Shows
Rough DraftsEpisode 15: Black Arms to Hold You Up (w/Ben Passmore)On this episode of Rough Drafts, L and M interview political cartoonist Ben Passmore about his newly released graphic novel Black Arms to Hold You Up, a book about Black armed struggle histories in the United States. L introduces Ben at the beginning of the episode and talks about his involvement as a researcher for the book. Ben talks about inserting himself into the novel (15:55) as a character in relation to Black radical histories. The conversation also touches on humor in the graphic novel when writing about Black radical histories with a respect and reverence (24:45). M asks Ben about...
2025-10-071h 04Rough DraftsEpisode 14: The Past, Present and Future of American and Global WarsWhat does war mean in the context of the 21st century? How has 9/11 and the so-called War on Terror shaped American life? And, what do the conflicts of the future look like?
M reflects on his brief stint at the United States Military Academy, and L shares about the military’s influence on the manosphere. They think about the role of technological innovations like drones, artificial intelligence, and robots, as well as present-day conflicts such as Russia-Ukraine, and the formidability of non-state actors in Myanmar and Hamas (18:30). They further reflect on the military’s relationship with shaping natio...
2025-09-0851 minRough DraftsEpisode 13: Parasocial Relationships (w/Dimo O.)What is a parasocial relationship, and have you ever been in one? In this episode, Luke and Maurice invite Dimo back to the pod to define and share stories about their primary social relationships (with references to One Direction, Frank Ocean, Bob Dylan and Tyler the Creator). They break down the historical evolution of parasocial relationships–mediated by different medium forms such as radio, television, and social media–as well as the various types of parasocial relationships, including fictophilia (26:00). The group also discusses the impact of parasocial relationships in the political sphere, including its impact on Zohran Mamdani’s primar...
2025-08-151h 02Rough DraftsEpisode 12: Major Topics (w/ Major Eason)Major Eason is a PhD student at Harvard University in the Department of Sociology who studies environmental racism and environmental justice. In a wide-ranging conversation with L+M, Major addresses attacks on DEI, the relationship between race, sport and childhood (17:00), and American car culture (31:00). They also discuss the phenomenon of Dr. Umar (42:50), Black Lives Matter Global (48:50), and grifting/black misleadership more broadly. They return to themes of narrative and perception in social movements, as well as the ritual/drama of modern political theater.
Elijah Anderson, A Place on the Corner (1978):
https://press.uchicago.ed...
2025-08-081h 15Rough DraftsEpisode 11: Great Expectations by Vinson CunninghamIn this episode, Luke and Maurice sit with Vinson Cunningham’s novel, Great Expectations (2024). The novel follows the campaign of a historic presidential campaign narrated by a young Black man who works on the campaign. The hosts reflect on their own memories of the campaign, with Maurice reflecting on having to “act” as Obama for a school performance, and Luke sharing his own school reminiscences. They put Cunningham’s text in conversation with Alexander Chee’s How to Write an Autobiographical Novel, and a documentary of the Obama campaign. Ultimately, they wonder about the impact of the campaign on contempora...
2025-07-1153 minRough DraftsEpisode 10: Lavender Boy (w/ Vernon Jordan III)In this episode, we interview Vernon Jordan III, a Philly born and bred writer, filmmaker and poet. For this episode, we read Vernon’s feature film script “Lavender Boy” which is currently in development as their feature film debut. We discuss the project and talk about their inspirations, afro-futurism and queer cinema.
If you want more, check out Vernon's acclaimed short proof of concept film ONE MAGENTA AFTERNOON (2022), which played at 14 film festivals nationally and internationally. It's free to stream on KWELI TV.
https://www.kweli.tv/watch/kweli/one-magenta-afternoon
2025-06-301h 13Rough DraftsEpisode 9: Real Rap (w/ ZekeUltra)In a conversation recorded after Valentine’s Day, ZekeUltra joins Rough Drafts for a conversation about music, political formation, and intellectual trajectories.
Zeke is a musician based in Dover, Delaware. A friend of Luke’s, the two reminisce on how they met and shows performed together over the years. During the conversation Zeke reflects on his perseverance in his music journey. He talks about the influence of SoundCloud, “abstract rap” -think Earl Sweatshirt— early Chicago drill (Chief Keef’s Sosa) as well as figures such as Fela Kuti on his music. Rastafarianism and Pan-Africanism also informs the music Zeke cr...
2025-05-121h 06Rough DraftsEpisode 8: What is a Martial Art?What constitutes a martial art? In this episode recorded in Nov. 2024, L and M work out their respective understandings of what a martial art is; they swap stories about their early experiences with martial arts, thinking about visual representations (in television, movies, anime, etc.) or from personal experience. They draw on historical figures such as Jack Johnson, and think with the legacies of Jet Li and Bruce Lee on Black culture.
Notes and Sources:
Luke mentions a boxer from Rockford, his name is Angel Martinez.
Fighting In the Age of...
2025-04-2546 minRough DraftsEpisode 7: Movement Journalism (w/ Dimo O.)What would it look like if there was a civil war conflict, and how would journalists cover it in the United States? In a conversation recorded November 1, 2024 L and M invite their friend Dimo Ortiz to the podcast to reflect on the film ‘Civil War’ which portrays the experiences of journalists covering a domestic conflict in the mainland United States. In a wide-ranging conversation, they reflect their respective relationships with journalism and how journalism influences their perception of the political/social moment.
In particular, they sit with the tension between institutions that have captured the mains...
2025-03-081h 22Rough DraftsEpisode 6: New Year's Eve Special 2024In a conversation recorded on New Years Eve 2024, L and M reflect on artistic and cultural highlights of the year, their respective “ins” and “outs” for 2025, and forecast what the year/second half of the 2020s will hold.
2025-01-281h 02Rough DraftsEpisode 5: Hope and Nihilism in These Trying TimesEpisode 5: Hope and Nihilism (Jan. 20)
L and M ask: what roles do hope and/or nihilism play in shaping political culture. In a meditative discussion held shortly after the US 2024 General Election, they reflect on how social movements and artistic expression hold potential to counter the isolation/alienation/exhaustion of the season ahead.
Tressie Cottom, Daily Show https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nno64FGj8d0
WEB DuBois, Black Reconstruction in America (1935) https://cominsitu.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/w-e-b-du-bois-black-reconstruction-an-essay-toward-a-history-of-the-part-which-black-folk-played-in-the-attempt-to-reconstruct-democracy-2.pdf
Jiirgen Habermas, The Structural Transformation of the Publ...
2025-01-2449 minRough DraftsEpisode 4: Amtrak Rail RenaissanceHow has Amtrak shaped American transit historically and in the contemporary period? L and M share their experiences riding the rail; they reflect on trips they’ve taken up and down the coast, and cross country. They swap stories about folks they’ve met, and look at the local and national impact of the Biden Infrastructure bill on Amtrak.
Sources:
“All Aboard Obama Express”, CBS News, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2GRwvk8EmI
Amtrak Fiscal year 2023 (https://www.amtrak.com/content/dam/projects/dotcom/english/public/documents/corporate/nationalfactsheets/Amtrak-Company...
2024-12-2749 minRough DraftsEpisode 3: Black BourgeoisieWhat is the state of the Black Bourgeoisie? And who even is the Black Bourgeoisie? L gives M a preliminary entrance exam to see if he can make it (he fails). They reflect on common misconceptions of the Black bourgeoisie, with particular attention to the distinctions between “class” and “status”, and “wealth versus “income.” They swap examples from family and their dating lives, and pose questions about the future vitality of the Black bourgeoisie in relation to politics and literature.
Sources:
Ralph Ellison, Invisible Man
Margo Jefferson, Negroland
Franklin Frazier, Black...
2024-11-2252 minRough DraftsEpisode 2: Is This Jazz (w/ Seth T.)What is the state of jazz in contemporary American culture? Maurice and Luke reconnect with their friend Seth, an independent jazz scholar and musician who shares his perspective cultivated by his reading and practice. Seth gives a historical overview of how the genre evolved through some of its most impactful contributors. In addition, he provides commentary on the relationship between jazz and white spectatorship and imitators (Jack Harlow maybe catches some strays).
Seth’s reflections urge us to think about the refined exploitation in the music industry and in black cultural expression more broadly.
2024-11-081h 04Rough DraftsEpisode 0: A Rough Draft of Rough Drafts (Explicit)Maurice and Luke, old friends from college, reconnected after their respective odysseys of the early 2020s, through their work at a bookstore. They decided to finally start that podcast they always talked about. They prepared three questions each for this episode to (re)introduce themselves to listeners and give a personal meditation on what Rough Drafts is | can | and could be!
2024-10-2221 minRough DraftsEpisode 1: State of American Masculinity in the 21st Century (Explicit)The podcasts’ Founding Fathers started with the questions: what does it mean to be a man in the 21st century American context? And, how are these different types of masculinities being formed?
Perhaps apropos, they started with bell hooks. They reflect on the legacies of brothers, friends, and formative men in their lives. Critiques were had of Andrew Tate, Fresh and Fit, Kevin Samuels, and the (Black) Manosphere.
Sources:
Fast Facts: Title IX NCES: https://nces.ed.gov/fastfacts/display.asp?id=93
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2024/09/24/key-facts-about-public-school-teachers-in-the-u-s/
Un...
2024-10-1849 min