Shows
The Metrics BrothersThe Metrics Brothers HiatusAfter 122 episodes covering SaaS metrics, GTM analytics, and the evolving world of AI-native software, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike announce that The Metrics Brothers podcast is going on hiatus.In this abbreviated special episode, Ray and Dave reflect on what made the show work, what made it hard, and why now is the right time to take a pause. They share their top-performing episodes across 122 weeks, including the all-time most-listened episode on NRR, a breakout episode on pipeline generation, and the Intercom AI transformation episode that set a record for first-week downloads.They...
2026-06-0312 min
AI to ROILeveraging AI to Reduce Churn and Increase NRR - with Dan Harmeson, Co-Founder and Co-CEO at QuadSciMost B2B software companies are sitting on one of the most powerful and underutilized data assets in their business: product telemetry. Every click, API call, and feature interaction is a signal. The question is whether your go-to-market organization knows how to read it.In this episode, Ray Rike is joined by Dan Harmeson, co-founder and co-CEO of QuadSci, to explore how machine learning applied to telemetry data is changing how software companies predict churn, protect the base, and accelerate expansion revenue.Key topics covered in this episode:Why telemetry data is the largest...
2026-06-0230 min
AI to ROIThe AI Agent Outcome-Based Pricing Journey - with Kunal Agarwal, CFO GorgiasWhat does it actually look like when a CFO drives the strategic, pricing, and financial decisions behind an AI-first product transformation? Kunal Agarwal, CFO at Gorgias, the leading e-commerce customer experience platform for Shopify merchants, joins our host, Ray Rike to share the unfiltered story of how Gorgias built, priced, and operationalized its AI agent product from the ground up. This episode goes well beyond theory, covering the real decisions, real numbers, and real lessons learned from a company that has roughly half its customer base already using its AI agent product.Episode Highlights:The build...
2026-05-2733 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Agentic Work Unit (AWU)Salesforce made waves in February 2026 by introducing the Agentic Work Unit, or AWU, as a new way to measure and potentially price AI agent activity. The Metrics Brothers, Ray "Growth" Rike and Dave "CAC" Kellogg dig into whether the AWU is a legitimate step toward outcome-based pricing, a vendor-specific adoption metric, or just another awkward intermediate measure in the long, messy history of software pricing models.Episode Highlights:Tokens are not business metrics. Ray and Dave open by drawing a clear line: tokens measure text processing and compute consumption, not business outcomes. Nobody walks into a...
2026-05-2727 minThe Metrics BrothersPrivate Credit and the Medallia IncidentWhat happens when a $6.4 billion PE buyout becomes a cautionary tale for every SaaS operator, investor, and board member? In this episode, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike break down Private Credit: what it is, how it works, and why it is showing up everywhere from venture rounds to leveraged buyouts. Then they walk through the Medallia deal step by step to show exactly how the model breaks.What we covered:Private credit 101: from venture debt to leveraged buyoutsPrivate credit is non-bank lending done by funds instead of banks, with a...
2026-05-1329 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Redpoint 2026 State of the Market ReportDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike dig into the Redpoint Ventures 2026 Software and AI Market Update - a 69-page report built on proprietary CIO survey data from 141 respondents, plus public market data from Qatalyst, Pitchbook, Goldman Sachs, RBC, and McKinsey. Big report with even bigger implications. Ray and Dave unpack the data that matter most for B2B SaaS and AI-native software operators.WHAT WE COVER IN THIS EPISODEThe AI Build-Out Is Real and It's Not the Dot-Com BubbleHyperscaler CapEx is projected to hit $765B in 2026, up nearly 50% year over...
2026-05-0729 min
AI to ROIThe AI-Native Services Playbook - with Jake Saper, General Partner - Emergence CapitalOur host, Ray Rike sits down with Jake Saper, General Partner at Emergence Capital, to unpack the firm's AI-Native Services Playbook. Jake brings a unique lens: 12 years at Emergence, early-stage bets on companies like Zoom, and a portfolio of seven AI-native services businesses already in the portfolio. The conversation covers what separates AI-native services from SaaS, why the business model is harder to execute than it looks, and the five metrics and structural choices that determine who wins.WHAT WE COVER IN THIS EPISODEDomain Expertise: Critical - But Not Required from the Founders
2026-05-0730 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Intercom AI TransformationDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike tell the full story of how Intercom, a $400M ARR company that stalled at 4% growth, executed one of the most dramatic AI-first transformations in B2B SaaS. From writing off tens of millions in ARR to building a proprietary vertical AI model, this episode breaks down what it actually took to reinvent a mature SaaS business from the ground up.Topics CoveredFrom 4% to 26% Growth: The Numbers Behind the Turnaround. Intercom hit rock bottom with five straight quarters of declining net new ARR before founder Eoghan McCabe returned and...
2026-04-2923 min
AI to ROIThe Role of the CAIO in a Managed Service Provider - with Jim Piazza, CAIO EnsonoRay Rike sits down with Jim Piazza, Chief AI Officer at Ensono, a managed services provider scaling AI across both its internal operations and customer environments. Jim brings a rare combination of deep infrastructure experience, nearly a decade at Meta scaling data center operations with machine learning, and a rigorous framework for connecting AI investments to business outcomes that executive operators can actually measure.Key Topics:Defining the Chief AI Officer Role in an MSP: Jim describes the CAIO role as a blend of CDO, CIO, and CTO with an AI lens, but with a...
2026-04-2828 min
AI to ROIOn Paper, the SpaceX IPO is Not So HeavenlySpaceX filed for what could be the largest IPO in history, targeting a $1.75 trillion valuation and $75 billion raise on NASDAQ in June. Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan cut through the narrative and go straight to the numbers, business unit by business unit.Key Topics:The Launch Services Monopoly Falcon 9 launches cost roughly $67 million, compared to $110-160 million for competitors. With over 100 launches per year, $4 billion in NASA contracts, and a freshly awarded Space Force contract, SpaceX has no meaningful competitor at scale. The catch: the next-generation Starship rocket, critical to everything else in the bull...
2026-04-2433 minThe Metrics BrothersThe State of B2B Go-to-Market in 2026: The ICONIQ FindingsDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss the ICONIQ 2026 State of GTM Report, a 32-page benchmark study based on a January 2026 survey of 155+ B2B SaaS executives across CROs, CEOs, and RevOps leaders. The pair digs into what the data says about how high-growth companies go to market differently, how usage-based pricing is reshaping sales compensation, and where AI in the GTM stack is actually delivering results versus falling short.Topics CoveredGTM Motion Mix: Top-Down vs. Bottom-Up vs. Hybrid. The data shows roughly 60% of companies use a hybrid motion, but high-growth companies skew more...
2026-04-2227 min
AI to ROIAI's Organizational Impact: McKinsey's State of Organizations 2026 ReportRay Rike and Peter Buchanan dig into McKinsey's 2026 State of Organizations Report, a landmark study drawing on more than 10,000 senior executives across 15 countries and 16 industries. The central finding is both simple and uncomfortable: the vast majority of organizations are actively experimenting with AI, and that same majority reports no meaningful impact on their bottom line. This episode is about closing that gap.Topics CoveredThree Tectonic Forces Reshaping Every Organization. McKinsey identifies AI and agentic systems, economic and geopolitical fragmentation, and workforce transformation as structural shifts rather than temporary headwinds. Ray and Peter unpack why these...
2026-04-2233 min
AI to ROIBeyond OpenClaw - The Rise of Personal AI AgentsIn this week's AI to ROI: Big Story episode, Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan unpack the OpenClaw phenomenon and what it reveals about the future of personal AI agents for both individuals and enterprises.From a solo developer's side project to 1.5 million active agents in two months, OpenClaw has ignited a new category and forced every major AI company to respond. Ray and Peter break down what is working, what is still broken, and which vendors have the best shot at winning the enterprise.Top Insights from This EpisodeOpenClaw Proved the...
2026-04-1631 min
AI to ROIThe Power of Eye Tracking for the Enterprise - with Adam Gross, Co-Founder & CEO of HarmonEyesEye tracking has moved far beyond the clinic and the sports performance lab. In this episode, Ray Rike sits down with Adam Gross, co-founder and CEO of HarmonEyes, to explore how AI-powered eye-tracking is being deployed in enterprise environments to measure cognitive load, predict performance degradation, and reduce costly employee burnout and attrition before problems occur.What You Will Learn:What eye tracking actually measures and why objective, passive, quantifiable eye movement data is more reliable than self-reported assessments for measuring cognitive and attention statesHow AI transforms raw eye data into actionable intelligence, including real-time model...
2026-04-1433 minThe Metrics BrothersSegments vs. Cohorts: What’s the Difference?One word can reveal a lot about someone's analytical depth, and on this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike break down one of the most commonly misused pair of terms in metrics analysis: segments and cohorts.Dave shares what sparked this topic, a Norwest benchmark report that used the word "cohort" when it clearly meant "segment," and explains why the mix-up matters far more than a simple vocabulary error. In this episode, Ray and Dave cover:Segments vs. Cohorts Defined: A segment is a slice of data defined by a...
2026-04-0128 min
AI to ROIPricing Strategy for AI Software and SaaS: When to Change, Who Should Own It, and the CFO's Role with Dan BalcauskiPricing is one of the most underleveraged strategic levers in B2B SaaS and AI Software. Most companies are getting it wrong. In this episode, Ray Rike sits down with Dan Balcauski, founder of Product Tranquility and a 20-year software industry veteran, to cut through the noise around consumption, usage, outcome, and hybrid pricing models. Dan brings a practitioner's perspective on when to review pricing, who should own it, and how the CFO fits into the equation.Signs Your Pricing Needs a ReviewBest-in-class companies review pricing at least quarterly -- but review does not always...
2026-03-3133 min
AI to ROIThe Power and Promise of Vertical AIWhile the AI headlines obsess over foundation model fundraises and hyperscaler spending, a quieter revolution is generating real, measurable returns. In this episode of AI to ROI: The Big Story, Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan break down why vertical AI companies may be building the most durable and valuable businesses in the history of enterprise software, and why most people aren't paying attention yet.What's covered in this episode:Defining Vertical AI: What separates vertical AI from horizontal tools like Microsoft Copilot or Google Workspace AI, and why the distinction matters for buyers and investors alikeA...
2026-03-3135 minThe Metrics BrothersNorwest B2B Sales & Marketing Benchmark ReportThe Metrics Brothers, Dave Kellogg and Ray Rike open with their introductory bit, which this week included Statler and Waldorf, the grumpy old men in the balcony from the Muppets, before diving into a thorough review of the Norwest B2B Sales and Marketing Benchmark Report, a102-page study published in November 2025, that included 177 participants (77 Norwest portfolio, 100 third-party VC/PE-backed).Key Topics Covered:Overall Report Assessment: Praised for its breadth, year-over-year trend data, and even split of marketing (40%), sales (42%), and combined (18%) respondentsMarketing Budgets: Smaller companies ($5M–$15M ARR) saw dr...
2026-03-2532 min
AI to ROIThe Superhuman AI Agent - with Amanda Kahlow, CEO & Founder, 1MindIn this episode of the AI to ROI Podcast, host Ray Rike sits down with Amanda Kahlow, founder and CEO of 1Mind. Prior to 1Mind, Amanda was the founder and former CEO of 6sense, an early pioneer in intent data.The Vision Behind 1Mind: Amanda founded 6sense to help companies find buyers; she founded 1Mind to close them. 1Mind builds what she calls "go-to-market superhumans", AI agents that take on multiple roles across the full customer lifecycle, from inbound qualification and live demo delivery to deal closing for SMB/commercial accounts, and even post-sale onboarding, upsell, and...
2026-03-2432 min
AI to ROIDeloitte 2026 State of AI Report - The Untapped EdgeOn this AI to ROI Big Story episode, our hosts Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan dig into Deloitte's 2026 State of AI Report, a 41-page annual study surveying over 3,300 business leaders on the state of enterprise AI adoption. Deloitte calls it "The Untapped Edge," and Ray and Peter unpack exactly why.They walk through the report's seven key inflection points from scaling pilots into production and reimagining business processes, to agentic AI, sovereign AI, and physical AI, with a focus on what the data actually means for companies trying to drive real ROI in 2026.Key topics...
2026-03-2329 min
AI to ROIAI to ROI: Big Story - Will the Angst, Agony, and Adversity of AI be Worth It?Is the trillion-dollar AI bet actually going to pay off? In this episode of AI to ROI, hosts Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan tackle the big question head-on: with hyperscalers pouring over $600 billion into AI infrastructure this year alone, enterprises struggling to move pilots into production, and white-collar job postings already falling 16% year-over-year, the anxiety is real and justified. But so is the optimism.Ray and Peter break down why the same supply constraints slowing AI buildout may actually give companies and workers more time to adapt, why foundation model costs have plummeted 97% since 2023, and how IBM's...
2026-03-2031 min
AI to ROIAI-Native ERP vs. Legacy ERP: What's the Difference? with Santiago Nestares, Founder & CEO of DualEntryWhat does it actually mean for an ERP to be AI-native and why does it matter for your finance team? In this episode of the AI to ROI podcast, host Ray Rike sits down with Santiago Nestares (Santi), Founder and CEO of DualEntry, to unpack the real differences between legacy ERP systems and a ground-up AI-native platform.Santi shares the origin story behind DualEntry, born from a painful nine-month ERP implementation at his previous company that cost a team of 12 and hundreds of thousands of dollars—and explains why simply adding AI features on top of...
2026-03-1729 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Rule of 40 Becomes the Rule of 60For more than a decade, the Rule of 40 has been the gold standard for measuring SaaS performance:Growth Rate + Profit Margin ≥ 40But in today’s environment of higher interest rates, multiple compression, private equity leverage, and AI-driven cost pressures, that benchmark may no longer be enough.In this episode of the Metrics Brothers, Ray “Growth” Rike and Dave “CAC” Kellogg explore why many investors and operators are now targeting something far more ambitious:The Rule of 60.Dave walks through the history of SaaS economics, from the growth-at-all-costs era, to the rise of...
2026-03-1125 min
AI to ROIThe Rise of the Chief AI Officer (CAIO)Is your company leaving money on the table by not having a Chief AI Officer? In this episode, Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan dig into groundbreaking research from IBM's Institute of Business Value, spanning 600+ executives across 22 geographies and 21 industries to unpack why dedicated AI leadership is quickly becoming non-negotiable for enterprises competing in today's market.The numbers tell a compelling story: only 26% of companies currently have a CAIO, yet those that do are seeing 10% higher ROI on their AI investments and are 24% more likely to outperform their peers. And that gap? It's widening. With 66% of...
2026-03-1025 minThe Metrics BrothersA Tale of Two AI Futures - Citrini vs CitadelIn this episode, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike go point-counterpoint on two high-profile articles making waves across Wall Street and Silicon Valley: Citrini's provocative February 2025 report, The 2028 Global Intelligence Crisis, and Citadel's rebuttal, The 2026 Global Intelligence Crisis.Dave and Ray unpack whether AI is truly triggering an unprecedented economic collapse or whether Citrini's dark simulation is, as one economist put it, just "a scary bedtime story." They dig into the SaaS private credit contagion theory, the historic parallels of labor displacement, the role of government regulation, and why this particular AI scare hits closer to ho...
2026-03-0527 min
AI to ROIThe SaaS to AI-First Transformation - 3 Examples from Notion, Canva and ServiceNowThis episode of the AI to ROI podcast, hosted by Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan, explores how leading SaaS companies are surviving the "SaaSpocalypse" - a massive market cap devaluation triggered by the rise of AI. The hosts break down the transition from traditional SaaS to AI-first models, emphasizing that simple "feature bloating" isn't enough; companies must undergo a fundamental "organ replacement" of their architecture, pricing, and culture.The discussion deep-dives into three success stories:Notion: Transformed from a document suite into an agentic execution platform through strategic acquisitions, moving toward autonomous workflows.Canva: Democratized design...
2026-03-0427 min
AI to ROIAI SDR Learnings, Results, and ROI - with Jacco van der Kooij, Winning by DesignIn this episode, our host Ray Rike sits down with Jacco van der Kooij, founde and CEO, Winning by Design, to discuss the real-world deployment of "Jack" - an AI SDR that has spent the last 12 months redefining the front line of Go-To-Market (GTM) strategy. Jacco shares the "AHA" moments and hard truths discovered while moving beyond human constraints like slow response times and inconsistent qualification. Discover how treating an AI SDR (agent) as a "system" rather than a "product" initially led to 2,030 conversations, 100% CRM capture, and a $200,000 deal.Episode SummaryWinning by Design set...
2026-03-0234 minThe Metrics BrothersICONIQ State of AI: Bi-Annual Snapshot ReportIn this episode, the Metrics Brothers, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike dive deep into the ICONIQ State of AI: Bi-Annual Snapshot Report. Published in January 2026, this 44-page report summarizes insights from ~300 software executives on the front lines of building and scaling AI products.Ray and Dave explore a market transition from experimental model races to the challenge of building durable, economically sound products. Key discussions in this episode include:Differentiation Beyond the Model: Why 69% of builders are focusing on vertical AI applications and why 49% cite the application layer (UX and workflows) as their primary...
2026-03-0230 min
AI to ROIThe Great AI War on JobsAre we witnessing a productivity revolution or the greatest labor displacement in history?In this detailed episode of AI to ROI, Peter Buchanan and Ray Rike break down the "Great AI Jobs War," a period of massive upheaval where corporate gleefulness meets workforce anxiety. They move past the "AI washing" to find the real metrics that define success in the age of intelligence.Key Discussion Points:The Historical Context: Ray draws parallels between the AI revolution and past disruptions like the Industrial Revolution, the cotton gin, and the assembly line, noting...
2026-02-1929 min
AI to ROISaaS to AI-First TransformationIn the second episode of AI to ROI: The Big Story, Ray Rike and Peter Buchanan analyze the critical transformation required for traditional SaaS companies to become AI-first organizations. With the SaaS industry generating $273 billion annually, the hosts warn that incumbents are under "two-front" attack: internal refactoring of legacy systems and external disruption from hyper-efficient AI-native startups.Key Highlights of the Episode:The "SaaS to AI" Pivot: Ray compares the current shift to the on-premise-to-SaaS transition of 20 years ago, noting that today’s change requires a fundamental rewrite of an operating culture rather than just adding "AI...
2026-02-1232 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Impact of AI on Labor Productivity and GrowthIn this episode of the Metrics Brothers podcast, Ray Rike and Dave Kellogg tackle one of the most critical yet misunderstood metrics in the U.S. economy: Labor Productivity. Amidst the rapid rise of Artificial Intelligence, the "Metrics Brothers" break down how productivity is officially measured by the Bureau of Labor Statistics and why historical technology booms, from SaaS to Cloud, haven't always moved productivity growth as much as expected.Key Takeaways: A deep dive into the ratio of economic output per hour worked, including what the BLS excludes (farms and government) and the nuances of white-collar...
2026-02-1125 min
AI to ROIContext Graphs - AI’s Trillion-Dollar TechnologyIn the first episode of the AI to ROI: Big Story podcast, our co-hosts Peter Buchanan and Ray Rike discuss the emerging importance of Context Graphs in AI Software.Why are context graphs suddenly being called a trillion-dollar opportunity in enterprise AI? In this inaugural episode of The Big Story, hosts Ray Rike (CEO of Benchmarkit) and Peter Buchanan (Managing Partner of New Plan) dive into the "glue technology" that fills the missing gap in the AI stack.While traditional knowledge graphs tell you what happened, context graphs reveal the why! Context Graphs capture the...
2026-02-0624 minThe Metrics BrothersBrand Measurement Metrics and TechniquesBrand is one of the most powerful assets a company can build and one of the hardest to measure. In this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Dave “CAC” Kellogg, and Ray "Growth" Rike take on one of marketing’s most persistent challenges: how to measure brand in a world obsessed with direct attribution and near-term ROI.The conversation starts with what a brand really is, originating from literal marks of ownership and evolving into a promise of quality, trust, and differentiation. From there, Ray and Dave explore why strong brands create pricing power, customer loyalty, category leadership, and lo...
2026-02-0526 min
AI to ROIMeasuring the performance and business impact of AI agents - with Todd Olson, Founder and CEO PendoWelcome to the first episode of AI to ROI, the newly re-imagined evolution of the highly successful Metrics That Measure Up podcast. In this launch episode, our host, Ray Rike sets the stage for a new era of conversations focused on turning artificial intelligence from hype into measurable business outcomes.The inaugural guest is Todd Olson, Founder and CEO of Pendo, who joins the show for an interactive, unscripted discussion on how companies should measure the real impact of AI agents inside modern SaaS and cloud organizations. Together, they explore how AI-driven “digital workers” are reshaping productivity, work...
2026-02-0427 minThe Metrics BrothersThe State of Generative AI in the Enterprise 2025The State of Generative AI in the Enterprise 2025In this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Ray Rike and Dave Kellogg break down the 2025 State of Generative AI in the Enterprise report from Menlo Ventures and explain what the data really says about where enterprise AI adoption is accelerating and where the market is consolidating.The headline takeaway: AI software is scaling faster than any software category in history. Enterprise AI spend has exploded from roughly $1.7B in 2023 to nearly $37B in 2025, reaching scale in just three years. This revenue milestone took SaaS more than 15 years...
2026-01-2824 minThe Metrics BrothersDissecting the MIT NANDA ReportThe claim that “95% of AI projects fail” has become one of the most repeated talking points in enterprise AI. But where did it come from, and does it actually hold up?In this episode, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike take a detailed, data-driven look at the MIT NANDA report, titled The GenAI Divide: State of AI in Business 2025. They break down how the "95% fail rate" statistic went viral, why it stuck, and why the underlying evidence does not support such a sweeping conclusion.What Ray and Dave cover:Why the NANDA report is o...
2026-01-2126 minThe Metrics Brothers2026 Brand vs Demand Benchmark ReportBrand vs Demand: Why B2B Marketing Is Stuck in a Measurement TrapIn this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike tackle one of the most persistent and controversial questions in B2B marketing: Brand vs. Demand.The discussion is grounded in new data from the 2026 B2B Brand vs Demand Benchmark Report. While most marketing teams say they believe brand and demand are complementary, the numbers tell a more complicated story.Today’s reality?Marketing budgets are still heavily skewed toward short-term demand generation, wi...
2026-01-1426 minThe Metrics BrothersTidemark 2025 Vertical SaaS ReportIn this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike break down the 2025 Tidemark Vertical & SMB SaaS Benchmark Report. Drawing from data across 200+ companies, the report explores control points, multi-product expansion, fintech monetization, and AI adoption, but not all conclusions hold up under scrutiny as they are sometimes take on the tone of a narrative summary rather than insights purely from data-backed research.Ray and Dave dig into what the data actually supports versus where narrative may be running ahead of evidence. They unpack the concept of “control points,” examine why fintech (especially paym...
2026-01-0726 minThe Metrics BrothersAI Eats the World by Benedict EvansIn this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Ray Rike and Dave Kellogg unpack Benedict Evans’ latest landmark presentation, AI Eats the World, and explore why this moment may rival or even surpass the original “software is eating the world” era. Drawing parallels to Marc Andreessen’s 2011 thesis, they examine how AI is no longer just another platform shift, but a force capable of reshaping labor, capital allocation, and entire industries at once.The conversation spans the explosive rise in AI infrastructure spending, from hyperscaler capex surging past $400B to the growing strain on power, compute, and supply chains...
2025-12-3026 minThe Metrics BrothersHigh Alpha SaaS Benchmarks 2025 ReportIn this episode of The Metrics Brothers, hosts Ray “Growth” Rike and Dave “CAC” Kellogg provide a critical deep dive into the 2025 SaaS Benchmark Report published by High Alpha. Known for their analytical, and sometimes "crusty" approach, the metrics brothers dissect the data behind 800+ SaaS companies to separate real market trends from report commentary.Key Highlights & BenchmarksThe brothers break down the report’s most significant findings with their signature skepticism regarding "correlation vs. causation."The AI Growth Premium: Companies with AI at their core are growing significantly faster than those using AI as a supporti...
2025-12-1727 minThe Metrics BrothersExpansion ARR and NRR in a Variable Pricing Environment - Part 2In this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Ray “Growth” Rike and Dave “CAC” Kellogg take on one of the biggest challenges facing modern SaaS and AI-Native companies: how to measure NRR and expansion when pricing isn’t fixed anymore.With the rise of usage-based, user-based-but-variable, and outcome-based pricing, the traditional world of ARR - long the backbone of SaaS metrics has been turned on its head. Contracts no longer tell the story. Spend does.Dave breaks down how to rethink ARR proxies using quarterly or monthly revenue (“implied ARR”) and why longer intervals help smooth volatility, es...
2025-12-1240 minThe Metrics BrothersCalculating NRR in Usage- and Outcome-based PricingIn this episode, "The Metrics Brothers," Growth (Ray Rike) and CAC (Dave Kellogg), dive into a critical challenge for modern SaaS and AI-Native companies: accurately calculating Net Revenue Retention (NRR) in environments that utilize variable pricing models (usage-based, outcome-based, etc.).They begin by defining NRR, emphasizing its importance as a key metric and its high correlation with Enterprise Value-to-Revenue multiples.The brothers then dissect the primary challenge: the absence of traditional Annual Recurring Revenue (ARR) in non-annual contract models. They explore different proxies for ARR, including MRR x 12 and Implied ARR (Quarterly Revenue x 4), and...
2025-12-0521 minThe Metrics BrothersA New Agentic AI Metric: Containment RateIn this episode of The Metrics Brothers, Ray “Growth” Rike and Dave “CAC” Kellogg break down one of the emerging metrics in the Agentic AI era: Containment Rate - the percentage of tasks an AI agent completes (resolves) end-to-end without human intervention.They explore multiple aspects of the Containment Rate Metric including:How containment rate differs from classic chatbot metric - deflection rateWhy defining “resolved” and/or "completed" is essential to calculating containment rateHow the metric connects directly to ROIWhy ROI needs to include both the benefit (cost-savings) and the investment (expense) for the AI Agent
2025-11-2022 minThe Metrics BrothersWhat is ROI and Why Does it Matter in AI Software Investments?The buzz about ROI from AI software investments is palpable, so Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike take on the topic of measuring Return on Investment on AI software investments. During today's episode, Dave and Ray discuss the details on measuring ROI including:Defining Return on InvestmentSoft vs Hard BenefitsProductivity - the primary benefit of AI investments todayBuy versus Build & Run - an old problem is new againROI models need to go beyond payback periodLook back reviews - the value vs the realityReturn on Investment (ROI) is not a...
2025-10-2922 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Iconiq State of Software 2025 ReportIconiq recently published its State of Software 2025: Rethinking the Playbook. Whenever a new industry benchmark report is published, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike try to quickly read, analyze and decide if the report should be discussed on an episode of the Metrics Brothers. The Iconiq State of Software 2025 is a solid industry report that includes several key findings that Dave and Ray discuss during this episode including:Ai-Native vs AI-Enabled vs non-AI segmentationGrowth's impact on Enterprise Value to Revenue multiplesRevenue growth trends by company sizeNet Revenue Retention BenchmarksCAC Payback Period BenchmarksAdoption vs Engagement vs Outcomes for A...
2025-10-0825 min
AI to ROIThe Strategic Future of FP&A - with Albert Gozzi, Founder and CEO AlephThe world of FP&A is having its day in the spotlight. New pricing models, a new focus on near real-time business planning, the increased focus on balancing revenue growth and profitability, coupled with the dynamic impact that AI is having on the SaaS market, are all making the role of FP&A a more strategic asset. Albert Gozzi, is the founder and CEO of Aleph, a modern FP&A platform and company that recently raised $29M in their Series B financing from Khosla Ventures.During today's episode, our host, Ray Rike is joined...
2025-10-0830 min
AI to ROIThe Use and ROI of AI in Finance - with Sowmya Ranganathan, Former Controller OpenAI and CEO, LumeraThink about the unparalleled growth that OpenAI has experienced since the public introduction of ChatGPT on November 30, 2022. Now, think about being in finance, or being the controller who had to scale their financial processes, including closing the books to keep up with a company that has scaled from less than $100M in revenue to $10B+ in less than 3 years!?!?That was the situation that Sowmya Ranganathan, Former Controller OpenAI and CEO, Lumera found herself facing in the early part of 2023.During today's conversation with Sowmya, our host Ray Rike discusses several important lessons...
2025-10-0131 min
AI to ROIThe Role of FP&A in Business Strategy - with Christina Ross, Founder and CEO CubeChristina Ross is the founder and CEO of Cube. Prior to founding a SaaS platform purpose built for everyone of those companies still using Excel (majority of companies) for business modeling but want to enhance the collaboration of business budgeting, planning and performance across the company, Christina was a corporate audit executive at GE, financial transformation consultant at Deloitte and a multi-time CFO at companies including Rent the Runway, Criteo and Eyeview.During today's episode, Christina and our host, Ray Rike discuss multiple aspects of the Financial Planning and Analysis role, department and the...
2025-09-1831 minThe Metrics BrothersBessemer's State of AI 2025 ReportBessemer Venture Partners recently released their State of AI 2025 Report, a space exploration manual for the AI software era. With AI now the dominant software force, let's dive into what Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike took away from the report in today's episode:The key differences in performance metrics between AI Supernovas and Shooting StarsWhy Vertical AI companies have a unique opportunity to outperform horizontal AI companies in the early daysThe importance of building a structured Proof of Concept or Pilot program into your customer acquisition processThe top 5 predictions for the AI market in 2026Top 10 takeaways...
2025-09-1025 minThe Metrics BrothersAI Valuations from AventisAventis Advisors recently published a report on AI Valuations which covered the number of investments, size of those investments, median valuations and multiples on AI investments over a 15 year period from 2010 through first half of 2025!Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss some of the highlights including:AI industry categories includedNumber of financing rounds (2010 - 1H2025)Total Capital Raised (2010 - 1H2025)Median sizes by round (2010 - 1H2025)Valuations (2010 - 1H2025)Valuation multiples (2010 - 1H2025)Large Language Model valuations vs AI Coding Assistant ValuationsSummary of the AI funding environmentYou can follow...
2025-09-0323 minThe Metrics BrothersThe New AI Growth Metric: Months to $100M in ARRSaaS companies were traditionally measured on how many years it took to achieve $100M ARR - a key milestone! In today's brave new world of AI, this milestone is now measured in MONTHS. Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike highlight discuss this new AI growth metric in today's episode with many examples including:LovableCursorWizBoltAnthropicOpenAIDave and Ray discuss how these new hypergrowth AI-Native companies compare to some of the fastest growing traditional SaaS companies including DocuSign, Atlassian, Box, HashiCorp, Zoom and Slack.The Metrics Brothers then dive a little deeper into...
2025-07-3125 minThe Metrics BrothersAI MetricsAI and AI-Native companies are changing the software industry and the metrics to measure AI market momentum are still evolving.During this weeks episode, our co-hosts Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss a recent article on AI Metrics by Benedict Evans. AI measurements and metrics discussed include:Daily Active Users / Monthly Active Users (DAU/MAU)Tokens - what they are and how they are calculatedWeekly User RetentionDave and Ray take us on a stroll down "metrics memory lane" as they discuss the early days of the internet, and some o...
2025-07-1724 min
AI to ROIThe Role of the Fractional CFO - with Josh Aharonoff, Your CFO Guy and Founder Mighty DigitsJosh Aharonoff, better known as "Your CFO Guy" and the founder of Might Digits, a consultancy specializing in accounting, finance and fractional CFO services. Josh has amassed 450,000+ followers on LinkedIn, which is extremely rare for anyone, especially someone who caters to the corporate finance community!During Josh's appearance on the Metrics that Measure Up Podcast, he and our host, Ray Rike discuss a wide variety of topics including:The Role of the Fractional CFOWhen to consider an internal VP Finance or CFOWhy excel is a CFOs best friend…or NOTBuilding a LinkedIn following of 450K+ - th...
2025-06-1130 min
AI to ROIThe Data Intelligence Market in 2025 - with Ben Eisenberg, CEO People Data LabsThe Data and Sales Intelligence category includes a list of well known players such as ZoomInfo, Seamless and Apollo, and are now joined by new entrants like Clay and Lusha. But where does a pure play Data (Sales) Intelligence provider like People Data Labs fit - their CEO, Brian Eisenberg who has grown through the ranks at People Data Labs from Data Engineer to CEO provides his insights in how the Sales (People) Intelligence category is evolving.During today's episode, our host Ray Rike discusses multiple topics with Ben including:The top challenges customers are facing w...
2025-05-0829 minThe Metrics BrothersWhy Can’t We All Just Get Along? Aligning Finance and GTM with SaaS MetricsDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike recently did a LIVE episode of SaaS Talk with the Metrics Brothers at the Baker Tilly Technology Finance Symposium in San Francisco. The topic of their discussion was aligning Finance and the Go-to-Market functions and included how SaaS metrics can be used as a core "alignment" strategy. During this "extended" version of SaaS Talk with the Metrics Brothers, Ray and Dave discussed several different strategies to align Finance and the GTM functions, including:What is alignmentWhat isn't alignmentReal-life stories on what misalignment looks likePutting "Strategy" back into Strategic PlanningStrategic Pl...
2025-05-0845 min
AI to ROIMeasuring the ROI of Transitioning from Outbound to Inbound GTM - with Aviv Canaani, CRO DatarailsAviv Canaani is the Chief Revenue Officer at Datarails who recently transformed their Go-to-Market motion to be primarily inbound from the traditional outbound motion. During today's episode Aviv and our host, Ray Rike dive deep into multiple GTM strategies and measurements including:Top performance measurements for a B2B SaaS CROThe catalyst for transitioning to an "inbound GTM motion"The ROI for an Inbound vs Outbound GTM motionLeveraging Social Media to build awareness with the Office of FinanceMeasuring ROI in content and media investmentsAviv was initially the head of Marketing and then took o...
2025-04-1033 min
AI to ROINext Generation ERP - with Sandeep Chopra, Co-founder and Co-CEO at Everest SystemsEnterprise Resource Planning (ERP) has been the foundation for larger companies dating back to the introduction of SAP R-3 in the late nineties. Sandeep Chopra, Co-Founder and Co-CEO of Everest Systems says that ERP vendors have lost their "customer focus" and believes their is a large opportunity to re-invent ERP in the cloud to help companies run their business more efficiently. Introducing Next Generation ERP to the SaaS industry is the first step.During today's episode our host Ray Rike and Sandeep discuss the next era of ERP includingThe need for a next generation ERP...
2025-03-0629 min
AI to ROIState of Interactive Product Demonstrations - with Natalie Marcotullio, Head of Growth at NavatticSaaS buyers complete ~70% of the buying process before they speak to a vendor's sales organization. As a result more and more SaaS companies are leveraging interactive product demonstrations on their website which is the topic of today's episode. Natalie Marcotullio, Head of Growth at Navattic discusses their recent "State of Interactive Product Demonstrations" with our host Ray Rike where they cover multiple topics including:The State of Interactive Product DemonstrationsTo Gate or Not to Gate - what is the best practiceMeasuring the Impact of “Self-Directed” Interactive DemonstrationsIn 2024, almost 12% of SaaS companies are providing inte...
2025-02-0725 min
AI to ROIB2B Sales Elixir of AI + Collective Intelligence with Stephen Messer, Founder and CEO Collective[I]The possibilities of combining AI with the collective intelligence from hundreds of B2B companies to increase their customer acquisition efficiency are limitless. Stephen Messer, Founder and CEO of Collective[I] shares his unique insights into how the potential is becoming a reality for many B2B companies. During today's episode, Stephen and our host, Ray Rike will cover the following topics:The vision behind founding Collective[I] and the Economic Foundation ModelWhy buyer’s historic behavior is more important than a selling processThe challenges and benefits of a “give to get” collective for go-to-market data sharing
2025-01-2338 min
AI to ROIThe Role of a SaaS Acquisition Marketplace - with Andrew Gazdecki, Founder and CEO AcquireSaaS company acquisition velocity will increase in 2025 and the role of marketplaces purpose built for buyer and sellers will become a must visit for both. If you are considering selling or buying a SaaS company, this discussion with Andrew Gazdecki, Founder and CEO at Acquire.com is a must listen. During the episode Andrew and our host, Ray Rike cover the following topics:The catalyst for founding Acquire.comThe trends in B2B SaaS start-up and early stage company acquisitionsTop lessons learned from the insights of hundreds of B2B SaaS acquisitionsSome of t...
2025-01-1621 minThe Metrics BrothersICONIQ Growth 2024 Marketing Budgets and Productivity ReportMarketing budget and productivity benchmarks are hard to find, so when Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike first saw the ICONIQ Growth Marketing Budget and Productivity Report - they knew it was a great topic for this episode of SaaS Talk with the Metrics Brothers.During today's episode, Dave and Ray discuss several critical Marketing Planning, Budget, and Productivity benchmarks including:Marketing budget as a percentage of RevenueOn-line versus off-line spendProgram vs People budget allocationOnline Marketing spend by channelOff-line Marketing spend by programOutsourcing and Agency spend by program typeMarketing efficiency benchmarksPipeline contribution sources
2024-12-1827 minThe Metrics BrothersThe Service Titan S-1ServiceTitan, a vertical SaaS company for the trades recently filed their S-1 and went public on December 12, 2024. Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss many details regarding the S-1 including the basic enterprise value creating performance metrics and some very interesting aspects of the IPO structure.During this episode, Dave and Ray discuss several aspects of the S-1 and IPO measured against industry benchmarks including:ARR Growth RateRule of 40Net Dollar Retention RateCAC Payback Period Gross Margin S&M as a percentage of revenueR&D as a percentage of revenueARR per FTERevenue breakdown by category (Su...
2024-12-1227 min
AI to ROIThe Evolution of Variable Pricing Models & Revenue Management with Apurv Bansal - Founder and CEO ZenskarAs SaaS pricing evolves to be more variable in nature, such as in Usage-Based Pricing or Value-Based Pricing the requirements for a more flexible billing platform that also enhances the customer experience and also becomes a foundational component of financial reporting.Apurv Bansal, founder at Zenskar is converting that evolving need into a next generation billing platform. During this conversation with Apurv, our host Ray Rike covers the following topics with Apurv:The evolving nature of Usage-Based pricing and its Impact on Billing Software RequirementsThe role of customer experience in billing -Revenue Management - beyond manual...
2024-11-2030 min
AI to ROISaaS CEO and CFO Collaboration - with Godard Abel and Chad Gold, CEO and CFO G2Godard Abel, CEO of G2 and Chad Gold, CFO at G2 led a session at SaaS Metrics Palooza 24'. This is an audio only version of their fireside chat with Metrics that Measure Up host, Ray Rike.During this episode, Godard, Chad and Ray discuss the following topics:When does a company need to hire a CFOWhat is the partnership dynamics between a CEO and CFOWhat are the investor and board responsibilities for a CEO vs CFO at G2What metrics become more important as a company scales to $100M ARR and above
2024-10-2936 min
AI to ROIB2B Marketing Metrics Framework - with Bill MaCaitis - Former CMO Slack, ZenDesk and SalesforceBill MaCaitis the former Chief Revenue Officer at Slack, and previously the CMO at Slack, CMO at Zendesk, and SVP of Marketing at Salesforce joins our host Ray Rike to share the Marketing Metrics Framework he developed during his experience as a multiple time Chief Marketing Officer. During today's episode Bill and Ray discuss various topics including:Top lessons learned from Marketing leadership roles at category leadersCatalyst for developing a Marketing metrics framework with six categoriesPrioritizing Marketing metrics that the CEO and CFO care aboutStarting his career in more traditional B2C media...
2024-10-0133 minThe Metrics BrothersFree Cash Flow - A Deep DiveFree Cash Flow is a key metric for any SaaS investor and thus for SaaS CFOs and CEOs. Moreover Free Cash Flow Margin is a key variable in the Rule of 40 - a key enterprise value creation metric. Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike dive deep into the value behind the FCF metric and the different ways to calculate!During this episode Dave and Ray discuss the following elements of Free Cash Flow:Where to find Free Cash Flow on public company filingsThe three primary Cash Flow statementsDifferent formulas to calculate Free Cash FlowThe impact o...
2024-09-1823 minThe Metrics BrothersBessemer 2024 Cloud 100 ReportBessemer Venture Partners recently released their 9th annual Cloud 100 Report. Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike dive deep into the impact of AI companies on the top 100 private cloud companies which increased their aggregate enterprise value to $820B and increased their growth rate to 70%!Key highlights Dave and Ray discuss include:Aggregate enterprise value of the Cloud 100 increased 25% year over yearAverage growth rate increased from 55% in 2023 to 70% in 202497% of the Cloud 100 will be over $100M ARR by the end of the yearTop 10 companies in the Cloud 100 represent ~ 30% of the total Enterprise ValueAi companies represent the t...
2024-09-0921 min
AI to ROIEntering the U.S. SaaS Market from Europe - with Niclas Lilja, Founder and CEO YouniumNiclas Lilja, Founder and CEO at Younium recently joined our host, Ray Rike on the Metrics that Measure Up podcast to discuss his decision to re-locate from Sweden to the United States to better understand the U.S. buyer's market for recurring revenue billing solutions. During this fast-moving 30-minute conversation, Nic and Ray discuss the following topics:The Evolution of SaaS Pricing (yesterday, today and tomorrow)Global Expansion - The Cultural ChallengesHow Usage-Based or Hybrid Pricing Impacts SaaS Metrics CalculationTop 3 learnings as a European Founder and CEO entering the U.S. MarketWhy is...
2024-08-1333 minThe Metrics BrothersThe New SaaS Mendoza Line - Growth Expectations for a SaaS IPOThe SaaS Mendoza line highlights the slope of the long term growth rate that investors expect and operators should target on a path to IPO. Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike break down the updated expectations.Veteran software VC, Rory O’Driscoll of Scale Venture Partners proposed a theory to identify the growth rate below which a company may not be on the VC-to-IPO trajectory.In 2018, Rory started with an analysis of SaaS companies at the time of IPO. In 2018, SaaS companies going public had a minimum run rate ARR of $100M and at leas...
2024-08-1322 min
AI to ROIThe Global Sales Tax Challenge for SaaS Companies - with Michelle Valentine, Founder and CEO AnrokMichelle Valentine, Founder and CEO of Anrok is taking on the Sales Tax compliance challenges for B2B SaaS companies. Global Sales Tax compliance is a critical obstacle to successfully deploying a global Product-Led Growth strategy.Michelle's conversation with our host, Ray Rike covers a wide array of topics including:Evolution of Sales Tax and Compliance in SaaSChallenges of Global Sales Tax ComplianceDynamic Nature of SaaS Sales TaxEvolution from Investment Banking to Venture Capital to B2B SaaS Founder/CEOWhat was the catalyst for Michelle to found Anrok? Michelle's experience as a...
2024-08-0628 minThe Metrics BrothersThe OneStream IPO and S-1 BreakdownOneStream went public on July 24, 2024 and Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike dedicated this episode to discussing their S-1 and Initial Public Offering (IPO). OneStream, the company offering their Digital Finance Cloud to the Office of Finance has a long history including being self-funded, being acquired by Private Equity (KKR) in 2019 and beginning the transition from a perpetual license software company to a SaaS company in 2020 on the path to their IPO.During the episode, Dave and Ray discuss multiple aspects of the OneStream public offering including:The history of OneStreamKKR investment in 2019IPO pricingUmbrella...
2024-07-3026 min
AI to ROIThe Start-Up CEO Field Guide - with Matthew Blumberg, Founder and CEO BolsterMatthew Blumberg, author of the Start-Up CEO Field Guide and founder of Bolster provides his insights and highlights from his series of books for start-up executives. Our host, Ray Rike, and Matthew discuss many of the main topics in the Start-Up CEO and directly from Matthew's experience as a multiple-time founder and CEO including:Lessons from being the founder & CEO at the same company for ~ 20 yearsImportance of Authentic Leadership in Changing TimesMoving beyond Storytelling to Execution to Selling your companyEach book in the "Start-Up" series was written specifically to help founders and CEOs u...
2024-07-2240 min
AI to ROISelling Business Value to the CFO and CRO - with Sean Brophy, Head of Global Sales, PigmentSean Brophy, the Head of Global Sales at Pigment joins our host, Ray Rike to discuss selling the Return on Investment of Financial Planning, Modeling, and Forecasting Software to both the Chief Financial Officer and the Chief Revenue Officer.Topics discussed during the conversation include:The challenges of selling to the CFO & CRO as economic buyersHow the business perspective on the value of planning, modeling, and forecasting has evolvedProving value and ROI to the CFO as the economic buyerTop Sales Performance MetricsSean has spent 20+ years on helping companies turn data into...
2024-07-0929 min
AI to ROIThe Evolution of B2B Software Reviews - with Godard Abel, G2 Founder and CEOGodard Abel, Founder and CEO of G2 is a pioneer in the world of B2B Software and SaaS reviews joins our host, Ray Rike to discuss the benefits of being a multiple-time CEO as he guides G2 into the next stage of growth and success. During the conversation, Godard and Ray cover a wide array of topics including:The benefit of being a multiple-time B2B SaaS Founder and CEOHow the experience of a Salesforce acquisition impacts perspectiveThe vision behind G2 and B2B Software Reviews (yesterday and tomorrow)How AI will change the B2B SaaS...
2024-06-2637 min
AI to ROISelling to the CFO - with Tim Riitters, CFO at GongTim Riitters, CFO at Gong sits down with our host Ray Rike to discuss the keys to successfully selling to a CFO. Tim provides a unique perspective as both a multiple time CFO and being the CFO at Gong who is helping to make a CFOs live easier with their Revenue Intelligence and AI enables forecasting solution!During this episode we cover four primary topics with Tim including:How Tim uses SaaS metrics to inform decision making at GongHow Gong uses SaaS metrics in board reporting and QBRsThe key considerations to understand when selling technology to...
2024-06-1233 minThe Metrics BrothersBenchmarkit 2024 SaaS Performance Metrics Benchmark ReportBenchmarkit recently published their 2024 SaaS Performance Metrics Benchmark Report based upon 936 B2B SaaS companies participation. Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss the recent trends and insights.SaaS Metrics and the corresponding benchmarks discussed include:2023 Growth Rates2024 Planned Growth RatesCAC Ratio (Blended, New and Expansion)CAC Payback PeriodNet Revenue RetentionSales and Marketing expenses as a % of RevenueARR per EmployeeThe full report and interactive benchmarking tool can be reached at: benchmarkit.ai/2024benchmarksIf you work in the B2B SaaS or Cloud industry this episode is a m...
2024-06-1223 min
AI to ROIThe Future of B2B Events - with Patrick Smith, CMO at CventPatrick Smith, Chief Marketing Officer at Cvent joined our host Ray Rike to discuss the Future of B2B Events including the latest trends and critical components required to engage attendees in 2024 and beyond.See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
2024-06-0726 min
AI to ROIThe State of Global Hiring - with Tony Jamous, Founder and CEO Oyster HRTony Jamous, Founder and CEO Oyster HR share his insights on the global employee strategy imperative and his insights into why global employment is so important to the world's economy. During this episode, Tony and our host, Ray Rike discuss a wide array of global employment topics including:The Sustainable CEO - the what, why and howWhy global employment is important to the world economyThe reality of global employees - it may surprise youThe top three challenges in implementing a global employee strategySee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy...
2024-06-0526 min
AI to ROIThe Journey to Head of Marketing - with Brandon Redlinger, VP Marketing Chili PiperBrandon Redlinger, Vice President of Marketing joins our host Ray Rike to discuss his journey to becoming the head of marketing for Chili Piper, a leading B2B SaaS company. The topics they cover include:The path to VP Marketing and beyondThe benefit of building a personal LinkedIn brand and followingThe evolution of the B2B SaaS CMO roleHow will B2B Marketing evolve in the AI eraBrandon's first role was as a Sales Development Representative and then as an AE for a few years. Then he discovered his passion for technology and...
2024-05-2937 min
AI to ROIThe Evolution of Revenue Operations - with Henry Mizel, SVP RevOps at ApolloHenry Mizel, the Senior Vice President of Revenue Operations and Partnerships at Apollo.io has over 8 years of experience as a Revenue Operations professional. During today's episode Henry and our Host, Ray Rike discuss the evolution of Revenue Operations as a function and a profession including the below topics:The evolution of Revenue OperationsThe primary responsibilities and measurements of RevOpsRevOps - strategic function or a tactical departmentProduct function to GTM executives (Data Side)Examples of unique value deliveryIf you are a Revenue Operations professional or an executive leader interested in learning more about h...
2024-05-2229 minThe Metrics BrothersRedpoint Venture - State of the Market '24 Report ReviewLogan Bartlett, Managing Director at Redpoint Ventures recently shared the Market Overview Report they presented to their Limited Partners in March '24 at their AGM event at the Chase Center in San Francisco. Ray "Growth" Rike and Dave "CAC" Kellogg review the key insights during this episode.Insights that Dave and Ray discussion include:Enterprise Valuations - a return to 2019Growth Rate trends - a return to a time long ago in a land far awayThe value of Growth vs Profitability - the trends and the factsDown Rounds, Shut Downs and No Rounds
2024-05-1521 min
AI to ROIAI Enabled Customer Communications - with David Daneshgar, Co-Founder and CEO WhippyHow does being a World Series of Poker champion influence the entrepreneurial journey? That was one of the surprising insights that David Daneshgar, Co-Founder and CEO of Whippy shared during his appearance on this weeks episode.During David's conversation with our host, Ray Rike he shared his experiences and vision for AI enabled customer communications which including the below topics:How being a World Series of Poker Champion helps David as an entrepreneurThe promise, potential and reality of AI empowered customer communicationsCustomer Use Cases for AI enabled customer communicationsIf you are...
2024-05-0828 min
AI to ROIHas SaaS lost Go-to-Market Fit - with Jacco van der Kooji, founder and CEO Winning by DesignSpeaking to Jacco van der Kooij, Founder and CEO, Winning by Design is like drinking a shot of espresso first thing in the morning.During this episode of the Metrics that Measure Up podcast, our host Ray Rike covers a wide array of topics that essentially asks the question - "Has SaaS lost Go-to-Market Fit?" and if so "What to do about it". Topics covered include:Data that highlights the need to change Go-to-Market tactics in SaaSThe concept and reality of the need to "Cut to Grow"The importance of Unit EconomicsGo-to-Market Fit - What is...
2024-02-2330 minThe Metrics BrothersTop Metrics for a Chief Customer OfficerDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss the top metrics for a Chief Customer Officer to use presenting to the board and to report to the executive team when the CCO has responsibility for: 1) Customer Success; 2) Professional Services and; 3) Customer SupportNet Revenue RetentionGross Revenue RetentionCustomer Health ScoreBillable PS RevenueBillable UtilizationGross MarginCases per AgentPost Case Closed CSATDeflectionsThose these are the high level metrics for a CCO, each function will have more detailed lagging and leading indicator metrics that Dave and Ray will cover in subsequent episodes of SaaS Talk with the Metrics...
2024-02-1022 min
AI to ROIThe Evolution of Customer Success - with You Mon Tsang, Founder and CEO ChurnZeroYou Mon Tsang is the founder and CEO of ChurnZero. During this episode, You Mon and our host, Ray Rike discuss the following topics:How the role of Customer Success has evolved over the past 12 - 24 monthsHow the measurements used to determine CS ROI have evolvedThe top three metrics that You Mon recommends for Customer Success teamsThe catalyst for founding ChurnZero began when he was a Marketing leader and had a large selection of technologies to automate, manage, and measure marketing performance. When You Mon assumed responsibility for Customer Success, he quickly realized...
2024-01-1736 minThe Metrics BrothersGrowth Adjusted Enterprise Value to Revenue Multiple (ERG)How the Enterprise Value of a SaaS company impacted by growth rate is the topic of today's conversation with Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike - the result is a new metric named "ERG" - the Enterprise Value to Revenue to Growth Rate Multiple.During this episode, Dave and Ray highlight several leading public, B2B Cloud companies and how their Enterprise Value to Revenue multiples are impacted when the growth rate is factored in. With a public Cloud/SaaS company median growth rate of 21%, the median Enterprise Value to Revenue multiple of 6.1x a...
2024-01-1022 minThe Metrics Brothers2024 SaaS Metrics PredictionsDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike go out on a limb and share their predictions on the Top 5 SaaS Metrics in 2024 - some are old friends and two are brand new for 2024!!!2023 was a year focused on efficient growth, extending cash runways and making progress towards profitability. Simultaneously, certain metrics became more important in correlation to enterprise value to revenue multiples - including the re-emergence of the Rule of 40 being critical to company valuations. Which metrics are Dave and Ray predicting as the Top Five for 2024:Rule of X - a growth-weighted Rule...
2024-01-0322 min
AI to ROICorporate Venture Capital Investing at Microsoft - with Peter Berg, Managing Partner at M12Peter Berg, Managing Partner at M12 - the Microsoft corporate venture capital arm joins our host, Ray Rike to discuss the trends and measurements of success in venture capital inside Microsoft.Topics that Peter provide deep insights into included:The role of Corporate Venture Capital - insight from Visa and MicrosoftThe evolution of venture investing in 2024 and beyondMega-trends that will shape the future of technology investing Top 3 Cloud/SaaS Industry forecasts for 2024If you are interested in how large technology companies use a captive internal VC organization to drive strategy, ecosystem reach...
2023-12-2028 min
AI to ROIB2B Demand Generation Investment and Performance Trends - with Kevan Savage, The Alexander GroupKevan Savage, Principal of the Marketing practice at the Alexander Group shares the results of the research and associated report from the Alexander Group - Unveiling Pipeline to Profits with our host, Ray Rike. The report highlights the trends in demand generation and the associated return on investment of those changes. Key topics discussed during this episode include:Marketing expense trends as a % of RevenueAllocation of Marketing investments for Demand GenerationPipeline contribution by sourceFull conversion benchmarks from Marketing Qualified Leads to RevenueAs companies model and plan for next year - this episode is...
2023-12-1229 min
AI to ROICloud Computing Cost Management - with Phil Pergola, CEO CloudZeroPhil Pergola, CEO at CloudZero shares his unique insights into how to better understand, manage, and reduce the Cost of Goods Sold associated with using Cloud Computing infrastructure for B2B SaaS applications. During this episode Phil and our host, Ray Rike discuss the following topics:Cloud Cost Trends as a percentage of the Cost of Goods Sold (COGS)Reducing Cloud costs techniques beyond vendor negotiationHow to identify Cloud cost-saving opportunitiesGross Margins in the B2B SaaS industry have remained fairly stable over the past 10 years - so why focus on Cloud costs...
2023-11-2838 min
AI to ROIThe Evolution of the SaaS CFO Role - with Chad Gold, SalesloftChad Gold, the CFO at B2B SaaS Sales Engagement Platform leader Salesloft, shares how the role of a SaaS CFO has evolved over the last few years.Chad and the Metrics that Measure Up podcast host, Ray Rike discuss the following topics during this episode:How the B2B SaaS CFO role has evolvedHow performance metrics are used to manage and report on the businessHow performance metrics are used for budgeting and planningHow the B2B SaaS CFO Role will evolve over the next few yearsChad started his career as...
2023-10-2426 minThe Metrics BrothersTop Take Aways from ICONIQ | Growth 2023 Benchmark ReportDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike dive deep into the ICONIQ | GROWTH 2023 - The New Era of Efficient Growth Report to discussed several key report components including:Enterprise Five MetricsResiliency RubricTrade-off between Growth and EfficiencyExpansion vs New Logo contribution to New ARROperating Expenses as a % of RevenueBenchmark utilization cautions, concerns and insightsGo grab the ICONIQ | Growth Report - take it for a read while listening to this episode to see if some of the key points Dave and Ray make resonate with your own personal perspectives.See Privacy Policy at...
2023-10-0525 min
AI to ROIMostly Metrics - The Creator's Challenges with CJ GustafsonCJ Gustafson, CFO at PartsTech and the creator of the Mostly Metrics Newsletter and Run the Numbers podcast joins our host Ray Rike on this episode to discussVanity Metrics and why they are so dangerousSaaS Metrics that might not be that valuableCautions when using a Usage-Based Pricing modelThe motivation of being a social media creator for B2B SaaSThe challenges of being a social media creatorCJ and Ray share several interesting insights and sole disclosing perspectives on the opportunities and challenges of creating content on all things SaaS MetricsSee...
2023-09-2632 minThe Metrics BrothersNet Revenue RetentionDave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike continue their discussion on the importance of measuring revenue retention. This week they cover Net Revenue Retention (NRR) - a top three B2B SaaS Metric. 'During this episode they cover many aspects of how to calculate and use Net Revenue Retention including:Cohort method versus formula methodThe impact of Usage-Based Pricing on the NRR calculationNRR benchmarks using a Good, Better, Best frameworkIdeas on how to optimize and increase NRRIn addition, Dave and Ray answer three audience submitted questions - fulfilling their goal...
2023-09-2127 min
AI to ROIHacking SaaS - with Eric Mersch, author and Partner FLG PartnersEric Mersch is the author of "Hacking SaaS" and a partner at FLG Partners. Eric joined our host, Ray Rike to discuss the details behind the thought process of writing the book and why he segmented it into discrete sections and chapters based upon the following:SMB to Mid-Market B2BEnterprise B2BB2CVertical Industry SolutionsHorizontal SolutionsDuring this episode, Eric and Ray will dive into several of the B2B SaaS Metrics that Eric wrote about including:Customer Lifetime Value to CAC (CLTV:CAC Ratio)Net Revenue Retention (aka Dollar Based Net...
2023-09-1938 minThe Metrics BrothersGross Revenue RetentionOn this episode, Dave "CAC" Kellogg and Ray "Growth" Rike discuss Gross Revenue Retention (GRR), aka Gross Dollar Retention (GDR), and the different nuances to consider when calculating this metric.In addition, Dave and Ray discuss why this metric is important, how to calculate GRR and how to use the results to inform decision making.The Metrics brothers discuss the following nuances of calculating Gross Revenue RetentionThe definition of GRRCohort vs Formula MethodWhat to exclude and include in GRRHow is GRR impacted by Product Led Growth and/or Usage-Based Pricing environmentsHow does Churn...
2023-09-0526 min
AI to ROICommunity + Content + Event Lead Growth - with Anthony Kennada, Founder and CEO AudiencePlusAnthony Kennada, is the founder and CEO of AudiencePlus and formerly the Chief Marketing Officer at Hopin and Gainsight...quite the pedigree!Anthony joined our host, Ray Rike to discuss the evolving nature of community and content led-growth, which is a strategy and topic trending across every B2B SaaS CMO. Anthony takes the topic a step further and highlights why "Owned Media" is a critical component in every B2B SaaS CMOs Go-to-Market strategy.Anthony's experience in using content and community at Gainsight serves as the foundation for Anthony's vision for AudiencePlus and its...
2023-07-1128 min
The Metrics BrothersSaaS Talk™ with the Metrics Brothers - Ray "Growth" Rike & Dave "CAC" KelloggSaaS Talk™ dives deep into the world of Software as a Service, discussing the successes and hurdles that C-suite leaders in the SaaS industry encounter.Co-hosted by Ray Rike, CEO of Rev Ops Squared, and Dave Kellogg, Executive In Residence at Balderton Capital and Principal at Dave Kellogg Consulting, this podcast brings forth insights and perspectives from esteemed SaaS leaders. They share knowledge and experience on a wide array of topics, including SaaS strategy, business model innovation, customer success management, revenue operations, SaaS metrics, infrastructure and security, and data-driven decision-making.Whether you're a C-suite executive in...
2023-05-1021 min
AI to ROIConversational Intelligence delivers Revenue Reality - with Amit Bendov, CEO and Co-Founder, GONGConversational Intelligence (CI) is a technology that materially enhances the effectiveness of every B2B Sales professional.CI has quickly become a "must-have" component in the B2B sales tech stack and has become a feature in most Sales Engagement Platforms...WHAT is the future of Conversational Intelligence?Our host, Ray Rike, recently spoke with Amit Bendov, Founder and CEO of Gong.io, to discuss the vision and future of Gong and the Revenue Reality.Amit's premise was "is there a better way to get market feedback" from every communication channel into the...
2021-11-2434 min
AI to ROIMOVE: A Go-To-Market Strategy with Sangram Vajre, Founder Terminus and Flip My Funnel PodcastSangram Vajre, Founder and Chief Evangelist at Terminus and host of the Flip my Funnel Forecast, joined our host Ray Rike to discuss his MOVE Go-To-Market framework.Sangram ran marketing at Pardot, an early marketing automation vendor for salespeople, which Salesforce ultimately acquired and co-founded Terminus seven years ago. Terminus is a true pioneer in providing a platform for Account-Based Marketing programs, which in today's B2B SaaS world represents about 44% of total marketing investment in customer acquisition programs.The first thing Sangram shared was that marketing and sales need to SHARE the s...
2021-10-2636 min