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The Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 50: ITS UK's Max Sugarman on taking a strategic approach to transportation technologyMax Sugarman is chief executive of ITS UK. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, Max discusses the organisation’s recently published manifesto, the perks of membership and taking a strategic approach to transportation technology. Interview begins at 3:302025-06-0527 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 49: Kirk Steudle on working under different administrations and the latest exciting techKirk Steudle is legendary former Michigan DOT director. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, he discusses what it's like working under different administrations and his own perspective on moving from the public to the private sector as well as proving an industry overview including the latest tech that excites him.The episode is sponsored by MAV Systems2025-05-0129 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 48: Wes Marshall on his book 'Killed by a Traffic Engineer'Wes Marshall is a traffic engineer and author. His new book - Killed by a Traffic Engineer: Shattering the Delusion that Science Underlies Our Transportation System - is a fascinating exploration of why we continue to engineer roads that are literally killing its drivers via an industry focussed only on how to get from point A to B in the fastest way time. And - crucially - what to do about it. This episode is sponsored by MAV Systems.2025-03-2740 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 47: MAV System's game-changing ANPR cameraAndy Humphries and Chris Shepherd, respectively managing director and lead product and support manager for MAV Systems, chat with TTi editor Tom Stone about the AiQ, the company’s new ANPR camera, as well supporting different sectors, edge processing and the challenge of ghost plates. This episode is sponsored by MAV Systems. 2025-03-0344 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 46 - Safer fleets with Peter GoldwasserPeter Goldwasser is executive director of Together for Safer Roads. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, Peter discusses his international NGO, the use of AI 360 camera technology on large commercial vehicles to reduce blind zones, and the organisation's "truck of the future" pilot.Interview begins 5:15 2025-02-1317 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 45 - MJ Maynard on the use of AI in VegasMJ Maynard is CEO of the Regional Transportation Commission (RTC) for Southern Nevada. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, MJ offers a deep dive into the RTC's use of AI in the Las Vegas area, including technology that can zero in on a weapon. This episode is sponsored by Q-FreeInterview begins 5:152025-01-2327 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 44 - V2X with Brian CroninBrian Cronin is director of the ITS joint programme office at the US DOT. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, Cronin discusses the V2X deployment program he oversees, pilot projects, OEM buy-in and what the new Trump administration might mean for the DOT. This episode is sponsored by Q-Free. 2025-01-0831 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 43 - Asset management with Jochen Reiss of HexagonJochen Reiss is part of Hexagon’s asset life cycle intelligence division. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, Jochen will discuss managing transit and infrastructure assets, visualising your assets in real time, what a badly managed asset looks like, and data collection. This episode is sponsored by Hexagon, a global leader in sensor and software technologies2024-11-2026 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 42 - AI traffic monitoring with VivaCity's Anna KerenAnna Keren is chief technology officer with AI traffic monitoring and signal control firm, VivaCity. In conversation with TTi editor Tom Stone, Anna discusses the company’s mission, sharing near miss data with traffic planners and VivaCity’s forthcoming TTi webinar Using AI and Computer Vision to Achieve Vision Zero and Net Zero Goals.To register for the webinar on Wednesday 13th November click here2024-11-0321 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalEpisode 41 - The future of tolling with Pat Jones, CEO of the IBTTAPat Jones, executive director and CEO of the International Bridge, Tunnel and Turnpike Association (IBTTA) talks about the challenges of replacing fuel tax with road user charging, the Be Safe Together campaign, the upcoming annual meeting of the IBTTA - and the benefits of being based in Washington DC. 2024-10-1529 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #40 - ITS World Congress preview special with Joost Vantomme, CEO, ERTICOJoost Vantomme is chief executive of ERTICO, ITS Europe. In this ITS World Congress preview special, he talks in detail with TTi editor Tom Stone about what to expect at this year's 30th anniversary event in Dubai. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth.2024-09-1022 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #39 - Autonomy NOW - with Dr Stefan HeckDr Stefan Heck is CEO of Nauto, an AI-enabled driver and fleet safety platform. From their offices close to Silicon Valley, Stefan talks with TTi editor Tom Stone about sensor technology, the economics of collision avoidance and how to deliver safety benefits to autonomous vehicles right now.Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth.2024-08-1533 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #38 - AI traffic lights with Tal KreislerTal Kreisler, co-founder and CEO of No Traffic, talks smart traffic lights and how the No Traffic solution deploys video-based AI technology to improve traffic flows.Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth.2024-08-0833 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #37 - Standalone autonomous driving technology with Eran Ofir of ImagryEran Ofir, CEO of mapless AI-based autonomous driving solution Imagry, talks with TTi editor Tom Stone about how stand-alone autonomous driving works – and his views about its advantages over connected autonomy.Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth. Interview begins at 5:00.2024-07-2340 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast 36 – Getting public buy-in with Adam ProbolskyAdam Probolsky, president of Probolsky Research, talks with  TTi editor Tom Stone about how to garner public opinion and how to get public buy-in for new projects – because whatever you’re doing in transportation, it doesn’t work if the public doesn’t accept it.  Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth. Interview begins at 5:00.2024-06-2027 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #35 - Jaime McAuley, event director ITS AmericaIn discussion with TTi editor Tom Stone, ITS America's Jamie McCauley talks active travel, autonomous taxis and what to look out for in Phoenix, Arizona at this month's ITS America. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth. Interview starts at 5:00. 2024-04-1226 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #34 - Everett Lott, head of the DOT for Washington DCIn discussion with TTi editor Tom Stone, Everett Lott talks equality in transportation access, what it means to be a state DOT right next to the federal government, the challenges of heading up the DOT in the nation’s capital, and giving people options. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth. Interview starts at 4:30. 2023-07-2528 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #33: ITS Europe specialRecorded at ITS Europe in Lisbon, this episode features two main interviews: Eric Sampson, ERTICO’s legendary senior congress adviser and founder member of the international study group that led to the formation of ERTICO; and Vladimir Vorotovic , ERTICO’s director of innovation and development. Also featured: Max Sugarman, new chief executive of ITS UK, Paula Claytonsmith, chief executive of the Local Council Roads Innovation Group or LCRIG, and Steve Novosad, associate fellow at HNTB and a key player in Tampa Florida’s USDOT Connected Vehicle Pilot. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wor...2023-05-2319 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #32: Tim Haile - Contra Costa Transportation AuthorityTim Haile, executive director of the Contra Costa Transportation Authority, talks about his work with Contra Costa,  reflects on his ITS America experience and discussed his own new transportation podcast, On The Patio. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth2023-05-0512 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #31: Interview with Scott Lee, chief engineer with Transmart TechnologiesThis epsiode is sponsored by Wejo. Our interview is with Scott Lee, chief engineer with Transmart Technologies. As a user of Wejo’s real-time connected vehicle data, Scott is able to offer insight into how he uses the results, as well as how else it might be deployed, both now and in the future. 2023-02-2428 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #30 - Gareth Evans of WejoGareth Evans, vice president of public sector engagement for episode sponsors Wejo. Gareth reveals how Wejo connected vehicle data is helping to enable the design of safer, more efficient roads - and how it is empowering agencies to secure funding grants for quantifying successful road upgrades already undertaken.Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth2023-02-0734 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast #29 - Preview of the ITS World Congress with CEO Laura ChaseOur feature interview is with Laura Chase, president and CEO of ITS America. Laura discusses next week's ITS World Congress in LA with TTi editor Tom Stone.  Interview begins at 4:15. 2022-09-1418 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast 28: Challenging the driverless consensus - an interview with professor Peter NortonPeter Norton is associate professor of history in the department of engineering and society at the University of Virginia. In this interview he talks about his recent book Autonorama: The Illusory Promise of High-Tech Driving, arguing that driverless cars cannot be the safe, sustainable, and inclusive “mobility solutions” that tech companies and automakers are promising us. He claims the salesmanship behind the driverless future is distracting us from investing in better ways to get around that we can implement now that are inexpensive, safe, sustainable, and inclusive. Subjects of discussion include smart highways, the focus on autonomous vehicles and the...2022-07-0823 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe future of road user charging: an interview with Steve MorelloOur feature interview is with Steve Morello, senior advisor with CDM Smith. Steve talks road user charging (RUC), educating drivers about what RUC is paying for, the switch to EVs and how the do-nothing approach is no longer viable.  Interview begins at 3:45. 2022-06-1017 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalIntertraffic Amsterdam 4 – The Award Winners!TTi editor Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth are podcasting every day this week from Intertraffic Amsterdam. Their Day Three review features an interview with the three winners of the Intertraffic Awards.Interviews begin 4:102022-03-3111 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalIntertraffic Amsterdam 3 – Joost Vantomme, CEO of ERTICOTTi editor Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth are podcasting every day this week from Intertraffic Amsterdam. Our Day Two review features an interview with Joost Vantomme, the new CEO of ERTICO.Interviews begin 4:102022-03-3009 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalIntertraffic Amsterdam: Day One Review!tti editor Tom Stone is live from Amsterdam! This episode features two interviews: Pieter Litjens, chairman of the Interraffic awards jury and director at CROW, knowledge institute for infrastructure, public space and mobility. And also Nico Anten, chairman of Connekt, ITS Netherlands2022-03-2915 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalIntertraffic Amsterdam: Preview special!Intertraffic Amsterdam is upon us - and TTi is all over it! Here's a preview of this week's event with TTi editor Tom Stone and editor-at-large, Saul Wordsworth2022-03-2505 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalConnected vehicle regulation: Steve Sprouffske of Kapsch TrafficComThis episode is sponsored by Kapsch TrafficCom.Our feature interview today is with Steve Sprouffske, vice-president of connected vehicle services with Kapsch TrafficCom. Steve discusses connected vehicle regulation, hardware, Kaptsch’s latest pilot schemes and how 5G and roadside hardware can work together. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth. Interview begins at 4:45. 2022-03-0732 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalV2X, pedestrian protection and 5G: an interview with Commsignia's András VáradiOur feature interview is with András Váradi, research director with podcast sponsors Commsignia. Andras talks roadside infrastructure, pedestrian protection, ultra wideband and 5G. Plus news and conversation with iVT editor Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth. Interview starts at 5:452022-02-0425 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalITS America 2021: New chair Roger Miller speaks from CharlotteRoger Millar,  director of Washington State DOT and the new chair of ITS America, discusses this week’s ITS America 2021 in Charlotte, why it’s a good time to be part of the transportation space and climate change. 2021-12-0911 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalSafer roads with David BraunsteinOur feature interview is with David Braunstein, president of Together for Safer Roads. David talks about the recent increase in road risk, near-miss analysis and minimising the distractions of smart phones. Plus news and conversation with iVT editor Tom Stone and editor-at-large Saul Wordsworth. 2021-11-2534 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalCycling, LEZ and bus service franchising: an interview with Sir Richard LeeseSir Richard Leese is leader of Manchester city council in the UK. He talks covid, cycling, e-bikes, low emission zones and bus service franchising. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.Interview with Sir Richard Leese begins at 6:302021-10-2233 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalITS World Congress is nearly here! An interview with ERTICO's Angelos AmditisAngelos Amditis is chairman of ERTICO. With the ITS World Congress in Hamburg just weeks away, Angelos discusses what we can learn from the last 18 months, the effect of the pandemic on public transportation, building the foundations of MaaS, and sharing best practices. 2021-09-2238 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalBuild-up to the ITS World Congress - interview with Jacob BangsgaardTTi editor Tom Stone talks with ERTICO-ITS Europe CEO Jacob Bangsgaard about the forthcoming ITS World Congress in Hamburg, the return of events in general, and how sustainability is driving the industry forward.  Interview starts 7.00. 2021-07-2727 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalSmart motorways and AI - an interview with Verra Mobility's Mark TalbotMike Talbot was CEO of Redflex until its recent takeover by Verra Mobility, with whom he is now vice president government solutions. Mark talks about Verra's scope and resources, new products, smart motorways and AI. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.Interview with Mark Talbot begins at 6:152021-07-0624 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPODCAST 14: Maximizing city data - an interview with Gridwise CEO, Ryan GreenRyan Green is co-founder and CEO of Gridwise, an app that’s been described as the leading assistant for rideshare and delivery drivers.  Ryan discusses how driving for Uber and Lyft led him to create a solution that maximizes  drivers' road time and  profits, how Gridwise is consolidating its rich city data for other mobility stakeholders by offering a comprehensive view of how people and goods are moving across gig-mobility services, and whether much-maligned ride-hailing services could actually make transport systems more efficient. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.Interview with R...2021-06-0825 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalPodcast 13: Why pay-by-phone will be a cornerstone of MaaS - an interview with Mike McCamonMike McCamon, executive director of the NFC (near-field communication) forum, talks with TTI editor Tom Stone about passive wallet technology, the importance of wireless payments for Mobility as a Service, and NFC’s use as digital key for passenger vehicles. Interview begins at 7:20.Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth. For more information visit www.nfc-forum.org  2021-05-1731 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalManaging sidewalk robots: an interview with Bern GrushBern Grush is co-founder and chief innovation officer with Harmonise Mobility, and a well-respected industry figure.  In this fascination interview Bern talks about standards and safety around sidewalk robots, which are being developed  to solve last-mile delivery issues in urban centers. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.Interview begins at 6:45. 2021-04-1633 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe USDOT's Connected Vehicles pilot in Florida: an interview with Bob FreyOur feature interview is with Bob Frey, innovation director and CV project manager at Tampa Hillsborough Expressway Authority (THEA). Bob has helped to oversee the USDOT's Connected Vehicle Pilot Program in Florida since it began in 2014. In this exclusive interview, he is able to reveal more about the unique fourth stage of the project, involving automotive OEMs. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.The interview with Bob Frey begins at 7:15.2021-03-2332 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalAn interview with Phil Blythe: chief scientific adviser with the UK’s DfTOur feature interview is with Phil Blythe, professor of intelligent transportation systems at Newcastle University and chief scientific adviser with the UK’s Department for Transport.  Blythe talks Covid, decarbonisation and the introduction of electric vehicles and infrastructure. Plus all news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.The interview with Professor Blythe begins at 8:25.2021-02-1532 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalTolling and traffic on the Florida Turnpike - an interview with Nicola LiquoriNicola Liquori is Florida Turnpike Enterprise’s CEO. She discusses her mission to oversee the building of a new back-office system that will ensure income is secured more seamlessly than ever, the return of Florida traffic to close to pre-pandemic levels, and recent strides made in interoperability. Plus all news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.The interview with Nicola Liquori begins at 4:25.2020-12-0928 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalCovid, science and urban legend: an interview with Greg WinfreeGreg Winfree is director of the Texas A&M Transportation Institute and former assistant secretary at the USDOT during the Obama administration. Winfree shares his observations about the impact of Covid-19, how when it comes to Covid and travel, science and urban legend don’t always match up, and the challenges surrounding spectrum sharing in the 5.9GHz band for connected vehicles. Plus news and conversation with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.Interview starts at 7:45. 2020-10-0740 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalConnected vehicles standards: an interview with Steve NovosadSteve Novosad is associate fellow at HNTB and chair of the OmniAir Consortium, the industry’s leading association promoting interoperability and certification for connected vehicles. Novosad talks about his involvement in the USDOT’s high-profile connected vehicle pilot project Florida, as well as the importance of standards in connected vehicle technology (interview starts 08:35). Plus all the latest news and chat with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.This episode is sponsored by Siemens Mobility.2020-09-2432 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalAn interview with Shailen Bhatt, president and CEO of ITS AmericaShailen Bhatt is a passionate advocate for improving the safety and efficiency of transportation networks through the application of smart technology. Here he talks to TTI editor Tom Stone about the challenges surrounding connected vehicles and spectrum sharing in the USA, the ITS World Congress, both in its physical and virtual forms and why, given half a chance, he loves to sing. 2020-08-2735 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalTransportation and AI: An interview with Priscilla Boyd of Siemens MobilityPriscilla Boyd, senior data analytics manager with podcast sponsor Siemens Mobility's ITS digital lab, discusses how their new software solution harnesses AI to help predict where and when events will take place in a city, and even suggests ways to lessen the impact they might have on traffic and public transport systems (interview starts 07:35). Plus all the latest news and chat with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.This episode is sponsored by Siemens Mobility.2020-07-2934 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalConnected vehicles and the USA's newest DOT: An interview with Josh RowanJosh Rowan, commissioner, Atlanta Department of Transportation (ATLDOT) for the City of Atlanta, talks about the new agency, how connected vehicle technologies can help to improve safety and his vision for the future. Plus all the latest news and chat with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.This episode is sponsored by Applied Information, leading providers of connected vehicle and smart city solutions.Visit our CONNECTED VEHICLE SURVEY for your chance to win £100 in Amazon vouchers.2020-07-0936 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe future of connected vehicles: An interview with Bryan MulliganBryan Mulligan, president of podcast sponsors Applied Information, discusses the best means of vehicle connectivity - and what the recent Space X launch might mean for future traffic models. Visit our CONNECTED VEHICLE SURVEY for your chance to win £100 in Amazon vouchers. Plus all the latest news and chat with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth. 2020-06-1839 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalMicromobility and the new normal: An interview with Fran LaveyFrancesca Lavey, mobility programme director for Plexal, discusses the e-scooter trial that she helped to oversee at the Queen Elizabeth Olympic Park, London – and how such micromobility solutions could soon be more prevalent on Britain’s roads, as we look for more innovative ways to get around during the Covid-19 crisis. Plus, all the latest news and chat with Tom Stone and Saul Wordsworth.2020-05-2630 minThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalThe Transportation Podcast from Traffic Technology InternationalAdapting to the Covid-19 world: Interview with JJ EdenCovid-19 has taken the world by surprise, endangering millions, affecting billions and changing the workplace for everyone. We speak to JJ Eden, tolling giant and co-founder of the E-Z Pass network, to gauge how traffic is being affected by the pandemic. Plus news and the odd laugh with Saul and Tom.2020-04-2731 min