dartington.org/poetics-of-imagination/ His substack is https://graceofwords.substack.com/
2023-08-201h 11Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Unconscious. A conversation with Mark Vernon & Robert Rowland SmithWhat is meant by the unconscious? Is it even a "thing"? Why does it seemingly originate with Freud? How useful is the concept? How can it be worked with?In this discussion, Robert Rowland Smith and Mark Vernon explore the history of this central notion in psychoanalysis. They look at the different articulations of it, particularly in Freud and Jung, and ask how it links to other ideas such as the field, inspiration and the divine.Are vertical metaphors the right metaphors, as when people talk of "depth psychology"? Is the subconscious just the unconscious...
2023-08-1141 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsNarcissism. Good and Bad Therapy. A series of conversations with Robert Rowland Smith & Mark VernonWhat exactly is narcissism? Why is it so debilitating and troubling? Must everyone face narcissistic impulses and needs? In this discussion, Robert Rowland Smith and Mark Vernon explore the origins of narcissism in ancient myth and contemporary psychoanalysis. They explore the variety of pathological narcissisms, how it can be treated and whether a society increasingly online is at risk of becoming more narcissistic.For more on Robert - https://www.robertrowlandsmith.comFor more on Mark - https://www.markvernon.com
2023-06-1533 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Scandalous Radicality of Owen Barfield’s Thought. Landon Loftin, Max Leyf & Mark VernonOwen Barfield was the friend of CS Lewis and JRR Tolkien. He championed the importance of imagination and poetry. But what can be missed is the transformative depth of his ideas. They can revolutionise our perception of everything. Landon Loftin and Max Leyf are the authors of What Barfield Thought: An Introduction to the Work of Owen Barfield. In this conversation with Mark Vernon they ask how Barfield invites us to reconsider the meaning of everything from the human face to ancient history, from music to the person of Jesus. They ask about Barfield’s relationship with Lewis and...
2023-06-061h 18Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsWhat makes a place safe to talk? Psychotherapy and the frame. Robert Rowland Smith & Mark VernonSafety, confidentiality and trust are key parts of psychotherapy. That almost goes without needing to be said. But what is enabled by these qualities of the frame? How do they open up less conscious thoughts and feelings? In this second conversation about psychotherapy, Robert Rowland Smith and Mark Vernon explore this space of real encounter, which is paradoxically safe so as to allow the less safe to emerge. They ask how the frame feels sacred, how it can be spoiled or abused, and how it might enable the rebirth of souls.For more on Robert...
2023-05-1935 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesIn Praise of PraiseWhy do people offer praise and gain from it? Does God require, even demand praise? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert and Mark discuss what can be wrongly implied by praise and what it might mean as an immensely rich practice. Mark confesses to having been put off the notion, as if adulation were demanded by a divine narcissist, which Rupert responds to by considering the etymology of praise, shared by words such as appreciation and interpretation. The discussion develops to consider how praise is a disclosing activity, arising from a spontaneous perception of wholeness, beauty and...
2023-03-2843 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsWhat is objectivity? A conversation with Rupert Sheldrake & Mark VernonObjectivity has come to be regarded as a prime ingredient of reliable knowledge. But what is objectivity, how has it arisen, and is the notion in need of reform? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert and Mark consider the recent work of the philosopher, Richard Gunton. With colleagues, Richard examines older understandings of objectivity in science and proposes an alternative which is truer to scientific work. In particular, the reductive idea that links objectivity with replication seems increasingly untenable, given the replication crisis in science. Instead, linking objectivity to representation provides a fruitful way forward. R...
2023-01-1429 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsA New Axial Age? A conversation with Beth Macy & Mark VernonTo celebrate the release of his new book, Spiritual Intelligence in Seven Steps, the Pari Center invited Mark Vernon, to talk about his new work with Beth Macy.They discuss the notions of spiritual intelligence, the spiritual commons, the Axial revolutions, the presence of suffering, and whether we are in a new Axial Age now.For more on Spiritual Intelligence in Seven Steps see - https://www.markvernon.com/books/spiritual-intelligence-in-seven-stepsBeth Macy has been a manager, leader, consultant or participant in organizations experiencing difficult issues. David Bohm’s dialogue has been core to...
2022-12-2240 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesHumanism as Heresy: Testing the thesis of Tom HollandThe secular historian, Tom Holland, has made the case that atheistic humanism is, at heart, an off-shoot of Christianity. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask how that can be so. After all, contemporary humanists are inclined to blame Christianity for all ills, not thank Christianity for seeding values they share. Rupert and Mark agree that there is much in what Holland argues. For example, the tendency to evangelise for western values, as well as fall into dispute over what they might be, mirrors Protestant Christianity. But Mark is also wary of Holland’s...
2022-12-0632 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsHumanism as Heresy. Testing the thesis of Tom Holland. A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeThe secular historian, Tom Holland, has made the case that atheistic humanism is, at heart, an off-shoot of Christianity. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask how that can be so. After all, contemporary humanists are inclined to blame Christianity for all ills, not thank Christianity for seeding values they share. Rupert and Mark agree that there is much in what Holland argues. For example, the tendency to evangelise for western values, as well as fall into dispute over what they might be, mirrors Protestant Christianity. But Mark is al...
2022-12-0632 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsWhat is spiritual intelligence? Introducing my new book, Spiritual Intelligence in Seven StepsWe live in an age of emergency, exacerbated by a collapse of meaning. Writer and psychotherapist, Mark Vernon, examines the type of intelligence that, whilst often dismissed and overlooked, is crucial to understand and cultivate if we are to survive and thrive in our times. Spiritual intelligence is the foundation of who we are and our particular type of consciousness. It is the perception identified across wisdom and religious traditions, and known by many names, which can be summarised as the awareness of awareness, and so of being itself. It is the foundation of peace, even in t...
2022-11-0613 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsCircling Jesus: What's afoot with the new interest in Christianity? Elizabeth Oldfield & Mark VernonA number of public figures, in literature and ideas, have recently been talking about discovering Christianity, or perhaps it'd be better to say, being discovered by Christianity.So what's going on with this renewed interest? Why now? How can this be talked about? What kind of Christianity are they being draw to and captured by? And what does their experience say about the inadequacies of much Christianity in modern culture?These questions are asked by Elizabeth Oldfield, host of The Sacred podcast and former director of Theos. Mark Vernon, who often writes and talks about...
2022-10-2550 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Weirdness of Christianity. C.S. Lewis & Owen Barfield, with Jason Baxter & Mark VernonC.S Lewis is not the apologist and writer you might assume, if Jason Baxter is right. Plato, Boethius and Dante mattered immensely to a man who felt more at home in the medieval world, and longed to inspire the modern world with a half-forgotten theophany.His friend, Owen Barfield, also anticipated a transfigured today, one in which participation with divine life was known by ourselves and within the inside of the whole world.Christianity itself would recover its experiential, mystical core, the friends hoped, and be less eclipsed by credal and moral formulations.In this c...
2022-10-2155 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesRewilding ChristianityA renewed interest in Christianity? Old traditions of myth and place revived? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon consider the significance of recent conversions, as confessed by figures such as Paul Kingsnorth and Martin Shaw, as well as the prominence given to Christianity by writers such as Marilynne Robinson and Jordan Peterson. They explore what has been called the “rewilding” of Christianity and whether traditional approaches have run out of steam. Are surprisingly common religious encounters with divine and supernatural presences becoming more acceptable? What of the challenge to mainstream forms of Christianity comi...
2022-10-0839 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe New Christians, Rewilding Christianity. A dialogue with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark VernonA renewed interest in Christianity? Old traditions of myth and place revived? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon consider the significance of recent conversions, as confessed by figures such as Paul Kingsnorth and Martin Shaw, as well as the prominence given to Christianity by writers such as Marilynne Robinson and Jordan Peterson. They explore what has been called the “rewilding” of Christianity and whether traditional apologetics has run out of steam. Are surprisingly common religious encounters with divine and supernatural presences becoming more acceptable? What of the challenge to mainst...
2022-10-0739 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsSpinoza's Nondualism. Clare Carlisle talks with Mark Vernon about her book, Spinoza's ReligionBaruch Spinoza is widely regarded as either a God-forsaking atheist or a God-intoxicated pantheist, but Clare Carlisle says that he was neither. In her latest book, Spinoza’s Religion, she reads his masterpiece, the Ethics, to show that being-in-God lies at the heart of his nondual perception of reality. The book unfolds a powerful philosophical vision for the modern age—one which Carlisle argues overcomes "philosophical pathologies", from reductive materialism to nihilistic atheism, as well as putting crucial questions centre stage, such as how to live a joyful, fully human life.For more on Cla...
2022-07-2752 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesScience With Soul: Reflecting on Rupert Sheldrake’s 80th Birthday CelebrationThe Scientific and Medical Network organised a gathering on Friday 8th July to mark Rupert’s 80th birthday and reflect on his work. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert and Mark Vernon discuss the day, recalling remarks made by speakers including Merlin Sheldrake, Jill Purce, David Lorimer and Pam Smart. They discuss a variety of themes seminal to Rupert’s work, from science as the calling to share in a living cosmos to the business of coping with sceptics, which is not without its amusing as well as tricky moments. The conversation celebrates the richness of an enga...
2022-07-1439 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsScience with Soul. Reflecting on Rupert Sheldrake’s 80th Birthday CelebrationThe Scientific and Medical Network organised a gathering on Friday 8th July to mark Rupert’s 80th birthday and reflect on his work. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert and Mark Vernon discuss the day, recalling remarks made by speakers including Merlin Sheldrake, Jill Purce, David Lorimer and Pam Smart. They discuss a variety of themes seminal to Rupert’s work, from science as the calling to share in a living cosmos to the business of coping with sceptics, which is not without its amusing as well as tricky moments. The convers...
2022-07-1439 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesDante’s Paradiso, Awakening to the LightThis episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues continues Rupert and Mark's exploration of Dante’s Divine Comedy, taking a lead from Mark’s book, Dante’s Divine Comedy: A Guide for the Spiritual Journey. Dante is now guided by Beatrice through the heavenly spheres and into the Empyrean. It is a journey into the abundance of infinity and eternity, which immediately struck Rupert as akin to a DMT trip. Mark and Rupert explore how that is an apt analogy with Dante enabling us to incorporate the visionary into everyday life and understand how deeper perceptions of being can inform different times...
2022-06-2444 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Mossy Face of Christ. Martin Shaw talks w Mark Vernon about an unexpected return to Christianity0:00 Imagination and the Imaginal in the modern world7:20 Different kinds of power: agency, allure, contraries10:40 The revival of myth-telling but in the first person singular15:30 Martin’s rediscovery of Christianity21:40 The mossy face of Christ and what happened34:04 People’s reactions to Jesus: contraction and expansion39:04 Martin’s discovery of mystery in an Orthodox Church46:27 What does this rediscovery of Christianity mean to him?51:56 What does this mean for the “Christian curious”?54:50 The shamanistic presence of Malcolm Guite58:28 Mark’s journey in and around Christianity with Owen Barfield1:05:25 A turn to Wi...
2022-06-141h 16Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsVarieties of love in Plato, Jesus, Ibn 'Arabi and other mystics. Jane Clark & Mark VernonIt is often noted that the ancient Greeks had an advantage in possessing several words for love. Eros, philia, agape and others allowed them to be nuanced about love and navigate its differences. So is there benefit in considering how love has been understood in different wisdom traditions, too? This conversation, hosted by the Pari Center, explores how love has been understood in various faith contexts and across time, looking at Christian, Sufi, Platonic and other insights. The aim will be to tease out similarities and differences so as to deepen and refresh the felt presence of l...
2022-06-021h 38Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsThe Attack On Life and Understanding Our Times. A conversation with Iain McGilchrist and Mark VernonThe two hemispheres hypothesis, championed by Iain McGilchrist, has become well-known. But what light does it cast on modern society and our direction of travel? The nature of overweening bureaucracy, technologies of control, and the narrowing of freedom are explored in this conversation between Iain and Mark Vernon. They discuss issues from the legacy of the Covid pandemic to the story that modern humanity has come to tell itself about who we are. It turns out that now is a moment to be concerned and to ask again about fundamental matters, from the reality of evil to...
2022-04-151h 12Dante's Divine ComedyWhy Purgatory? Part 2 of 3 talks on Dante's Divine Comedy by Mark VernonThe mode of life called purgatorial is a medieval superstition, according to some, and the very purpose of mortal life, according to others. So what did Dante make of Purgatory and what has it to teach us now?In the Purgatorio, the essence of the spiritual path is shown in encounters and discussions. Purging itself, for example, is not about being rid of what we don't like, an activity that is another form of vanity. Rather it is about becoming clearer of that which hinders our sight of God and so limits the expansion of our being...
2022-04-051h 00Dante's Divine ComedyWhy Hell? Part 1 of 3 talks on Dante's Divine Comedy by Mark VernonThe notion of hell is delighted in by some and causes offence in others. So why did Dante write about this infernal domain on his journey through reality? What is its meaning? What might be learnt from it?The inferno illuminates how desires go awry, the nature of our being is misunderstood, perceptions narrow, and how societies, even civilisations, become lost.This is the first of three talks, originally hosted by the Fintry Trust. Why Purgatory and Why Paradise follow.The talk draws on Mark's book, Dante's Divine Comedy: A Guide for the...
2022-03-3051 minThe Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesDante’s Purgatorio, How to Be TransformedThis episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues continues Rupert and Mark's exploration of Dante’s Divine Comedy, taking a lead from Mark’s book, Dante’s Divine Comedy: A Guide for the Spiritual Journey. Dante and Virgil have found the way out of hell and a new adventure begins on Mount Purgatory. They first encounter souls who are shocked by their deaths and bemused by the afterlife. Then, the transformative ascent up the various terraces of the mountain begins. On each, souls are reckoning with the part of themselves marked by pride and envy, anger and lust, as well as other...
2022-03-0236 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsChristianity, Covid & Transformation – Paul Kingsnorth in conversation with Mark VernonWhat might Christianity have for us today? How might it stories still speak? Where to find what’s right in the tradition?I was delighted to speak with Paul Kingsnorth, whose substack and other writings since his conversion to Christianity, are helping to galvanise a new debate about religion in our society.We explore the need for more than cultural Christianity and its moral imperatives, to ask about its almost lost mystical side, and where and how that might be found.That matters not only for us as individuals but for our culture. It...
2022-02-081h 15
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesDante’s Inferno Part 2, The Dangers of Spiritual SeekingThis episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues is the second part of a conversation between Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon on the Inferno of Dante’s Divine Comedy. Deeper regions of hell are explored, in which individuals aren’t just confused about life but have become wedded to their confusions and the seeming power they bring. The deep ramifications of the worship of Mammon and worlds built on money is part of that addiction, as are the huge risks of spiritual seeking that arise directly from the tremendous goal of the spiritual quest, which is conscious participation in divine life. The...
2021-12-1838 minDante's Divine ComedyDante's Inferno, Part 2, dangers in spiritual seeking. A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeThis episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues is the second part of a conversation between Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon on the Inferno of Dante’s Divine Comedy. Deeper regions of hell are explored, in which individuals aren’t just confused about life but have become wedded to their confusions and the seeming power they bring. The deep ramifications of the worship of Mammon and worlds built on money is part of that addiction, as are the huge risks of spiritual seeking that arise directly from the tremendous goal of the spiritual quest, which is conscious participation in divin...
2021-12-1738 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLiving In Awareness - a conversation with Rupert Spira & Mark Vernon #nondualism #Blake #Rumi #DanteRupert Spira and I met for a second conversation, beginning with one of William Blake's great exclamations of nondual awareness:“Awake! awake O sleeper of the land of shadows, wake! expand!I am in you and you in me, mutual in love divineI am not a God afar off, I am a brother and friend;Within your bosoms I reside, and you reside in me:Lo! we are One”We discussed the meanings of suffering and death that feel so needed and neglected in our times; different possibilities for the expe...
2021-12-141h 24Dante's Divine ComedyDante's Inferno and the meaning of descent. A conversation with Rupert SheldrakeThe Divine Comedy by Dante is one of the great spiritual works of the Christian tradition. But how can it be read and what does it mean? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the first part of Dante’s cosmic pilgrimage. It takes Dante through the circles of hell, until he reaches the lowest point of reality, the region furthest from God. It becomes clear that descent into darkness is a key part of personal transformation because it helps the individual discern the dark side of experiences such as l...
2021-11-1230 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesDante’s Inferno Part 1, The Meaning of DescentThe Divine Comedy by Dante is one of the great spiritual works of the Christian tradition. But how can it be read and what does it mean? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the first part of Dante’s cosmic pilgrimage. It takes Dante through the circles of hell, until he reaches the lowest point of reality, the region furthest from God. It becomes clear that descent into darkness is a key part of personal transformation because it helps the individual discern the dark side of experiences such as love, anger and fa...
2021-11-1230 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsHomo Sapiens? Mark Vernon & Charles Foster in conversationFew have explored the nature of being human more directly than Charles Foster. He writes about his experiences in the wild in his books, Being A Beast and, most recently, Being A Human, raising profound questions about our awareness of the natural world in the past, present and future.The evolving nature of our perceptions of ourselves and the cosmos is also close to the work of Mark Vernon, both as a psychotherapist and writer. Are we Homo sapiens, narrans, scientificus, ignorans, noeticus - or simply loquens, never sure what we are talking about?In...
2021-11-0149 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesGnosticism Then and NowThe label “gnostic” is used to recommend and condemn. So what is, and what was, Gnosticism? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, takes a lead from a series of fascinating essays exploring the ancient movement and its modern forms by the philosopher, David Bentley Hart. Gnosticism was originally a set of cosmologies which shared the sense that the created order was blocked from the celestial spheres by angelic and demonic powers. It was remarkably widespread amongst early Christians of all kinds. They turned to Christ, in the hope of redemption or escape. Nowadays, it i...
2021-10-0829 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsGnosticism, Then & Now - a conversation with Rupert SheldrakeThe label “gnostic” is used to recommend and condemn. So what is, and what was, Gnosticism? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, takes a lead from a series of fascinating essays exploring the ancient movement and its modern forms by the philosopher, David Bentley Hart. Gnosticism was originally a set of cosmologies which shared the sense that the created order was blocked from the celestial spheres by angelic and demonic powers. It was remarkably widespread amongst early Christians of all kinds. They turned to Christ, in the hope of...
2021-10-0629 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsKnow Thyself - Rupert Spira and Mark Vernon in conversationWhat is the direct path of Advaita Vedanta and why is it significant for so many now? How is it found across traditions, including within Christianity? Why might it matter to us today, collectively as well as individually? What are its links to psychotherapy, individuality, freedom, God?Mark Vernon talks with Rupert Spira about these questions and more.0:34 What is the direct path and why is it of significance now?13:59 If awareness of awareness is the start, what happens next?17:20 Why might this matter socially as well as individually?23:27 What is the...
2021-09-211h 31Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsWhat the West can learn from the East - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeMeditation, yoga, vegetarianism. Eastern practices have become a feature of western life. But what do we learn from them? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, is prompted by a sense that the western way of life is being challenged, if not facing a full-on crisis. As Rowan Williams puts it in his new book, Looking East In Winter, climate change and environmental degradation are leading to a sense of needing not a programme or an ideology but an epiphany, which might renew our perception of reality. They dis...
2021-08-1836 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesWhat Can the West Learn from the East?Meditation, yoga, vegetarianism. Eastern practices have become a feature of western life. But what do we learn from them? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, is prompted by a sense that the western way of life is being challenged, if not facing a full-on crisis. As Rowan Williams puts it in his new book, Looking East In Winter, climate change and environmental degradation are leading to a sense of needing not a programme or an ideology but an epiphany, which might renew our perception of reality. They discuss how eastern Christianity, as well...
2021-08-1736 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsMatters of Life and Death - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeCovid has brought the reality of death into the centre of our lives, but what can we learn about death in response? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, is prompted by a sense that part of the anxiety arising from the pandemic is living in a culture that has forgotten how to know death in life. Rupert outlines some recent work on the role of death in plant life, and how that is not only of biological interest but can be spiritually resourcing. They discuss how wisdom traditions don’t...
2021-06-1634 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesMatters of Life and DeathCovid has brought the reality of death into the centre of our lives, but what can we learn about death in response? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, is prompted by a sense that part of the anxiety arising from the pandemic is living in a culture that has forgotten how to know death in life. Rupert outlines some recent work on the role of death in plant life, and how that is not only of biological interest but can be spiritually resourcing. They discuss how wisdom traditions don’t dissolve death but un...
2021-06-1634 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsOn Physics, Evolution, Mind at Large & Projections - Bernardo Kastrup & Mark VernonAn extended conversation that begins with thoughts on Owen Barfield, participation and the meaning crisis, Schopenhauer and Jung, moving through the state of modern physics, to the nature of evolution, the nature of mind at large, the role of dissociation and projections, and freedom.For more on Bernardo's work see - https://www.bernardokastrup.comFor more on Mark's work see - https://www.markvernon.comRunning order:3:18 Introducing Owen Barfield and representations8:22 The modern mistaken and the meaning crisis13:38 The paradox of increased knowledge and decreased meaning17:25 Questioning uniformitarianism...
2021-06-082h 05Inner Life, Talks and ThoughtsAnimals That Talk - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeWhy do matters as seemingly unconnected as children’s stories and shamanic encounters feature talking animals? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, is prompted the book, Roland In Moonlight by David Bentley Hart. It relates long conversations between the Eastern Orthodox philosopher and his pet dog, generating fascinating thoughts on all sorts of liminal experiences, from telepathy to panpsychism. How might a re-enchanted world appear to us in the future? What does that have to do with ancient perceptions and modern science? Rupert and Mark discuss matters from pets to s...
2021-04-2332 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesAnimals That TalkWhy do matters as seemingly unconnected as children’s stories and shamanic encounters feature talking animals? This episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, with Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon, is prompted by the book, Roland In Moonlight by David Bentley Hart. It relates long conversations between the Eastern Orthodox philosopher and his pet dog, generating fascinating thoughts on all sorts of liminal experiences, from telepathy to panpsychism. How might a re-enchanted world appear to us in the future? What does that have to do with ancient perceptions and modern science? Rupert and Mark discuss matters from pets to symbiosis, and th...
2021-04-2332 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsBillionaires, Brains and Beliefs - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeCould bliss be transmitted by a Happy Helmet? Are the fantasies of the super-wealthy secretly shaping our lives? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss a new novel, Double Blind, by Edward St Aubyn. It is a story of ideas, including issues previously explored in these dialogues, from the nature of consciousness and the revelations of psychedelics, to the missing heritability problem and the replication crisis. St Aubyn has richly addressed our moment with its environmental and existential concerns. His characters explore matters of paramount important as they effect re...
2021-04-0928 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesBillionaires, Brains and BeliefCould bliss be transmitted by a Happy Helmet? Are the fantasies of the super-wealthy secretly shaping our lives? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss a new novel, Double Blind, by Edward St Aubyn. It is a story of ideas, including issues previously explored in these dialogues, from the nature of consciousness and the revelations of psychedelics, to the missing heritability problem and the replication crisis. St Aubyn has richly addressed our moment with its environmental and existential concerns. His characters explore matters of paramount important as they effect real lives. His book...
2021-04-0928 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesPanpsychismThe discussion of alternative worldviews, from various forms of materialism to types of idealism, has exploded in recent years, and the notion of panpsychism is in the middle of the debate. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore the different types of panpsychism being proposed, from more conservative forms that are linked to materialism, to older types that have been advocated by figures from AN Whitehead to Aristotle. They ask about the place of time and space in different views of reality, and tease out the connections to consciousness and eternity. Models including...
2021-02-2238 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsPanpsychism - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeThe discussion of alternative worldviews, from various forms of materialism to types of idealism, has exploded in recent years, and the notion of panpsychism is in the middle of the debate. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore the different types of panpsychism being proposed, from more conservative forms that are linked to materialism, to older types that have been advocated by figures from AN Whitehead to Aristotle. They ask about the place of time and space in different views of reality, and tease out the connections to consciousness an...
2021-02-1938 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsLight - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeWe naturally talk about seeking the light at the end of the tunnel, or hoping to be enlightened. But are such phrases that reference light more than metaphors? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore how light is both physical and spiritual, and note the remarkable harmony between scientific and mythical ways of exploring light. They ask about the links between light and intelligence, as discussed by figures from Plato to Dante, as well as how our inner lives, say when we dream, include light. Rupert reflects on his ti...
2021-01-1530 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesLightWe naturally talk about seeking the light at the end of the tunnel, or hoping to be enlightened. But are such phrases that reference light more than metaphors? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore how light is both physical and spiritual, and note the remarkable harmony between scientific and mythical ways of exploring light. They ask about the links between light and intelligence, as discussed by figures from Plato to Dante, as well as how our inner lives, say when we dream, include light. Rupert reflects on his time in the ashram...
2021-01-1530 minInner Life, Talks and ThoughtsArtificial Intelligence - a conversation between Mark Vernon & Rupert SheldrakeArtificial intelligence is rarely out of the news. But what is it? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon take a lead from the breakthrough by Google in the prediction of protein folding, which Rupert has studied for decades. Whether this success reveals any deeper understanding of nature leads to a discussion of different types of intelligence, such as emotional and spiritual. They consider what is lost when AI dominates the imagination, and obscures aspects of reality that are embodied, and those that reach beyond, such as pure consciousness....
2021-01-0830 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesArtificial IntelligenceArtificial intelligence is rarely out of the news. But what is it? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon take a lead from the breakthrough by Google in the prediction of protein folding, which Rupert has studied for decades. Whether this success reveals any deeper understanding of nature leads to a discussion of different types of intelligence, such as emotional and spiritual. They consider what is lost when AI dominates the imagination, and obscures aspects of reality that are embodied, and those that reach beyond, such as pure consciousness.
2020-12-1130 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesDay of the DeadMost, perhaps all, cultures have moments of the year for fostering links with those who have died. In the western Christian world, the days of the dead are Halloween, All Saints and All Souls Day. In this Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask about the significance of this time. They take a lead from the Pixar film, Coco, which conveys this liminal zone with striking nuance and sophistication, and go on to ask about the meaning of praying for the dead, as well as relating to the legacy of ancestors in practices such as Constellations. The links...
2020-10-2834 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesPseudo-scienceThe accusation of pseudo-science is often made against those involved in the New Age, and sometimes rightly so. But as Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss in the latest episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, there is a lot more to the sneering and ridicule than meets the eye. They explore how science itself might morph into pseudo-science, which is perhaps a reason that scientists can be so nervous of novel ideas. They look at the origins of science's authority in the modern world, and the power of an impression of scientific rigour, whether or not justified. They discuss various...
2020-10-0234 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesRevelationWorld religions and inspired individuals alike say they are the recipients of divine revelation. But what might that mean? In this new episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the nature of revelation. They explore how revelation is a means of channelling and connecting with insight and intelligence in the domains of both religion and science. They ask how different revelations can be discerned and developed. The question of how revelation might be cultivated arises, as does the meaning of contemporary psychedelic revelations. Then there is issue of how revelation relates to what it is...
2020-09-0527 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesThe Flip, A discussion of Jeffrey Kripal’s bookDid you know Albert Einstein advocated telepathy research or that Marie Curie attended seances? In this edition of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss, The Flip, a new book by Jeffrey Kripal. The title refers to the range of experiences, from precognitive dreams to NDEs, that “flip” individuals from a mechanistic and materialist worldview. They become much more open to possibilities such as panpsychism and idealism. Kripal’s contention is that flips are common and, were they talked about, they would change culture. But would they? The conversation ranges over the links between psychic phenomena and spirit...
2020-08-0728 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesDavid Bohm: his life and ideasA new film, Infinite Potential: The Life and Ideas of David Bohm – https://www.infinitepotential.com – has just been released for free online. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss its excellent telling of the dramatic life and revolutionary insights of this deep scientific thinker. Rupert first met Bohm in 1982 soon after the publication of his book A New Science of Life precipitated a negative reaction from the militant materialists; the editor of the leading scientific journal Nature tried to excommunicate him. Bohm had a similar experience forty years earlier with the quantum phys...
2020-06-2628 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesSacred SpacesCathedrals are increasingly welcoming novel explorations of their tremendous interiors. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the powerful experiences that come with feeling free in sacred spaces. They look at how to access the sense of presence they hold, from lying on the ground to sitting in silence, noting that how you approach a building or shrine affects the spiritual qualities revealed. It’s also about the rediscovery of invocation and ritual, gesture and stance, and how they yield different dimensions of reality. This can happen without words, too, in subtle forms of...
2020-04-2924 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesSubtle Energies and HealingPsychotherapies that work, though with no agreement about how they work, are becoming mainstream. For example, EMDR is widely used in the treatment of trauma. So what can be said about their efficacy and what, if anything, do they have to do with subtle energies, morphic resonance, quantum phenomena or even the soul? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon dialogues, Mark Vernon asks Rupert Sheldrake how his theory of morphogenetic fields might relate to various types of therapy and healing. They consider how certain explanations can appear “hand wavy” and how to be more discerning when discussing these things. It t...
2020-03-1331 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesEco-confessionsClimate change has become the climate crisis, even climate emergency. In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake begins with an observation to Mark Vernon. He’s noticed how people are increasingly feeling the need to confess their carbon use and he wonders what that means. The thought develops into a conversation about living with the anxiety of our times where we can’t but help take part in eco-hostile activities. But maybe this is a necessary stage. Eco-confessions could help us to become more aware of our lives and the world around us. They might even be a cr...
2020-02-0332 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesImagination and Unfolding RealityMany today struggle to perceive spiritual reality. But might we be passing through a stage in the evolution of human awareness? In this episode of the Sheldrake-Vernon dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss a recent conference that addressed this question. It was inspired by the ideas of Owen Barfield, whom Mark has written about in his new book, A Secret History of Christianity. Barfield argued the task is not just to recover old ways of perceiving nature and the divine but requires a radical transformation of ourselves that can be troubling and even tragic. Rupert and Mark ask...
2019-12-2836 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesTrinitiesAristotle called three a perfect number. We offer three cheers of praise. Christians envisage God as triune. In this new episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask why three is associated with completion, creativity, dynamism and divinity. Their discussion ranges over the patterns of three that are revealed in nature; the relationship between being, consciousness and bliss; the links between a third position and transformation in psychotherapy. The discussion was prompted a Cambridge University conference, New Trinitarian Ontologies, which featured leading theologians such as Rowan Williams and David Bentley Hart. Their talks can be found...
2019-11-1729 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesThe Evolution of ReligionThe origins of religion lie deep in the story of human evolution. But as Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss in this new episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, the scientific study of our encounter with other worlds is changing. It has been proposed that humans believe in gods because punishing presences keep individuals in check, but that's discredited. New research is turning back to an older idea that our ancestors developed the ability to enter altered states. It’s fascinating partly because new evidence puts spiritual questing in the driving seat of human evolution. It also takes us back to...
2019-10-1430 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesBig History and the Need for MeaningBig histories are big sellers. Noah Yuval Harari, David Christian and Felipe Fernández-Armesto are among the authors attempting to tell a deep story of the universe and humanity. In this episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask how they work and what’s at stake. Mark is particularly interested in this question as his new book, A Secret History of Christianity, adopts a different worldview to show how spirit and soul drive life. The conversation ranges over fascinating questions from the nature of information and emergence to what, given the current sense of crisis, we...
2019-08-2731 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesThe Front Line of ParapsychologyThe evidence for psi is dismissed by sceptics with increasingly dogmatic assertions. But that's no surprise because the data in support of phenomena from telepathy to pre-sentience is now openly discussed in leading science journals. The real question, at the forefront of research, is how these experiences can best be understood? In this episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss various possibilities. They draw on the proposals aired at a recent seminar attended by the leading theorists, including Rupert himself. They explore the ideas of practising physicists and biologists working the area, and move onto...
2019-07-0630 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesLiving in An Age of Spiritual CrisisThe depth of the environmental crisis is becoming clearer. Social crises are around us, too. But do these realities stem from a deeper spiritual crisis? In this episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss whether we’ve become uncoupled from the foundations of life, which are not just biological and social but spiritual. They discuss how this loss shows itself in difficulties ranging from mental health to social cohesion. They ask how a society that doesn’t have a sense of the spiritual becomes unreal, as if our desires can be fulfilled solely in material ways...
2019-06-1135 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesCeltic Christianity And NatureAnxiety about the natural world is high and with good reason. Surprisingly, perhaps, the earliest days of Christianity in the British Isles have something vital to teach us. In this episode of The Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogues, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon take a lead from a new book, The Naked Hermit: A Journey Into the Heart of Celtic Britain, by Nick Mayhew-Smith. It makes several arresting claims. For example, the early missionaries, before the Synod of Whitby, engaged in a deep dialogue with the indigenous druids and pagans of these islands to forge a new engagement with the natural world...
2019-05-1025 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesPsychedelicsMany people today seek an expansion of mind through the use of psychedelics. So what other worlds, intelligences and entities are being encountered and sought in such experiences? In this Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss psychedelics and spiritual paths. They ask why they are of such interest now. They explore the effects they have and how these relate to other altered states of consciousness, from dreams and divine encounters to inspired visions. They ask how these experiences can be transformative, and whether they can be accessed in other ways. What dangers might be encountered, both psychological...
2019-03-2228 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesPilgrimageMillions of people around the world make pilgrimages. In a supposedly secular Europe, the spiritual practice is booming too. In this latest Sheldrake-Vernon dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss the revelatory experiences that people have when engaging with shrines and megaliths, temples and springs in this way. They talk about the evolutionary origins of pilgrimage and its roots in the living consciousness of places. They ask what it feels like to embrace these ancient pathways today and how anyone can very simply, very powerfully make pilgrimage an astonishingly expansive part of life.
2019-02-1123 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesWhat is Hell?Some preachers threaten hellfire, whilst others quench the flames with divine love. In this Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogue, following a suggestion of a regular listener, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask what sense can, today, be made of hell. Is it primarily a psychological state, in which people are locked up by distress? Is it a region of reality that some people, many people, or perhaps all people are at risk of traveling too? Does experience now shape the experience of the hereafter? How does the hell of the Greek and Judeo-Christian traditions relate to the hell realms charted in Eastern...
2018-11-0233 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesSpiritual EvolutionWe live in an unprecedented age for spirituality. Spiritual practices that were originally confined to relatively isolated traditions are being used and investigated by numerous individuals and an increasing number of scientists. In this latest Sheldrake-Vernon dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask what this mass undertaking, from meditation to pilgrimage, might mean for the evolution of spiritual sight. How does science illuminate spiritual practices, what’s new about the practices of today, and what role is played by other features of modern life, like a strong sense of the individual and the ego?
2018-08-2728 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesConsciousness in the Age of MachinesIt’s clear that our world is profoundly shaped by machines, from motor cars to mobile phones. But what impact do they have upon our awareness? In the latest Sheldrake-Vernon dialogue, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss a fascinating new book, In The Shadow of The Machine by Jeremy Naydler. It’s a prehistory of the computer, tracking the way human consciousness evolved in order to conceive of a mechanised world. Sheldrake and Vernon ask what’s been gained and what’s been lost in this process, the ways in which our perception of life and consciousness has been moulded...
2018-07-0225 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesMagicWhat is magic? How does it relate to psi and animism? Is prayer a kind of magic? In the latest Sheldrake-Vernon Dialogue, the series of conversations previously entitled Science Set Free, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon explore how people have engaged with the spirited economy of the natural world. They ask whether the purposes of magic evolve over time, whether it’s making a comeback in an otherwise secular age, and what its place might be in spiritual life.
2018-05-2128 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesThe Essence of ChristianityNow is a good moment to assess the essence of Christianity, to consider what lies at its heart, as we live in a period during which Christianity isn't disappearing but is routinely rubbing shoulders with other religions and none. In this episode of the Science Set Free podcast, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon ask what values and consciousness Christianity has helped develop - partly in response to a series of films Mark has made with The Idler Academy, entitled A History of Christianity in 11 Short Chapters. They ask about Christianity as an inner spiritual and outer social phenomenon; the...
2016-12-0629 min
The Sheldrake Vernon DialoguesFamily ConstellationsIn this Science Set Free podcast, Rupert Sheldrake and Mark Vernon discuss how we are not individuals but rather are more like nodes in networks. We are connected across living systems of families, organisations, cultures and spiritual traditions. The discussion focuses particularly on family constellations therapy, a way of examining how blocks and difficulties in life can be related to elements that we have taken on board from others. Rupert examines how this idea of inherited unconscious memory reveals what he has investigated as morphic fields. Mark asks how what is revealed in constellations workshops can be related to...
2016-02-0225 min